EU Red Tape Bonfire

[RoadieRoger]

Jacob Rees Mogg is looking for EU Regulations to be binned and asking for suggestions . Firstly I suggested that Creosote should be available for Individuals to purchase in small quantities, as Water Based Preservatives are hopeless at protecting Fences and Sheds . My other suggestion involved Electric Bikes , Firstly re-introduce the throttle and then increase the Motor Assisted speed from 14.6 to 20 mph . These actions would help Riders combat Wind , Slopes and keeping up with Traffic in 20 mph Zones .
To suggest any topics Email your suggestions to :- jacob.reesmog.mp@parliament.uk

 

[cyclebuddy]

I agree 100% on the Creosote. As for the 20mph/throttle ruling on e-bikes, one of my three e-bikes is already prepared in anticipation off that change!

 

[RoadieRoger]

I agree 100% on the Creosote. As for the 20mph/throttle ruling on e-bikes, one of my three e-bikes is already prepared in anticipation off that change!

My 11 year old Batribike Folder was from before the EU Rules were altered . It came with a throttle and a 200 watt front wheel motor . It has the walk assist 6 km/hr throttle position which I use on really steep hills . I never use the full throttle on this one as the power is so weak and I find it better to use full assist and pedals for `fast`getaways . My 28 in. wheeled Dapu mid-drive motor Pro Rider `Flare`came with neither throttle or walk assist . Steep hills are tackled in the lowest gear , full assist and pedals . Care has to be taken in confined spaces and careless assist selection, as this Flare will climb walls with it`s sudden take-off .
My Fat Tyre Lanarkshire Ebikes machine came with full throttle as standard and a walk assist position . The rear motor is 250 watt and I only use the throttle to start in traffic for a very fast getaway and do not cruise with the throttle . I regularly ride the two larger wheeled bikes on 35 mile routes and at 83 am sure that I wouldn`t be doing this on an ordinary bike .
I feel that my experience with these 3 Ebikes with their different motor positions and types will enable me to give sound advice to Jacob Rees Mogg when he asks for it, unless Flecc gets in first !

 

[matthewslack]

Jacob Rees Mogg is looking for EU Regulations to be binned and asking for suggestions . Firstly I suggested that Creosote should be available for Individuals to purchase in small quantities, as Water Based Preservatives are hopeless at protecting Fences and Sheds . My other suggestion involved Electric Bikes , Firstly re-introduce the throttle and then increase the Motor Assisted speed from 14.6 to 20 mph . These actions would help Riders combat Wind , Slopes and keeping up with Traffic in 20 mph Zones .
To suggest any topics Email your suggestions to :- jacob.reesmog.mp@parliament.uk

I would rather be dealing with a more rational individual.

Top of my ebike wishlist would be sorting out the contradictions in the speed pedelec class, in particular the availability of a specific class of insurance at reasonable cost.

 

[flecc]

My other suggestion involved Electric Bikes , Firstly re-introduce the throttle and then increase the Motor Assisted speed from 14.6 to 20 mph . These actions would help Riders combat Wind , Slopes and keeping up with Traffic in 20 mph Zones .

I presume your 14.6 mph is a typo, it is of course 15.6 mph assist speed.

Otherwise I'm afraid I have to disagree:

1) A higher assist speed will not help with wind or slopes. Only more power can do that. This is why the S Class high speed e-bikes failed at first, limited to only 250 watts. It only became successful when the power limit for them was raised to 500 watts, making 350 watts or more available.

2) The DfT will simply inform Jacob Rees Mogg that a 20 mph assist is already available on pedelecs, indeed 28 mph is the limit. Of course that does mean registration with all that entails. They will also inform him that this restriction cannot be changed without changing the entire chain of motorcycle legal regulations which at present prevent the change.

Since they are to deal with the fact that motorcyclists make up less than one per cent of traffic each year and yet they accounted for circa 20 per cent of road deaths each year, that is never going to happen.

N.B. In 2019, 108 motorcycle riders were killed per billion miles travelled, compared to just two car drivers, 29 cyclists and 35 pedestrians.

Suggestion:

It would have been best to consult in here before making your representation. That's because it would have been better to ask for an anomalous rule for the S class to be permitted here as it is in Germany, The Netherlands and Denmark. Precedent carries more weight.

That would mean the S class with up to 28 mph and assisted with up to 500 watts in addition to the current pedelecs, making everyone happy. That form of S class has this minimal bureaucracy:

Registration free with a mini number plate.

Compulsory third party L1e-B moped insurance which is cheap.

Compulsory cycle helmet wearing.

The DfT have already turned this down previously, but that was without any political weight behind the suggestion, only the trade asking.
.

 

[RoadieRoger]

I presume your 14.6 mph is a typo, it is of course 15.6 mph assist speed.

Otherwise I'm afraid I have to disagree:

1) A higher assist speed will not help with wind or slopes. Only more power can do that. This is why the S Class high speed e-bikes failed at first, limited to only 250 watts. It only became successful when the power limit for them was raised to 500 watts, making 350 watts or more available.

2) The DfT will simply inform Jacob Rees Mogg that a 20 mph assist is already available on pedelecs, indeed 28 mph is the limit. Of course that does mean registration with all that entails. They will also inform him that this restriction cannot be changed without changing the entire chain of motorcycle legal regulations which at present prevent the change.

Since they are to deal with the fact that motorcyclists make up less than one per cent of traffic each year and yet they accounted for circa 20 per cent of road deaths each year, that is never going to happen.

N.B. In 2019, 108 motorcycle riders were killed per billion miles travelled, compared to just two car drivers, 29 cyclists and 35 pedestrians.

Suggestion:

It would have been best to consult in here before making your representation. That's because it would have been better to ask for an anomalous rule for the S class to be permitted here as it is in Germany, The Netherlands and Denmark. Precedent carries more weight.

That would mean the S class with up to 28 mph and assisted with up to 500 watts in addition to the current pedelecs, making everyone happy. That form of S class has this minimal bureaucracy:

Registration free with a mini number plate.

Compulsory third party L1e-B moped insurance which is cheap.

Compulsory cycle helmet wearing.

The DfT have already turned this down previously, but that was without any political weight behind the suggestion, only the trade asking.
.

Flecc I would be highly delighted if two of my machines made the legal powered speed , they start losing power before 14 mph . I supposed the Manufacturers are nervous of turning out machines capable of exceeding 15. 6 mph and upsetting the Regulators . I am only interested in the lower powered Ebikes , if I want to go fast and scare myself I have a a 1982 Suzuki X7 to do that .
It was not my intension to represent any Organisation in putting forward suggestions , they are just that and no doubt will embrace many topics from a multitude of People if they respond .
Despite

 

[I893469365902345609348566]

N.B. In 2019, 108 motorcycle riders were killed per billion miles travelled, compared to just two car drivers, 29 cyclists and 35 pedestrians.

Cyclists almost 15 times more likely to die on the roads, than drivers? Do you happen to have a source or link with more information? ( No worries if it's a hassle to dig out). It would be good if stats broke down the "Cyclist" grouping into cyclists and pedelecers.

 

[flecc]

Flecc I would be highly delighted if two of my machines made the legal powered speed , they start losing power before 14 mph . I supposed the Manufacturers are nervous of turning out machines capable of exceeding 15. 6 mph and upsetting the Regulators .

It's not their nervousness, it's the law. Here's the exemption from being motor vehicles that we enjoy, note the words "progressively reduced":

Pedal cycles with pedal assistance which are equipped with an auxiliary electric motor having a maximum continuous rated power of less than or equal to 250 W, where the output of the motor is cut off when the cyclist stops pedalling and is otherwise progressively reduced and finally cut off before the vehicle speed reaches 25 km/h.

Some makers ignore it, a very few even take advantage of the 10% speed tolerance to have the cut off at 17 mph.

Coversely the very law abiding Japanese often start the power/speed cut off phase down very early.
.

 

[flecc]

Cyclists almost 15 times more likely to die on the roads, than drivers? Do you happen to have a source or link with more information? ( No worries if it's a hassle to dig out)

I didn't keep the link but its one of the popular ones on accident stats. No doubt those figures were derived from the overall accident stats and cycling and pedestrian mileages are bound to be estimates rather than actual. So take those with a pinch of salt, only the car and motorcycle comparison is valid (and horrific).
.

 

[I893469365902345609348566]

I didn't keep the link but its one of the popular ones on accident stats. No doubt those figures were derived from the overall accident stats and cycling and pedestrian mileages are bound to be estimates rather than actual. So take those with a pinch of salt, only the car and motorcycle comparison is valid (and horrific).
.

My sister is a nurse, she says in hospital they refer to motorbike accident riders "Donors". I look forward to seeing stats from 2020, when more cyclists, pedelecers and scooterists appeared on roads and pavements. It'd be wonderful if cylists and pedelecers weren't lumped together.

 

[soundwave]

when i crashed my bike and had to have staples installed in my elbow i said it was a ebike and they put down moped crash pmsl.

A moped is considered to be a two-wheeled vehicle that has pedals, a motor which is less than 50 cc (3.1 cu in) and a top speed of 30 km/h (19 mph).

 

[tonyw]

I think your bike is an untaxed/insured electric motorcycle, no? So moped is probably nearer the mark than bicycle.