Help with electrics please

[eddieo]

Can someone remind us and give a description of what "kit" is being discussed here? and has no one else bought one?

 

[Fecn]

Now I even own my own ammeter! Or should that be voltmeter? Damn!

The word you are after is multimeter

 

[flecc]

Can someone remind us and give a description of what "kit" is being discussed here? and has no one else bought one?

It's the Sparticle, which I understand from Frank is a rebadged Tongxin Nano motor. This one is the eight wire Hall sensor version, not the common three wire one used on the Nano Brompton and the like.
.

 

[eddieo]

It's the Sparticle, which I understand from Frank is a rebadged Tongxin Nano motor. This one is the eight wire Hall sensor version, not the common three wire one used on the Nano Brompton and the like.
.

Thanks Flecc.....it was a bit of an odd thread without the subject..........

 

[AndyOfTheSouth]

Hi Eddie

The 24v conversion kit is described with stunning linguistic felicity by The Electric Transport Shop as a '24v conversion kit.' It was indeed identified to me in the shop as a Sparticle, though they generally only use that name for the Brompton version. To complicate matters a little, I actually ordered the high torque version, which I assume I received, but who knows?

On whether it is the same as the nano-Brompton, I leave it for others to give the definitive answer, but I note that it looks different, at least superficially, from the one in the nano-Brompton website. It may also be heavier, though I am not sure.

Earlier in the thread are pictures of the kit for identification. It actually looks very similar to the 24v Alien kit, though TETS (great brand name, eh?), said that theirs was different and that it was more powerful than the Alien one. I was told that it is actually 29v. I hesitate to mention this in the light of my earlier report of my multimeter (ah, that's the word!) adventures, but I think I did confirm this when I was measuring things yesterday.

Nick - yes, I like your 'let's get stuck in' philosophy!

By the way, what is the difference between eight wire and three wire? In the tutorial spirit of this thread, please feel free to be technical...

 

[flecc]

By the way, what is the difference between eight wire and three wire? In the tutorial spirit of this thread, please feel free to be technical...

Conventional brushless Hall effect motors have Hall sensors incorporated which detect the position of the magnets in the motor by their fields and signal that to the controller so that the controller knows when to send the phased pulses of power to run the motor. To do that, the Hall sensors (Which are like small transistors) need a total of five thin wires to carry those signals. Then three thick wires are needed in addition to carry the phase pulses of power from the controller to the motor. Hence eight wires in all.

Tongxin came up with another way using only the three phase current wires. With this method, when the controller sends phase current pulses to the motor, the controller can sense feedbacks of emf (electro-magnetic-force) giving the necessary position information. This method makes for a slightly rough startup from standstill, but since pedal help should be given from a standstill, that doesn't matter.
.

 

[AndyOfTheSouth]

Thanks for this very clear account, Flecc. It inspired me to google Hall Effect motors and it led me to a chap called... Flecc! Of course...

 

[flecc]

Thanks for this very clear account, Flecc. It inspired me to google Hall Effect motors and it led me to a chap called... Flecc! Of course...

, Guilty as charged!
.

 

[Dynamic Position]

Well, bit of excitement. I measured the throttle pairs
yellow/black, 0.17
black/red, 0.41
green/red, 0.22

there was no change when the throttle was twisted

Then, I started on the other pairs
red/blue, 0.88
black, green, 0.91
black, red, 0.02
black, yellow, 0.91

at some point in this process, the motor started!!!!!
I was so excited, I stopped what I was doing and tried to connect it all up again. When I tried again, it was dead once more, except for the light.

Does this mean connection problem or controller problem?

I will go to Oxford tomorrow if I can. If you have any ideas of what is wrong, I'd still be interested and grateful.

Thanks

Andy

Andy,

I have been reading with interest the tests and results you obtained, I think in all probability the problem is within the controller. It is a pity that you did not try repeating the sequence of tests to see whether you could replicate the motor starting. Without having any diagrams etc. and assuming that you could replicate the test where the motor started, I would hazard a guess that the controller has a faulty filter?
The motor might have started because of the multimeter input impedance (DC Volts setting) bridging the fault.
There would not be much you could do other than let the retailer at Oxford or Cambridge give you an expert opinion. The chances are they will just supply you with a new controller. If they let you keep the faulty unit you could open it up to see if what is inside.