Hi guys, old man's attempt at getting fit!

[Nealh]

The batteries capacity is either in amp hrs/ Ah or watt hrs /Wh. In your case the battery is approx. max 420wh when fully charged. Depending on how keen a cyclist you are, your Wh usage will probably be 10 - 25 wh per mile. A fit keen rider can expect to use 8 - 15 Wh and a less fit or casual rider up to the higher figure.
What cells are being used in the Dillenger battery ?

 

[Nealh]

The BBS01 250W has a max out put of 540w which it will draw now and then on hills or going for it flat out with assist 9.
Being a big bloke and wanting to have a legal kit, there is a 250w 25a version available though will require a decent battery with 30Q cells.
For cells Nkon.nl is the best place to go.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

What you're missing is the amps from the cells. Laptop cells are generally not specified for high discharge rates like cells for ebikes would be. 1 amp is about as much as you can sustain from one cell, so 5 in parallel would give 5 amps, which is 30% of what you need.

 

[Bitsnpcs]

What you're missing is the amps from the cells. Laptop cells are generally not specified for high discharge rates like cells for ebikes would be. 1 amp is about as much as you can sustain from one cell, so 5 in parallel would give 5 amps, which is 30% of what you need.

Ok this is part of the equation I am missing then, when a battery is rated as 2000 mah for example how do I get the information on actual amps drawn from the sells

Is this the thing I am looking for?
3000mAh ***(30A)***

 

[DouglasXK]

Out of interest Nealth do you happen to know of a supplier that sell the generic cases? and or BMS? I did already purchase a cheap BMS from ebay that I used in my very first prototype but I am assuming these are not the best going forward?

I’ve bought several 36v BMS and all have had some problem or other, not just because the 10S5P pack had a diverse range of capacities. However one made by a Chinese Cpy ANNPOWER was very successful as is their 48v equivalent. They also sell 2a and 4a chargers - not cheap but good. They, ANNBATTERY who may not be the same but I think are, also have HaiLong battery cases including 18650 holders. They also are just about the only ones who sell pure nickel battery welding strip instead of rubbish off ebay that’s nickel plated.

I mention these people because I floundered with the ebay rubbish for a long time.

Have you tried NKON for new 18650s? The Samsung 2,500 mAhr 25R @3 euros is good value.

 

[Bitsnpcs]

I’ve bought several 36v BMS and all have had some problem or other, not just because the 10S5P pack had a diverse range of capacities. However one made by a Chinese Cpy ANNPOWER was very successful as is their 48v equivalent. They also sell 2a and 4a chargers - not cheap but good. They, ANNBATTERY who may not be the same but I think are, also have HaiLong battery cases including 18650 holders. They also are just about the only ones who sell pure nickel battery welding strip instead of rubbish off ebay that’s nickel plated.

I mention these people because I floundered with the ebay rubbish for a long time.

Have you tried NKON for new 18650s? The Samsung 2,500 mAhr 25R @3 euros is good value.

Hi thanks for this, are you talking about these companies are on ebay or aliexpress? or are they a website in their own right?

Yes I have heard some very good things about the samsung r25s but again as I am not looking to throw too much money into this (YET) then its still going to set me around 150 for the batteries so maybe in the future I will invest once I am 100% happy with my conversion.

I also noticed the lack of pure nickel strip on ebay, lots of words pure but then followed by plated lol. So for now that is what I have, again as this is my first attempt I am sure that I will go down that route should I stick with this new fad lol

 

[Nealh]

Ok this is part of the equation I am missing then, when a battery is rated as 2000 mah for example how do I get the information on actual amps drawn from the sells

Is this the thing I am looking for?
3000mAh ***(30A)***

We need a pic of the cells and the writing on them.

 

[Nealh]

As you say the detail is in the product reading.
Ali express for a lot techy bits pure nickel 99.9% is very reasonable, I paid about £10 for 200 pieces x 100mm x 8mm x 0.2mm pure.

 

[Bitsnpcs]

Ok so I have managed to charge the battery pack with the scooter charger, this is rated at 42v 2a and has protection, there is a green light when fully charged and red when charging.

I did notice that charging was VERY quick no more than an hour from the red light to the green light, I am unsure as to what the battery held originally but I would guess almost fully charged at 36v with my original 36v charger and then I have topped up with the 42v charger

After removing the battery from charge I went for a test ride and instantly feel a little more power however still shut down on me after a few minutes hard work.

By the way my c961 although advertised as 6 speed came with 4 speed, does this make any difference to the power? I mean if 0-4 4 being the highest is that equivalent to the 9 setting 0-9? They are just power banded differently 0-25% 25%-50% 50%-75% 75%-100% for example

reading of the battery after the shut off is 40Volts so unless under strain this dipped below the low voltage cutoff (34v? im unsure) then maybe it is the cells?

So now I am stuck, either I assume that the BMS is faulty in some way, however surely it wouldnt charge correctly or the battieries that were originally in the battery are also no good, I only tested the replacements so Im assuming all of this

Any idea will be greatly appreciated

 

[Nealh]

The cutting out will either be an unbalanced battery cell group or two or just poor cells in general.
As already requested a pic of the cells would help, either the original cells or the cells you replaced are just purely crap or even both and no good pulling the pack as a whole down.

The amp rating and ah rating of any cells need to be the same as the originals in the pack, If any are crashing down to the 3.4/3.5v then the other cells will be at 4v or more.
The bms is good if the pack is showing a good voltage 41.5 -42v when charged.

What you need to do is charge the pack up use it till it cuts out, then open it and jot down the 10 cell group readings with a meter via the 10 small bms balance wires. You should get 10 separate voltage readings between 3.4v and 4.2v, one or two will be very low compared to the others.

 

[DouglasXK]

Bitsnpcs
I’d buy, £20 or so, a 150 watt constant current electronic load to test the discharge capacity. Set the discharge at about 3.5amps. There are a few YouTube videos of how to use them. That will give you a decent tool to find what’s going on.
These come from Aliexpress as do the ANNPOWER equipment I mentioned before.

 

[Bitsnpcs]

The cutting out will either be an unbalanced battery cell group or two or just poor cells in general.
As already requested a pic of the cells would help, either the original cells or the cells you replaced are just purely crap or even both and no good pulling the pack as a whole down.

The amp rating and ah rating of any cells need to be the same as the originals in the pack, If any are crashing down to the 3.4/3.5v then the other cells will be at 4v or more.
The bms is good if the pack is showing a good voltage 41.5 -42v when charged.

What you need to do is charge the pack up use it till it cuts out, then open it and jot down the 10 cell group readings with a meter via the 10 small bms balance wires. You should get 10 separate voltage readings between 3.4v and 4.2v, one or two will be very low compared to the others.

Thats a great suggestion, I will definately do that to find out what the weak link is

Here is a pic of one of the original batteries

 

[Bitsnpcs]

Bitsnpcs
I’d buy, £20 or so, a 150 watt constant current electronic load to test the discharge capacity. Set the discharge at about 3.5amps. There are a few YouTube videos of how to use them. That will give you a decent tool to find what’s going on.
These come from Aliexpress as do the ANNPOWER equipment I mentioned before.

Will probably get one of these while still messing around with it waiting for delivery, can only help going forward, thanks for the suggestion, by chance do you have a link to one from ali that you have used/can recommend?

Chers

 

[Nealh]

The NK04 looks like an unbranded cheap China cell so amp rating not likely to be great.

 

[malkie0831]

Bitsnpcs
I’d buy, £20 or so, a 150 watt constant current electronic load to test the discharge capacity. Set the discharge at about 3.5amps. There are a few YouTube videos of how to use them. That will give you a decent tool to find what’s going on.
These come from Aliexpress as do the ANNPOWER equipment I mentioned before.

A cheaper alternative can be made using a string of car bulbs, use enough to get the load up to 5A or more and check the battery voltage. If the voltage sags rapidly you have your answer.

I have a BBS01 and really rate it, but it has to be fed good steady power, you are wasting your investment by using a second rate battery.

 

[Bitsnpcs]

Ok guys, I heard all I needed to about the battery cells and quality etc. so I bit the bullet and bought some Samsung 25R from NKON.NL (thanks
DouglasXK)

And WOW, all I have to say is WOW, the difference is enormous, it will now pull me up the hills on just throttle alone (testing) and pedal assist is awesome, much more responsive and I am truly really happy with it now.

I will post the project pics so far but just a couple of things I would like advice on if anyone is willing?


Pics 2 and 3

These are the magnets for the hydraulic sensors, now this was a bit of a nightmare because the brake levers didnt really have any movement that I could use for separation so I used screws and have screwed and glued in place inside a small Allen key grub there, not 100% sure what this grub screw does but cant see any harm in it?

Pics 4 and 5

Tie wraps to hold the sensor onto the brake close enough to the magnets, this was a nightmare as it seems the sensors are not well made at all, I found that one sensor had the "sensor part" at the very end of the plastic casing and the other had the "sensor part" the opposite end at the cable end of the casing, meaning I had to fit them 2 different ways! Any better suggestions for fixing? And should I return the sensors to get a matching pair so to speak?

Pic 6

WIRES! Lots of them lol! A real mess and really interested in ideas to make it look less messy and aesthetically pleasing?

Pic 7

Display, Any thoughts on this particular model of display? Any settings I should be tweaking to get the most out of the system? I have seen and read a little about "hacking" the software with a computer but I am far away from even trying this unless I am missing something huge?

So that is it thank you so much for all of your help and I look forward to many happy miles riding and losing those few pounds (stone lol) that I want!

 

[Bitsnpcs]

One last thing, this is my chain after fitting and on the lowest gear, you can see from the pic that the derailleur seems a little stressed, I am assuming this is due to the front gear being more teeth that my original, hasnt caused any issues as yet, no slipping or chain coming off etc. But does anyone think I should be adding some links in to take the stress

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Most likely the chain had a vouple of links less. It lòoks a bit on the short side, but probably OK, especially as you probably don't use first gear much.

 

[chris_n]

It's not too short.

 

[Georgew]

One last thing, this is my chain after fitting and on the lowest gear, you can see from the pic that the derailleur seems a little stressed, I am assuming this is due to the front gear being more teeth that my original, hasnt caused any issues as yet, no slipping or chain coming off etc. But does anyone think I should be adding some links in to take the stress

With the chain on the smallest rear cog I would expect the pulley cage to be in a vertical position as a way of checking for correct chain length.