In In Holland One out of Eight Bikes Is Electric

[Barry Heaven]

In Holland One out of Eight Bikes Is Electric

Interesting article: Bike Europe - News: In Holland One out of Eight Bikes Is Electric

 

[rooel]

Would it not be more accurate to say "one in eight bikes presently and recently sold in Holland is an electric bike"? That does not mean that one in eight of all currently usable Dutch bikes are electric.

 

[Barry Heaven]

Would it not be more accurate to say "one in eight bikes presently and recently sold in Holland is an electric bike"? That does not mean that one in eight of all currently usable Dutch bikes are electric.

I think that's right.

 

[allen-uk]

Why Holland?

I mean why is Holland so high up the European league in terms of e-bikes anyway? I know because of the flattish terrain they have a higher-than-usual bike usage, but doesn't the same terrain factor make them LESS likely to want power assistance?

Germany I can understand; more hills, bigger Germans, etc.

Allen.

 

[flecc]

Being very flat over large areas the headwinds across the polders are ferocious Allen. That's why they also like the low fully streamlined velomobiles, no problem getting their weight up the non-existent hills but high speeds cutting through the air on the flat.

*Velomobile = low recumbent trike with full cowlings.
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[wurly]

Headwinds. They have a similar climate to us. Flat terrain can also mean no obstructions. The wind is so strong it feels like you are going backwards on occasions. Also their lifestyle incorporates cycling far more than us, ebikes just make cycling easier for those who already cycle.
I have friends who live there who tell me this.

Lol i missed your post Flecc (we agree though)

 

[flecc]

Lol i missed your post Flecc (we agree though)

Nothing more reassuring to a questioner than a second opinion that agrees.
.

 

[HittheroadJ]

Why Holland?

I agree with the points about a. strong winds and b. lifestyle incorporates cycling more.

The lifestyle/culture of cycling might be the most influential. If the weather turns good in spring you can see tens of thousands of cyclists cycling recreationally outside of the towns.
Some own observation and stories from Dutch friends.
1. A Dutch Secondary or Grammar school can have a large percentage of pupils cycling in from the same city and outskirts, but also from surrounding villages (up to 5 miles is not too out of the ordinary).
2. Many Dutch school-kids will cycle to school, friends-visits, sports, dancing, and other pastimes. I recently read that the average family with teenage kids drives 2100 miles a year for the kids runs.
3. Many university students will have the bicycle as their main form of transport. I'm ot sure about average mileages etc. but someone who leaves university will have done a fair bit of cycling up to that point in his / her life.
4. I know a photographer who lives in Amsterdam and who recently bought one eBakfiets (carrier bike) aside from his car. Most of his shoots are in Amsterdam and he said he often got stuck in traffic in a car and averaged 4 to 8 parking tickets a month to be on time (at 65 to 130 euro each). With the electric bakfiets he was usually on time and could carry all his stuff. Point is: Many inner cities are hardly accessible by car, the nice historic centres with canals have many small streets that can easily be blocked by cars that are parked the wrong way, utility vehicles etc.. Parking is often even harder.
5. I had a Dutch friend visiting and I asked him after a couple of days what he thought were the differences between the cyclists here and in the Netherlands (aside from there being less of them). He answered: a. There are mainly mountainbike style bikes here and in Holland there are more bikes for riding on roads, less rolling resistance. b. Most cyclists here have no mudguards and you can see marks of muddy water on their backs and backpacks, in Dutch cities we always say "the one riding without mudguards is the one trying to wipe the dog-doody out of his neck and hair". Mudguards are the norm in the Netherlands. I spoke to him recently. He himself has recently bought an ebike for his daily 10 mile commute (5 in 5 out) which he did for years without electronic support. He works on several innercity locations and has to go to meetings.. He said that commuting on the bike was brilliant, but he was concerned about the bike getting stolen with him moving around town a lot. He said he was considering getting a cheap second-hand bike for getting around the city centre.


I am not sure to what extent Dutch people will be getting electric bikes, but with the roads and cities cluttering up it may be a more and more realistic alternative for many.

Just my 2c.

btw. these 2 pdf's have much info on numbers of bikes, kilometres ridden and so on and so forth.
Cycling in the Netherlands - Fietsberaad

Facts about cycling in the Netherlands - Fietsberaad

 

[lemmy]

Why Holland?

I mean why is Holland so high up the European league in terms of e-bikes anyway?

Another factor, I think, is that the Dutch see bicycles as a practical form of day to day transport. Hence so many fewer mountain bikes, trendy 'fixies' and other style statements and the preponderance of upright and sedate (to English eyes) 'traditional' bikes.

Viewed like this, an electric bike all the advantages of a normal bike plus the advantage that it requires less effort. If all you want to do is transport yourself from one place to another that is quite a bonus.

 

[dicklaiwisper]

6 of 10 bikes in shanghai are electric. here is very flat too. people like ebike very much. I believe within two years 3 of 10 will be coming true in uk .

 

[Alex728]

the same wind exists the other side of the North Sea

I saw one of those recumbents being watched by the Politie on youtube, in a show called Blik op de Weg (their version of Police! Camera! Action!) something like 65-70 km/h

the dude didn't get in big trouble though, I don't think the cops actually stopped him (my Dutch is only very basic at the moment) as he wasn't on a busy path endangering others but they handed over the tape to the TV company and the media traced him / "encouraged" him to come forward.

The next week him and the traffic cop had a civilised discussion on the telly about whether this was a good idea on the bike path that is for everyone including slower riders - the consensus was that he should have been on the road at that speed (there is apparently a limit on bike paths of 25-30km/h) and the cop agreed that it was an impressive feat.

I think it is attitudes like this why the roads as a whole are safer places in NL..

 

[flecc]

the same wind exists the other side of the North Sea

But as you've frequently pointed out, there are some hills at various points in East Anglia plus more frequent occurrences of trees, these breaking up and slowing the winds. I agree though that in the flattest agricultural zones the winds can be very strong, but the vast flat areas of the Netherlands are uniquely favourable to sustaining stable very high wind speeds at ground level.
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[simonbarnett]

But as you've frequently pointed out, there some hills at various points in East Anglia plus more frequent occurrences of trees, these breaking up and slowing the winds. I agree though that in the flattest agricultural zones the winds can be very strong, but the vast flat areas of the Netherlands are uniquely favourable to sustaining stable very high wind speeds at ground level.
.

Hence the windmills

 

[HittheroadJ]

Hi Alex728.

You are largely right, but some details are wrong.

1. "Blik op de weg" is loosely tanslated (keep your) "Eyes on the road". It is more like "fifth gear" and a certain BBC program. They were actually filming something else when they saw this "Quest" and filmed it. They then put the clip in their show to see who it was and the driver contacted them. YouTube - Blik op de Weg met Quest

2. The "Quest" seen here is achieving these speeds at an area in the east of the Netherlands (Apeldoorn, fairly close to Germany). This area actually has trees and hence lower windspeeds than the west. He does claim as an advantage of the quest that his travel time is about the same throughout the year wind or rain slow him down less. He used to ride a motorbike but he switched to cycling.

3. There is no legal speedlimit for bikes. The police may stop him to check whethr he is, perhaps, motorised. But if he uses manpower only he can go as fats as he can (he cruises at 45 KmH and has short bursts of up to 70 KmH).

4. They do discuss whether he has the right to drive on the road rather than the bicycle path. According to Dutch law bicycles are allowed on the road if they are wider than 75 cm.

My observation: The population-density in th east is much lower than in the west. If he lived in Amsterdam he would have to slow down considerably to avoid collisions.

 

[Barry Heaven]

Cycling in the Netherlands - Fietsberaad

Depressing statistics in this. Britain has the lowest rate of bike use for share of journeys at 2%, but has one of the highest death rates (6 deaths per 100 million kilometres) and one of the lowest for kilometres cycled per person per day. Needless to say, Holland is the opposite.

 

[Alex728]

My observation: The population-density in th east is much lower than in the west. If he lived in Amsterdam he would have to slow down considerably to avoid collisions.

indeed, I've seen videos of rush hour in some parts of the Netherlands with all the bicycles! I have however seen comments by Dutch folk that cops do occasionally stop lycras on the bike paths, but only to give warnings to train in more appropriate areas (which seems fair enough IMO)

Although our roads are of course far worse in design, I have been spending a fair bit of time on 112nederland.nl (exactly what you think it would be ) and injury/fatal RTC's involving cyclists are far from uncommon, as well as collisions with motor vehicles cyclists crash into one another!

Of course out of a far larger proportion of cyclists it means its relatively safer, but the Dutch do still have the same traffic issues we do in some areas especially at junctions and with the pace of life increasing and community spirit declining even there, and the enviable cycling infrastructure of todays Netherlands is a recent development which occured only in my lifetime (I am in my 30s..)

Todays NL elections have shown a shift rightwards - not as much to extremist parties as the sensationalist media have made out, but more towards centre right parties more hostile to public sector spending. I wonder what effect it will have on the cycling culture, given that it appears much of this was supported by the public sector? Of course facilities already present won't disappear, but what about future projects?

 

[Hermit]

Hence the windmills

When I was young, I was told they were actually propellers to stop Holland from sinking

 

[dan]

I spoke to a bike dealer in Holland recently, he said, in Holland like all other countries the population is getting older, and lots of older people want to keep cycling, so are starting to buy electric bikes. He estimated that 70% of the electric bikes he sold were to over 50's. and almost all of them were already cyclists.

In the UK most people who purchase electric bikes have not recently been cyclists.

He also said that sales over last couple of years have increased rapidly as more and more affordable (< 1,000 Euros) electric bikes have come onto the market.

 

[Jim Taverner]

When my family were growing up, we did 2 tours one year after the other.
The first was western Ireland where many areas are pretty hilly and hard work.
The following year we toured Holland (3 bikes and a tandem). Using the highly unscientific test of moan volume from kids, I can say that they found the seemingly continuous head winds harder work than the hills of Ireland.
Cheers,
Jim
On a separate subject, I have now had my electrified Dahon Vitesse from C H Whites of Malmesbury for a month and I love it. It's my first electric bike and so far it ticks all the boxes.

 

[HittheroadJ]

When I was young, I was told they were actually propellers to stop Holland from sinking

Actually, To stop Holland from flooding would be accurate.

One of the aspects of living below sea-level is that you have to keep pumping. Since you are below sea-level there will be no rivers to remove excess rain water and there will be a slow flow of sea-water seeping through, and under the dykes. If you stop pumping for a while your feet will start getting decidedly wet.

Count on some friendly neighbours to accelerate a demo of what will happen if you stop pumping Inundation of the Wieringermeer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia 3.75 meters of salt water on top of your farmland will leave quite a bit of salty mud where your spuds used to grow. Oops the Wieringermeer was inundated with fresh water and was habitable before the end of 1945.

One brilliant aspect of the dykes and dunes is that they allow for excellent bicycle paths.