more help on climbing with a Giant Twist/Lite

[flecc]

The discharge advice isn't actually contradictory Peter, though it looks that way. The initial full discharges and recharges are to condition the cells to their full capacity, and the small additional aging by doing that is part of the battery spec.

Thereafter if the battery is always or frequently fully discharged it's life will be shorter than one that's charged after part usages.

I'm lucky in having many trips of between 3 and 6 miles so charging in between is likely to give long life. On the other hand, the excessive drain the Torq imposes in my hilly area tends to undo the good and damage the batteries through them reaching cut-off all too easily.

Those in much less hilly areas generally don't experience any of the problems we suffer, especially the younger fitter riders, and are often puzzled by the subject even arising.
.

 

[Mike Robinson]

The discharge advice isn't actually contradictory Peter, though it looks that way

then it's very badly written! Is it that hard for a supplier to tell a user how to look after a battery?

Seeing as it's a very common question would it be worth extracting some readable advice for each type of battery and having it as a "sticky" message on this group. It might also be useful if everyone who offers advice on battery management states what type of battery they are talking about.

I still have no real clue with my battery (Nimh). It's stated that a full discharge can be good for it and that it is capable of 500 recharges. I therefor figured I should ride the bike for as much as I can between recharges and avoid any topping up after short little rides. Some simple advice would be helpful.

Mike

 

[flecc]

then it's very badly written! Is it that hard for a supplier to tell a user how to look after a battery?

Seeing as it's a very common question would it be worth extracting some readable advice for each type of battery and having it as a "sticky" message on this group. It might also be useful if everyone who offers advice on battery management states what type of battery they are talking about.

I still have no real clue with my battery (Nimh). It's stated that a full discharge can be good for it and that it is capable of 500 recharges. I therefor figured I should ride the bike for as much as I can between recharges and avoid any topping up after short little rides. Some simple advice would be helpful.

Mike

I've given the advice you ask for many times in this forum Mike, and it's widely available elsewhere. In a nutshell for Nimh:

Initially fully discharge and recharge 3 or 4 times.

Thereafter use as you wish for short or long intervals between charges, but every so often, around once every 5 to 15 charges, it's not critical, run it to a full discharge or close to that. If your charger conveniently has a discharge function you can use that to complete a full discharge.

The reason for doing that is the way in which NiMh still has a tendency to have a memory effect, where it can get reluctant to issue power below the level it was previously charged from. By doing a full discharge from time to time, the chemical "memory" doesn't develop over time.

Hope that clears it up for you.

The above ONLY applies to NiMh, Li-ion is very different. That too needs the initial conditioning full discharges, but thereafter should be discharged as little as possible between charges for the longest life. I've published this twice in different threads in the last day alone, and the general battery position has long been in an article of mine within this site.

 

[Mike Robinson]

I've given the advice you ask for many times in this forum ...
I've published this twice in different threads in the last day alone ...

Then why not make it a sticky thread on the front page of the forum? There must be loads of people with memories as bad as mine

Mike

 

[ABU]

giant lite1.0

I have been reading all this advice on batteries with great interest because I am an 'electric virgin' soon to be deflowered but by which machine?
I need some advice.
Advanced in years so that I do not need to work for the NHS anymore, I have in that institution damaged my back and knees to such extend that, combined with the ageing of lungs, my Dutch hart does not wish to give up cycling for pleasure. So, I need to be able to tackle gentle hills and the odd steeper one. The Giant TWIST 1.0 appeals because of it's capability of longer distance (I have a fit husband) and has good reviews on Dutch websites and it looks like a normal bike. It has also been suggested I look at the Powacycle Windsor. (both of which available in Edinburgh, my nearest dealer in electric bikes and so for servicing).
Could anyone give some input to help me along in my choice? After all it is a fair amount to spend and would like to make the right choice.

 

[JohnInStockie]

Hi ABU

What are your key requirements, range, high capability (%) that type of thing? This forum, and subscribing to A to B magazine helped me choose. I have the old version of the Giant Twist which only has 1 battery but chain drive, meaning I get about 1 hour cycling out if it before recharge time, but its great on hills.

A to B had a review of the Twist 1.0 in their Feb issue I think.

Also generally with HUB drives, smaller wheels = better hill climbing.

John

 

[flecc]

Then why not make it a sticky thread on the front page of the forum? There must be loads of people with memories as bad as mine

Mike

That's for Russ to decide Mike, I can't do that. Russ has put my battery article given the essence of the usage information in the articles section accessed from the home page.
.

 

[flecc]

Hi ABU

The Twist 1.0 and the Powacycle Windsor are in very different price brackets of course, and somewhat different in the motor power. The latter doesn't make too much difference to the hill climbing though. I wouldn't regard either as top class climbers, but both will handle reasonable hills. Typically a 1 in 10 (10%) shouldn't trouble you, but if you have to climb very much steeper, you may need to consider more powerful models as well.

The choice between the Twist 1.0 and the Powacycle comes mainly down to quality and range, with the Giant typically having an excellent finish which will last for years. On range, the Powacycle is good and can typically give around 22/25 miles on the NiMh battery model, 27/30 miles on the Lithium battery model, while the Twist has an exceptional range from it's twin batteries, typically about 40 miles. The downside of that is the replacement Twist batteries are £600 currently and could be rather higher when replacement time comes. The Powacycle NiMh battery is just £99 and the Lithium battery just £199, something to consider seriously.

If you have any very steep hills, I'd advise that you look at the eZee bike range from 50cycles, the Sprint being a step through like the Windsor but very powerful and with a similar range. It sits in the middle for price at £995.
.

 

[ABU]

Thank you for that and certainly the cost of replacement batteries ar quite prohibitive...I shall follow up your suggestion. Any more? keep em comong please....

 

[JohnInStockie]

I would recommend having a look at the Ezee Sprint, from what Ive read/heard, it does have a reasonably good range / speed / hill climbing ability.

However, as said, I dont have one of these.

John

 

[ABU]

thank you john. I must say I have not looked at this before because, as I said, the only dealer I know is one in Edinburgh and he does not sell these(I think) How critical is it to be near a service point for these bikes? You see, coming from Holland we have bike shops on every corner if anything goes wrong. However, I live here and wish to buy here.

 

[flecc]

No local dealers for the Sprint I'm afraid ABU, 50cycles only sell online. That tends to be true for the majority these days, but Giant, Powacycle and Powabyke do have local dealers in many locations, and some others are trying to set up dealer networks.

Support tends to be a very variable thing though, even with local dealers. Cycle dealers in general rarely have any electrical expertise and have to rely on the importer/manufacturer as much as you might have to when buying online.

One case I've been helping with currently is an example. An Isle of Man customer had to wait for a long time for Giant to get round to dispatching some test components to his dealer there. They've arrived now and with my assistance the fault has been identified by the customer and the necessary action taken, but you can see how the local dealer had very little to contribute in fact.

 

[JohnInStockie]

It was the same for me. I live near Manchester, but ordered my Twist from a dealer in London. Basically, I have to learn more about servicing myself, as well as being able to get the 'standard' parts of the bike serviced at a normal bike shop.

If anything went wrong with the electrics, well, I'd probably ask on this forum.

 

[ABU]

a lot to think about

Thank you all for your help.
I shall go and try the various bikes and come back with questions for the experts.
Someone told me a Gazelle E.... asyglider might be good. So much to choose from and so little knowledge