Motor or battery suddenly shuts off

Onweels

Finding my (electric) wheels
Oct 22, 2008
10
0
I have a problem.

I bought my bike new last September and with the onset of wet weather and snow I haven't ridden it more than 100 miles since I bought it, and the battery has been recharged maybe 15 times and not more than 20.

This bike has a hub motor and a 360 watt 10 amp hour Phylion battery that was manufactured in July of 2007. Last time I rode it any distance was in October. I went 15 miles and it wasn't until I'd gone 14 that I noticed any loss of power. As this ride included several large hills and I weigh about 185 lbs I was completely satisfied with the bikes performance.

The bike has sat in a dry unheated outside shed for most of the winter. I live on the West Coast of Canada and there is some humidity in the air but not enough to make things inside the shed damp. Every time the temperature went below freezing I carried the bike in the house as I didn't want to risk exposing the battery to freezing temperatures. I have never ridden the bike in weather that is not completely dry.

In February my son and his partner came for a visit. I charged up the battery and both went for a short 1 mile ride and both reported the motor suddenly cutting out. My son probably weighs the same as I do but his partner can't weigh more than 110 lbs. My son knows a lot about electronics and he thought maybe it was the emergency cut off button malfunctioning, as the motor doesn't cut out when it is pressed.

He suggested I should avoid pushing that button, which I don't really need anyway.

When there was a break in the rain and snow a while later, I went for a two mile ride which included a big hill and the bike worked fine. I thought the problem my son had must have been because he and his partner didn't know what they was doing and had pushed the emergency cut off button or something.

But today I went for a 5 mile ride on a fully charged battery and I had the bike just suddenly cut out about 5 or 6 times.

The first thing I noticed which made me feel something was wrong is after the first 1/2 mile I noticed I didn't seem to have much power.

That only lasted briefly at the top of a hill and the flat stretch afterwards. But I had never noticed a problem on that hill before. It was enough that I stopped and checked my battery light. It was down to two lights from 3, but after a big hill it will do this. After I stopped for a minute, the bike seemed to be working normally again, but about a mile later on a very slight uphill that would not normally strain the battery at all , there was a small jolt and then no motor or power or anything. I stopped and turning the throttle got no response at all. The bike seemed totally dead. I tried repeatedly and nothing worked and I was thinking I would have to turn around and go home, when I tried turning off the key that turns the bike on, and then turning the key to turn it on again. Then everything was back to working as good as new.

I continued on to town, but on route the bike cut out about five more times. Each time it was running entirely normally and suddenly there would what seemed like a little jolt and everything went dead. Each time I stopped got off the bike turned off the key which inserts into the battery, turned it back on, and was able to go again like everything was fine.

Except for the first time it cut out, I never touched the emergency cut off button and I only did that after it died the first time, trying to see if something loose in there could be jiggled back to allowing the bike to work again. So I don't think this is likely to be the problem.

As every time the problem happened it seemed to be solved by turning the bike off through the key in the battery and back on, I am guessing that is something to do with the source of the problem.

The bike has a 1 year warranty.

Any ideas on what my problem is? Is it probably the battery like I think, or the motor, or maybe the emergency cut off like my son thought?

It would be easier to get the problem fixed or the part replaced if I knew where the problem is most likely to be located.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,807
30,379
Since the on/off switch resets and gets it working again, it's almost certainly the battery cutout operating. These li-ion batteries drop voltage substantially under load and a cell protection cutout in the battery's internal management system operates at about 32 volts. Switching off and then on resets that, but doesn't cure any subsequent cutting out under load.

I suspect you may have left the battery uncharged for as much as three months at one point during the winter and these batteries don't like that and can start to fail. They should be charged regularly,at least every three months and preferably every two whether used or not. If this is the case it would be best to claim under the warranty for a new battery.

If you haven't left it three months without charging, it could be a controller cutout operating due to a bad connection from battery to bike also causing inadequate current supply and low voltage, so try cleaning the connections on battery and bike. If this is the cause, you might find replugging the battery when a cutout occurs will cure the problem. If that only resets but doesn't cure the problem, it will almost certainly be the battery.
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Onweels

Finding my (electric) wheels
Oct 22, 2008
10
0
Thanks for your sharing your expertise Flecc

I know for sure the battery was fully charged on October 21, December 7, and January 30.

I also remember I recharged it a couple times in between these times, as I thought there would be a break in the weather and I'd be able to ride into town for groceries, but there wasn't and I ended up hitchhiking or walking instead. I can't remember the exact dates as I have no record of trips I never took. But I am sure the bike never sat for more than 7 weeks without being charged.

The battery slides into place and sits on top of the controller. I put a lot of duct tape around the joint where the battery is on top of the controller as weather can change quickly here and I was afraid I might start out without a cloud in the sky and end up in a downpour.

I can't see how anything in the connection between the battery and controller would improve between the time the motor cuts out and me turning off the key and turning it back on. As soon as I did this everything worked fine with full power. So I doubt that is the problem.

Also I didn't notice it was cutting out when it was under load. When I went up some steep hills there was times where the bike and me together were barely making it, but this wasn't much different than before, and if there was a change, it may be nothing more than the cold temperature and me being out of shape. The bike didn't cut out when it was really pushed to the limit. It continued till things got easier. It cut out about 3 times a couple hundred feet after a hill, when it was no longer seeming to be strained, but 2 times it cut out on an easy almost entirely flat stretch of road.

There is a duct tape and plastic fitted cap under my bike seat and over the battery to protect it from unexpected rain, and part of that might put a bit of pressure on the key when it is in the battery. Not nearly enough to move it, but perhaps if something was only marginally connected that might affect it. Is it possible that could be the problem?

The loss of power I noticed on the first hill was very strange, but it went up 3 more major hills after this with no problem ( except suddenly cutting out a ways after 2 of them ) It wasn't much above freezing, so it may be the temperature had something to do with that brief lack of power?
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,807
30,379
In that case as it clearly doesn't seem to be the usual "under load" cutout problem, it's either a defect in the battery or the controller randomly cutting power.

Severe cold can cause loss of performance, but that cannot account for al the other problems you've had.

I suspect the battery is the problem though, given that it was manufactured in July 2007 and not sold to you as new until September 2008 when it was already 14 months old, since these batteries age whether used or not. I think you should ask the supplier to exchange the battery under warranty or at least furnish you with another one to try and see if that cures the problem.
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