Not from London

flecc

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An incredible performance from Devon's Tom Daley which in almost any past competition would have got him Gold. The amazingly high standards took that from him, but his Bronze records his achievement. At only 18 years old, he must surely get golds in future.
 

funkylyn

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Extremely impressive, so pleased and proud of him, his dad would be so proud.

Even surpassed his youtube vid......and thats saying something :D

Lynda :)
 

flecc

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And now Yorkshire returns to the fray, Hull's Luke Campbell decisively winning gold in his boxing match.

More boxing tomorrow, so more Team GB chances to come.
 

flecc

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As promised the final results of the three winning regions, London still well ahead with Yorkshire and Scotland tied. I've placed Scotland second since it has a smaller population than Yorkshire:

Team GB: 65 medals, 29 golds, 17 silver, 19 bronze

London: 25 medals, 11 gold, 14 silver and bronze

Scotland: 11 medals, 6 gold, 5 silver and bronze

Yorkshire: 11 medals, 6 gold, 5 silver and bronze

Below I've adjusted the Scotland and Yorkshire totals upwards by their ratio to London's population to give a direct performance comparison:

London: 25 medals, 11 gold, 14 silver and bronze

Scotland: 17.6 medals, 9.6 gold, 8 silver and bronze

Yorkshire: 14.7 medals, 8 gold, 6.7 silver and bronze

Of course part medals can't be won, but it's the only way to accurately compare.

When attempting to compare the totals of these three regions' athletes with the whole of Team GB's, do bear in mind that there are more athlete medals than national medals. For example, if two win in a sailing boat, Team GB gets one medal but the athletes get one each. Since the great majority of sports are solo efforts, the overall difference isn't great, but it can be in individual competitions. Notably when a British team won an 8 man rowing event, Team GB got one gold but there were 8 athlete's golds with those rowers coming from various areas.
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indalo

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Nice bit of maths there Flecc! I'm afraid I'm not big on all this nationalistic or regional fervour and jingoism. Neither can I take any real pride in being a citizen of a particular nation just because we happen to win a few events. Where and to whom I was born, in keeping with everyone else, are matters over which I had no control so it's probably worth remembering that these Olympic competitions are actually called games therefore nobody dies, (usually!) when one country fights against others.

That said, I am pleased that our little island's sportsmen shone in this competition against the finest athletes in the world. The individuals who made that possible, (at all levels) should be proud of their personal achievements.

I just spent a lovely day up town and there were folk there from every part of the world. Indeed, I think the only English voice I can say that I heard with any certainty was through a tannoy system saying, 'Mind the gap!" For all its faults, London, our capital city, is still a great place.

Indalo


ps I should really have mentioned that the Americans ought to be applauded also. I know they have a squillion people but they consistently appear close to the top of any Olympic medal table.
 
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flecc

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That's close to my attitude Indalo. I'm proud of the achievements of Team GB, and also of London for the way the Olympics have been organised and the performance of the London athletes, but I'm also delighted by the performances of other areas and nations. For me one of the highlights was the sheer delight on Tom Daley's face at the quality of the two dives from his competitors that shifted him from first to third and his demonstrative applause for them. It was an amazing bit of sportsmanship that so many professional "sportsmen" could learn much from.

I'm pleased you enjoyed your day in town. For me the multiplicity of peoples and languages is a source of considerable pleasure, infinitely better than the boring near monoculture of English society of 60 and more years ago.
 

GaRRy

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Sorry Flecc still dont see how you are working out your figures.

Take a look at this map provide by OS it certainly does not appear to back up your claim with a good spread all around and only 21ish medals in london (NOTE this map show all medal winners including all members of a team event so far more than 65 medals (eg ladies hockey, 8 man rowing etc) taking the total to nearer 100. I have also assumed by London you mean inside M25 which is not stricly speaking London.

As I said it really depends on how you define where some one is from (eg American being classed as from London!! and painting a post box gold in London for Andy Murray !!!!)

Oh and im not in any way anti any where and will freely admit the area I come from (West Midlands) along with the far north east would appear have under performed compared to other areas and that London has got more than its fair share. I really dont care where they come from was just curious as to how you working out your figures.

Just remember Lies, Damn Lies and statistics.

And finally irrrespective of where in UK they come from congratualtions to them all.
 

flecc

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I don't know what map you mean Garry, no link provided.

I haven't counted any Americans or Andy Murray Garry, only the genuine London winners as they've won an event. The BBC Online have been very helpful in this and in other respects too, as have some other online facilities. The media often like to present the athletes as people popping up from nowhere, but the reality is that they are all very well known and established in their sports and have often won major titles elsewhere. As such they have fans, websites and blogs, plus Wikipedia articles. It's from those sources each time that I've been getting my information, date of birth and where, where they have been educated, lived their lives and/or trained and I rely on that much more than a map with origins I don't know, since I'm getting the very full picture.

There are individual judgments involved of course. For example, Mo Farah was born in Somalia, but he was brought to England as a boy and reared in Hounslow, going to school at Hounslow and college at Feltham, all in London. He first met his wife-to-be while still at school and has therefore lived almost all his life in London other than his short training trips to Africa. This last year he's been in America at Portland, Oregon to train with the greatest running coach of them all, Alberto Salazar, and since he was financed by Nike for that, he was able to take his wife and child there as well. All that means to me that I'm entitled to say he is a London winner.

I haven't just looked up any of that, it's from memory of what I looked up originally, and it shows how thoroughly I've done my job and why I resent the challenge. I doubt anyone in the media has been anything like as thorough.

I put accuracy above my local interest and in the late stages was hanging on the result of the womens modern pentathlon since former world champion Mhairi Spence from Aberdeen was competing, as was Preston's Samantha Murray. If Mhairi had won it would have put Scotland in first place for golds pro rata, ahead of London. Sadly it wasn't to be, but at least Samantha won the silver. Once again I can show without referring back how thoroughly I've done my research, since I know what brought these two together into the common interest of that event. From very different areas, they both went to the University of Bath together.

There can be difficult ones to assess, but luckily the London athletes weren't among them, especially the four in my borough! For example sailing champion Ben Ainslie has differing claims made on him. He was born in Macclesfield, Cheshire, but was reared in Truro, Cornwall. In adult life he lives at Lymington, Hampshire, on the Solent for his sailing interest. From that you might think Cornwall's claim is sound, but in fact his education was in Hampshire, presumably in boarding school, so he was only in Cornwall for school holidays. That of course swings the balance strongly towards Hampshire's claim. Once again, I haven't just looked up any of that, it's what I previously researched. The media may well tell you that he's a Cornish winner, but my thorough assessment says that's wrong.

So sorry Garry, I trust the quality and depth of my own research against any other source and stand by my figures. You should have realised the extent of my research from my earlier reply, showing how of four athletes allocated by others to Dorset, only one was from there, the others from Aberdeen, Manchester and Cardiff. I didn't expect to be questioned in this manner, but I now wish I'd kept a list of every athlete so you could have checked every one of my assessments. Good though my memory is, I can't remember them all now of course.

P.S. I think you might mean this Ordnance Survey map of where the UK athletes were born Garry. If so, forget it since that's meaningless. It's where they've been predominantly reared, educated and lived their lives that matters, not the location of a maternity ward. Using birth place makes Olympics Gold medal and Tour de France winner Bradley Wiggins a Belgian! As you remarked yourself, Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics indeed!
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GaRRy

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oops
Ordnance Survey Blog » Putting our Team GB medal winners on the map

Edit.

Oh I see you have found it. (teach me to read full post first)

I am also really sorry if you feel I was questioning your integrity all I was asking was how you worked out your figures and can assure you that in no way was that my intention and I apologise for any offence I have caused.

I will always stand my corner and argue my case but I will never intentionally insult another persons ideas or beliefs (well there might be the odd exception :D)
 
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flecc

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No problem Garry, I can understand now why you've questioned the figures. I'm also pleased that this answers why you found a discrepancy, since the difference of two of the athletes of is immediately obvious. Londoners Bradley Wiggins and Mo Farah are excluded by that, and I've no doubt the remaining two discrepancies are for the same reason, since one third of all Londoners were not born in London!

Of course that map is rather silly since it reduces the medals Team GB won. Obviously the IOC wouldn't agree.
 

jazper53

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I noticed my home town from the map has one Bronze medal- for the womans hockey, so is that ONE medal or 1/16 of a medal I can feel proud of:confused:
 

flecc

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That's one whole medal Jazper. Having lived at Bournemouth for a while, I can understand how restrictive such locations can be, having only 180 degrees of land access. Brighton Marina is hardly a sport sailing venue since the nearby Solent takes all that away, so Brighton people are left with what land sporting facilities a seaside town can provide. From what little I know, that's nothing to write home about, but correct me if I'm wrong.
 

jazper53

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That's one whole medal Jazper. Having lived at Bournemouth for a while, I can understand how restrictive such locations can be, having only 180 degrees of land access. Brighton Marina is hardly a sport sailing venue since the nearby Solent takes all that away, so Brighton people are left with what land sporting facilities a seaside town can provide. From what little I know, that's nothing to write home about, but correct me if I'm wrong.
Our only claim to fame that comes to mind was 1983 when we got to the FA cup final, but lost after a replay to Man Utd, but sadly got demoted the same year.
 

flecc

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That usually happens! I remember when many years ago Bournemouth went on an FA Cup killing spree, beating three of the top league teams in a row. Everyone got very excited, only to see them collapse in following matches against very lowly teams.

These days my local team are Crystal Palace, called "The Eagles", but I think they should be called the YO-YOs, they've been up and down so many times.
 

flecc

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Update on the London results, the official figures for London wins give an extra silver won on an event that I'd missed, so London had 26 medals credited, not 25 as I'd said above. That would put London in ninth place out of 79 medal winners if it was a country. Amended results:

London: 26 medals, 11 gold, 16 silver and bronze
 
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mike killay

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This still doesn't explain why Londoners do so well.
Flecc says the facilities are not special. Climate and altitude are unlikely candidates.
Nutrition?
Or is it the kind of sports? Do other places have more fishermen, horse riders,dog breeders etc, (In other words, people's passtimes vary, Londoners go for competitive sports as do Scotland and Yorkshire but these sports are not so well supported elsewhere because the inhabitants have other things to do.)
 

flecc

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I think the reasons vary Mike. In some areas a facility creates an interest in a certain sport, for example living around the Solent and sailing, and in London we do have an advantage that the Thames has rowing clubs. An appearance of the Yorkshire Brownlee brothers on TV tonight showed how that county's countryside has nurtured their triathlete talents. They explained that they train in all that open Yorkshire country area using nature's facilities, no gyms or the like for them. I've no doubt that Yorkshire conditions breed the toughness and resilience that brings athletic success for many there. Scotland's conditions are likely to have the same effect.

Although many parts of Britain have mixed cultures, nowhere has a greater variety than London where 300 languages are spoken, teaching in my borough's schools alone is in 68 languages. That huge influx of many peoples from around the world probably brings many talents we wouldn't otherwise have, Mo Farah being one example since the English don't usually have that type of long distance running physique that certain African areas have.

Another factor is that big conurbations have a higher likelyhood of an individual's talent being spotted and nurtured. For example, Mo Farah's love was more for football despite his obvious running talent, but he had a London schoolteacher cum trainer who was having none of it. He wouldn't even allow Mo to go to his favourite team Arsenal's matches unless he completed his running training schedules. Probably less likelyhood of similar occurring in a small town or village school.

Big conurbations also engender greater competitiveness in everyday life. As I remarked earlier, London's where it buzzes and the pace of London life is undoubtedly higher than anywhere else in this nation. That fast pace of life and drive will undoubtedly affect a budding sports persons attitude and performance in training

Another factor I've spotted in my researches of backgrounds is the effect of universities, many of the team members having met and shared a new athletics interest at certain universities.

And of course it shouldn't be forgotten that the preparations for the Olympics have been in London throughout the seven years with our council tax payers surcharged to finance it. This constant awareness of the forthcoming event has probably been a motivator for all those in London with intentions of possibly qualifying to compete.

No doubt there are many other factors I haven't spotted, but certainly there are factors that strongly favour certain areas.
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mike killay

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You are probably right. Where I live,I know an awful lot of people that have not watched the olympics at all and have no idea of the results.