Panasonic motor, where to buy for DIY retrofit?

[cirrus18]

Panasonic motor, where to buy for DIY retrofit?

I have been looking on the Internet but can't find anyone selling these motors so I am tapping into the font of knowledge here to see if anyone can help me please.

 

[Mussels]

I think they require a specially designed frames so kits are not possible.

 

[daniel.weck]

As far as I know it's not a straight-forward bottom-bracket swap job. The bike frame must be specially designed to accommodate the motor unit.

By contrast, retrofitting a Sunstar S02 unit seems to be a relatively simple task, but finding one seems near impossible (note that I am deliberately ignoring the S01 model, which in my opinion is antiquated).

See here for photos of the motor on the latest Dahon Boost (browse the previous pages in the discussion thread for more info, photos, and brief comparison with Panasonic-powered folding bikes):

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/4541-dahon-folding-bike-5.html#post68521

See here for details about the motor kit itself:

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/4869-why-not-choice-speed-sensors-centrl-crank-motors.html#post61535

Cheers, Dan

 

[Lloyd]

Not an easy job. Trust me, I have tried! You would have to build the frame up around the motor mounting, and unless you can weld alu (very hard, unless you want a steel frame), have access to a framejig (geometry is revised to allow for seat-tube angle/bottom bracket axle, you would have to start from scratch) not to mention the man-hours, it would be one hell of a job. In my opinion you are better off taking an off-the-shelf frame and building a custom spec onto it. What is the end result you want to achieve?

Regards

Lloyd

 

[flecc]

The unit includes it's own bottom bracket and sits in a cradle as you see below in an upside down photo. In this instance the frame has an additional unused BB hole, but that's unusual.

The unit alone cost around 500 euros in mainland Europe recently, but you'd need to add to that the battery at about £400 UK and the control centre, so you'd be speaking of around a £1000 kit plus the high costs of modifying a frame. These parts can be ordered from any Giant bicycle agent, branches in most towns. Tick the Hybrid button for the Electric bike dealers:

Giant Dealer Locator Webpage

 

[andyh2]

£1000 is a lot, but it would be great to see one fitted to a cargo bike.

I was looking at the possibility of a Stokemonkey for my Xtracycle, but that would be £1,000 without battery and because it's power level is US standard it wouldn't be legal over here.

I've seen some have fitted Xtracycle kit to panasonic powered bikes but it would be great to see something like the Yuba Practical Cycles Cargo Bikes specialist - Yuba Mundo Version 3
or Bakfiets
Bakfiets Dutch Bikes
with built in Panasonic system.

 

[flecc]

I was looking at the possibility of a Stokemonkey for my Xtracycle, but that would be £1,000 without battery and because it's power level is US standard it wouldn't be legal over here.

There are Stokemonkey and Xtracycle setups in use in the UK Andy, despite the regulations. I remember seeing one at the New Milton show in 2007 and the owner said he'd never been questioned by any authority about it despite it's obvious speed.
.

 

[dan]

Panasonic motor, where to buy for DIY retrofit?

I have been looking on the Internet but can't find anyone selling these motors so I am tapping into the font of knowledge here to see if anyone can help me please.

I have an Giant Lafree ( which used the panasonic system) sitting in the back of my warehouse....its 3+ years old but has never been used, it is complete less the battery pack and charger, and we could probable find the battery pack ( but can't guarantee that ) but would be usless by now. You can have it for £150.00 if it is any good to you send me a private message

 

[cirrus18]

You can have it for £150.00 if it is any good to you send me a private message[/QUOTE


Dan, many thanks for your offer but it's not the type of thing I'm looking for.

Thanks guys for all your replies. It seems that the idea of fitting a Panasonic motor to a standard bike is a no-go situation. I certainly haven't got the skills for welding aluminium etc.

Most electric bikes are big and clunky things, fat soft tyres, suspension units, and heavy. Built more for comfort than fast recreational riding with occasional motor assist.

I saw this one.........click attached image file below.







To my idea it is exactly the bike that I am looking for, smart, lightweight, Panasonic motor powered, built more for cyclists than MoPed riders.
Unfortunately, they have overpriced it by fitting a titanium frame.
As my bike (aluminium frame) looks very much like this one I thought I could perhaps save money by converting it to a Panasonic set up.

It now looks like I'll have to buy something already made.
So question time, anybody know where I can buy a cheaper version of this with perhaps an aluminium frame instead of the titanium one?

 

[Mussels]

What about a Cytronex kit then? If you really want a Panasonic motor then there was sporty version shown on here a while back but I can't remember which company it was from.
Personally I think the Cytronex kit is far better suited to a fast road bike than a Panasonic unit.

 

[cirrus18]

What about a Cytronex kit then? If you really want a Panasonic motor then there was sporty version shown on here a while back but I can't remember which company it was from.
Personally I think the Cytronex kit is far better suited to a fast road bike than a Panasonic unit.

Yes, I had thought about this Cytronex bike and it is definitely light weight and what what I am after.
I just don't like the idea of a front wheel drive motor on the wet and slippery Cornish country lanes we have here. Especially if there is a hill involved as well. Very unnerving.
I have had a number of close calls just on a normal bike from these problems.

Personally, I think a motor driving through the gears to the back wheel is the way to do it.

 

[matt-derby]

front wheel drive in slippery conditions

I would assume that the motor wouldn't be in action under most circumstances where a skid/slippery slide would occur. You'd probably be breaking which on any bike would cut the power to the designated wheel.

So doesn't really matter which wheel is powered when you are breaking under no assistance. 2 wheel drive could also be a benefit in the slippery conditions.

Maybe even a higher weight over the front axle under breaking could help also?

I went for the Cytonex after trying both Kalkhoff and Emotion Panasonic bikes. It's a funny thing trying to go fast on those crank systems. Pedal faster you get less assistance! A mountain bike Panasonic system sounds very tempting however!

 

[Mussels]

Yes, I had thought about this Cytronex bike and it is definitely light weight and what what I am after.
I just don't like the idea of a front wheel drive motor on the wet and slippery Cornish country lanes we have here. Especially if there is a hill involved as well. Very unnerving.
I have had a number of close calls just on a normal bike from these problems.

Personally, I think a motor driving through the gears to the back wheel is the way to do it.

In that case there are chain drive kits around that will fit the bill but you may have to order from the States.

 

[daniel.weck]

In that case there are chain drive kits around that will fit the bill but you may have to order from the States.

The Cyclone kit or equivalent is available on eBay I think...

 

[cirrus18]

I would assume that the motor wouldn't be in action under most circumstances where a skid/slippery slide would occur.

How about a sharp bend or a sharp turn into a side road, the front wheel under power, gravel, wet leaves, mud, cow droppings, disaster!!

[QUOTE It's a funny thing trying to go fast on those crank systems. Pedal faster you get less assistance! [/QUOTE]

Wouldn't using a higher gear solve this problem? By doing so you would peddle slower, get more assistance and the bike would go faster

 

[flecc]

Cirrus, the BH Emotion upper range might suit you:

Emotion bikes at Onbike

Otherwise, the Cyclone chain drive kits come in a wide variety of powers, but the 350 watt is the best compromise for range and performance in our market. They are throttle controlled without a torque sensor and not remotely the quality of the Panasonic systems but with a bit of waterproofing they can be ok. There are two mounting types on this website, rear of BB and the superior version forward on the downtube. Click the 1 piece and 3 piece chainwheel headings for all the details:

Cyclone Taiwan
.

 

[cirrus18]

Cirrus, the BH Emotion upper range might suit you:

.

Thanks for that, very interesting and they look like what I am looking for. Pity they are not a little nearer to me so that I can try one out.
Looks like an expedition is in the offing.

 

[matt-derby]

front hub

If I was going to do a very sharp turn I probably wouldn't be pedalling, you may catch the pedal on the floor as you bank over. If you're not going fast enough to need to bank over (probably <5mph) then my current pedelec system is automatically switched off at below that speed also. If I also blipped the breaks before the corner it turns it off. In fact It's forever turning off while manoeuvring, only really there when you are all set pedalling.

The roads, paths, river and canal paths around here I have had no problem with.

I have no doubt the Panasonic crank drive is quick, just counter intuitive at first, your gear change habits have to be altered and as Flecc mentioned the dérailleur BH Emotion bikes are probably best suited offering a higher gear than the hub systems. The 'Sport' model being my favourite of those... the pedals are lower though and can catch the floor when cornering and pedalling at the same time. I've had the battery fall out on me doing exactly that.

For off road use I agree front wheel drive would be a disaster as your weight is mainly on the rear as you pull on the bars to drive down the pedals. Plus the crank drive works instantly not needing to get to the min speed to activate.

 

[matt-derby]

bike search

"Looks like an expedition is in the offing."

Try asking on here if anyone is running an Emotion nearer to you, there have been a few requests from people looking to try certain bikes and they all seem to grab everyone's attention!

Good luck!

 

[Phil the drill]

For off road use I agree front wheel drive would be a disaster as your weight is mainly on the rear as you pull on the bars to drive down the pedals. Plus the crank drive works instantly not needing to get to the min speed to activate.

Not sure I agree with that. We have had several postings on here in the past from one of our European members who has linked video clips of some very impressive hillclimbing (all off road) with a front drive hub motor and insists that the 'two wheel drive approach' is the only way to go in slippery conditions.
Personally think all e-bikes are about as useful as a chocolate teapot for proper off roading. They are fine for bridlepaths and fire roads though. I had a Powabyke several years ago and I had no problems on steep slippery Cornish hills and lanes. I think it mostly depends on your riding style. That is, how much you use the pedals vis-a vis the motor.
Horses (e-bikes?) for courses i think.
Now I'll just don my helmet and hide behind the sofa, 'cos i know there's a lot of anti front wheel drivers out there.........

Phil