Re-Celling an NiMh Battery without Ebay

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
Have you noticed that when this forum opened the content was predominately about eZee bikes, but lately it's been getting decidedly twisted? :)

With the two NiMh batteries for my Giant Lafree Twist Lite (What were Giant thinking of with that name, must have been a committee job) nearly four years old, renewal was needed. The range had virtually halved and the performance was dropping due to increased cell resistance.

There were three choices:

1) A new one from Giant. Said to be 9Ah and 216 W/h, they've supplied one with only 156 W/h to at least one user, leaving the bike's range unchanged. The price £250.

2) Using Cellpack Solutions to re-cell the battery. They make the same claim as Giant about capacity, but A to B magazine found one they had re-celled to equate to 165 W/h when tried out. This would only give a 5% range increase. The cost £150 plus £8 to send it, £158 in all.

3) Buying a Powacycle battery for the Windsor or Salisbury models and scavenging the cellpack. Virtually all these electric bike 24 volt batteries use a similar 20 x D cellpack, though with different formations. These are claimed to be 8 A/h and 192 W/h, and this has been tested and verified in the A to B test of the Windsor model. That would increase the range by 23%. The cost £99 plus £10 carriage for non-Powacycle owners if applied, so maximum £109.

So the cost per Ampere hour respectively for the above is either:

£38.46 or £27.71 from Giant, depending on what they feel like sending you.

£22.98 (or £17.56 if they live up to their claim) from Cellpack Solutions.

£12.38 (or £13.63 if del. charge applied, mine wasn't) from Powacycle.

In a torment of uncertainty, I struggled with those options for over a fifth of a second before finally making a decision. I ordered the battery online on Sunday, they (guess who) despatched Monday and I received it DHL on Tuesday (yesterday), and last night re-celled one of the Twist's batteries.

At near zero charge, I charged it and went for a first run this morning. As expected, the battery is initially well down on capacity until it's had some four discharge and recharge cycles. I just had time to squeeze in a second run this afternoon after recharging and the battery is already greatly improved. Once the weather permits a couple more of those longer runs I'll be able to enjoy the full range increase, on a standard geared Twist up from 20 to nearly 25 miles, though on my geared up one, from about 17 to 21 miles.

The Powacycle battery is remarkable value. With a cheaply constructed but adequate case, it has a keyswitch built in with a pair of keys. To avoid owners being inconvenienced with carrying two keys, they very thoughtfully include a replacement for the frame mounted battery lock as well. For £99 that's stunning, and there's the bonus that if a Powacycle owner is unlucky enough to drop a battery and shatter the case, there's a new spare case here ready for them now.

However, re-celling a battery is not to be lightly undertaken. Up to 200 W/h of power can do a lot of damage if treated wrongly. It isn't just a case of popping in the cellpack and connecting two wires, far from it, there are other considerations. Batteries have the cell connectors strapped in different formations, there are temperature sensors to be correctly positioned, integral battery meters as per Giant may need to be provided for. There may be metal sensor strips which need to be transferred onto a new cell. The different fuse values and positions are important. It's often not worth it when a new NiMh battery is inexpensive as with Powacycle and eZee batteries.

Some time over the next week or two I'll do an illustrated write up on this for those who feel confident to tackle it, publishing it on my website and announcing that here. It will be detailed for the Twist battery, but with generic advice for other makes.
 
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JohnInStockie

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 10, 2006
1,048
1
Stockport, SK7
I think that will be required reading material for all Twist owners and look forward to reading it.

John
 

tallbloke

Finding my (electric) wheels
Dec 5, 2006
22
0
Yeadon
www.tallbloke.net

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
No need to be sorry Tallbloke, well done, but only if they are ok!

After all, they are second hand, and I think that most, like me, would never buy a second hand battery. Also, you have no way knowing in advance the true capacity when new of what you've bought. They may have been be ok, many makes weren't, and two of my three quoted options failed to live up to the promise, and by large margins. Crucially, the cells in those are welded in a formation that makes them useless for my posted purpose.

I would still play safe with the certain option which is brand new cells with the standard one year guarantee, and strongly advise others to do the same.

Since making my posting above, I've received the invoice and haven't been charged the expected £10 for delivery for non-owners of Powacycle bikes, it's shown as zero delivery charge. That makes the value even better and I've amended the figure in the first post.

And I did say I was re-celling without Ebay! :p
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
Update on the Powacycle cells used

The increase in charge time on the third conditioning charge just completed with my well known Metco charger indicates the capacity, which on delivery was 112 Wh, is now well past the 156 Wh of the original new battery. It's now reached a calculated 182 Wh, so a fourth conditioning charge should bring it to it's specified 192 Wh.

However, I'm hopeful that this could be increased further. The genuine 8 Ah NiMh cells currently produced commonly have a capacity of 8450 mAh, and if this is attained, the final new capacity will be 203 Wh, giving a 30% range increase to the Twist.
 
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Gaynor

Pedelecer
Nov 28, 2006
152
2
Batterys... do the NIMh batterys, have a 'shelf' life like the Li ion, in that they lose power when theyre not in use?
Been reading a bit about that, and thought how do you know when you buy a new battery, how long its been in the shop? How much as been wasted..
Second hand battery buying sounds risky to me, but then because of shelf life, so can new ones
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
No worries about shelf life with NiMh Gaynor, they mainly deteriorate in use.

Li-ion should only be bought as fresh stock, but 50cycles are well aware of their requirements and they operate on a continuous flow of required quantities.

How do I know that? The constantly changing availability in their website catalogue indicates the above, items out of stock briefly showing no languishing and decaying surplus.

I'm sure they'll correct me if that's not true! :)
 

JohnInStockie

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 10, 2006
1,048
1
Stockport, SK7
Flecc,

For my new twist, should I use the 'Refresh' function on the Panasonic charger for the first 5 or 6 recharges, Is that right to get the most out of it?

Thanks

John
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
Yes John, for about three or four charges. That discharge and charge cycle takes a long time since the discharge rate is very slow, so you might need to plan for that.

Afterwards, once in a while, depending on usage. If it's in daily use, once every two or three weeks, less frequent use, once every 7 or 8 uses or thereabouts. As my batteries got older, from 150 or so charges, I increased the rate of refreshes, leading to every 2 or 3 eventually, to compensate in part for the loss of performance.

None of these is critical though, NiMh are quite tolerant.
 

Rooster

Just Joined
Jan 25, 2007
2
0
Spain
NiMh batteries

No worries about shelf life with NiMh Gaynor, they mainly deteriorate in use.

Li-ion should only be bought as fresh stock, but 50cycles are well aware of their requirements and they operate on a continuous flow of required quantities.

How do I know that? The constantly changing availability in their website catalogue indicates the above, items out of stock briefly showing no languishing and decaying surplus.

I'm sure they'll correct me if that's not true! :)
Can I say that it is most important, if a NiMh battery is going to be stored and not in use, it is very important to recharge every 3 months.
My new Dahon had a label on the battery for entries re. charging including dates. This was not done in my case, resulting in a battery that would not hold its charge!
Rooster :mad:
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,805
30,377
I agree, I know that might be a problem, though I've not experienced it personally with NiMh batteries left uncharged for longer periods. It's generally a good precaution to charge any rechargeable battery periodically though, and I tend towards 2 monthly intervals to allow some time for the inevitable odd oversight.

I think most bike suppliers are cautious about stock, and I've found them temporarily out of stock as often as not. One exception currently is Giant who've still been moving Twist series NiMh 6.5 Ah batteries which are at least a year old stock. However, these have been causing no problems with regard to either charging or capacity, so it seems cell quality might be a factor, their cells being top quality (but pricey) Panasonic manufacture.

Theoretically NiMh shouldn't need regular charging as they don't work in the same way chemically as most other types, but are somewhat akin to hydrogen fuel cells. Content leakage, possibly water by evaporation or oxygen, is the only factor I can see that might cause a problem over time.
 
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