Swytch Max++ Rear wheel kit

[azy77]

Hi,

I've pre-ordered this conversion kit but have a week or so to cancel if there's a better option.

With the rear wheel motor, delivery and oled display it's costing almost £700, is there a better option as a whole? The kit is for a Giant Escape 3 2017 edition which is hybrid and weights about 15kg.

On flat ground or slight inclines there is no issue with my bike, its just for the steep hills I am looking for electric power.

I can do basic bike diy following youtube instructions, I calibrated the 7×3 gears on it yesterday, took about 5 hours (yup, I know) but they are working almost flawlessly now.

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

have a week or so to cancel if there's a better option.
Any advice would be appreciated.

If you wanted a front hub kit £276 is good including 36v 15.6Ah battery

36V250W 26"/28" Front E-Bike Conversion Kit + 36V15.6Ah HL Plus Battery

1.Technical Data and Packing list 2. Warm tips*Our package is equipped with an integrated sensor（as top left corner）. The original pedal sensor in kit isn't fit for Hollowtech II and Octalink. The brake levers are not fit for bike with hydraulic brake. Please carefully confirm the suitable...

www.yosepower.co.uk

They also do a rear freewheel kit (I'm assuming 3*7 is freewheel rather than cassette) but its not in the sale.

My first conversion was a bike with rim brakes, eventually I got sick of the poor braking performance and constant adjustment and moved it to a bike with disc brakes - plenty on facebook for under £100

Also ready built bike is cheap - eg

VARUN M26-2

VARUN Ebike—48V 7.8Ah Battery & 250W Motor, Up to 25km/h Speed. Features Full Suspension, Shimano 21-Speed Gears. 150kg Capacity—Suitable for 155-195cm Riders.

www.varunebike.com

557 Euros = £480, free delivery with 48V 7.8Ah battery - probably realistically 30 - 40 mile range

With the rear wheel motor, delivery and oled display it's costing almost £700, is there a better option as a whole?

This cost me less that £700 including the donor bike

 

[azy77]

Appreciate that Peter, looks like Swytch really is expensive. I have a cassette rather than freewheel. I read that rear conversions are considered better than front, will look into these thanks.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

Appreciate that Peter, looks like Swytch really is expensive. I have a cassette rather than freewheel. I read that rear conversions are considered better than front, will look into these thanks.

Well the cassette motors are in the sale ! (not that it really matters, you can install a cassette motor wheel on a bike that had a freewheel, just means you need to buy a 7 speed cassette)

36V250W 26"/27.5"/28" Rear E-Bike Conversion Kit for Cassette with 36V13Ah HL1 Battery

1.Technical Data and Packing list 2. Warm tips*Our package is equipped with an integrated sensor（as top left corner）. The original pedal sensor in kit isn't fit for Hollowtech II and Octalink. The brake levers are not fit for bike with hydraulic brake. Please carefully confirm the suitable...

www.yosepower.co.uk

 

[Nealh]

For what they are switch are expensive , they have tried to make the connection battery bag look niche, it may look a bit neater but tbh many mention connection issues and very poor CS.
Woosh sell kits a bit cheaper with superior CS or Yose bike do cheap nice kits.

If one lives where their is pretty much flattish terrain with no big hills then the Bafang G370 mini hub is superb, lightweight with no torque steering noticable.
The drive rides unpowered as if it wasn't there, couple with KT system one will find it hard to beat.

 

[saneagle]

If your bike has rim brakes, it would be better to sell it and buy one of those cheap ready-made ebikes from Amazon, Ebay or Aliexpress, like that Varun above. If you're around 90 kg or more, it would be better to get something similar, but with 48v. Those bikes with the battery mounted on the downtube have standard kit that can be removed and fitted to any bike if you feel you can't live with that one in the future, though the ones I've tried have been pretty good.

 

[azy77]

I usually do a 6 hour ride on the hybrid once a week if weather permits. Going to my destination is mostly downhill or fairly level and requires little effort. The fairly steep up hill return journey is where I think an e-bike would be very useful.

I do have v brakes....I just configured these yesterday and they work really well, would prefer to stick with these, I can imagine the risk of speeding with these on an ebike but I intend to use the electric boost on hills anyway. I weigh approx 90 kg.

I'm now reading about mid drive kits and that just throws another spanner in the works in my decision.

ldeally looking for a light kit (3-4 kg) that is powerful for hills (more than the 250w motor on swytch) , not too complex to install (like swytch but I can do some diy) but just as important is long term reliability and efficiency which is where I gather the swytch is not so great at. The more miles it can do the better, realistic mileage of 30 to 40 sounds great.

Appreciate all the tips guys and I'll keep an eye on this thread to do more research.

The more I'm rrading about that yose one on offer (almost 1/3 price of swytch) the more I feel like going for it, not rush into it though like I did with swytch.

If your bike has rim brakes, it would be better to sell it and buy one of those cheap ready-made ebikes from Amazon, Ebay or Aliexpress, like that Varun above. If you're around 90 kg or more, it would be better to get something similar, but with 48v. Those bikes with the battery mounted on the downtube have standard kit that can be removed and fitted to any bike if you feel you can't live with that one in the future, though the ones I've tried have been pretty good.

 

[saneagle]

I usually do a 6 hour ride on the hybrid once a week if weather permits. Going to my destination is mostly downhill or fairly level and requires little effort. The fairly steep up hill return journey is where I think an e-bike would be very useful.

I do have v brakes....I just configured these yesterday and they work really well, would prefer to stick with these, I can imagine the risk of speeding with these on an ebike but I intend to use the electric boost on hills anyway. I weigh approx 90 kg.

I'm now reading about mid drive kits and that just throws another spanner in the works in my decision.

ldeally looking for a light kit (3-4 kg) that is powerful for hills (more than the 250w motor on swytch) , not too complex to install (like swytch but I can do some diy) but just as important is long term reliability and efficiency which is where I gather the swytch is not so great at. The more miles it can do the better, realistic mileage of 30 to 40 sounds great.

Appreciate all the tips guys and I'll keep an eye on this thread to do more research.

The more I'm rrading about that yose one on offer (almost 1/3 price of swytch) the more I feel like going for it, not rush into it though like I did with swytch.

With the additional weight and speed of the ebike kit, rim brakes wear through the rim, then you need a new motor wheel or have to rebuild it with a new rim.

I don't know how many times people come on here with their unpowered bikes, and they argue about how they're happy with their rim brakes. Ebikes are different, as you'll find out. Rim brakes might be acceptable if you're very light.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

The Varun bike that I linked to above would be heavy to pedal around without any motor assist

There are almost limitless possibilities when you are converting a bike , each with pros and cons. If you wanted a light kit that was easy to pedal unpowered , and just use the assist on hills, I would be tempted to use a 201rpm AKM-75 front hub motor (1.44kg) or Barang G370 (1.6 kg like @Nealh s) and a Woosh 36V 10Ah bag battery (1.8kg). If it had to be a rear hub, then the AKM100 (2.1kg). Combine with a 36V 15A KT controller and display

For your requirements I don't think a mid drive isn't really suitable - too heavy to pedal long distances unpowered for one thing

The only thing I would say is that your views are likely to change once you have got an electric bike and you are likely to use the assist more than you think - doesn't mean you don't put same pedalling effort in, just you get there faster ! I only changed my view on rim brakes after I had been using my converted kit for a while. So get components that you can upgrade in future !

 

[matthewslack]

If you can handle getting your hands a little dirty, Swytch is never best or cheapest solution. And getting your hands dirty at the outset means no trouble later that you can't resolve yourself.

 

[Sparksandbangs]

I would be tempted to use a 201rpm AKM-75 front hub motor (1.44kg)

I don't know but at 15kg I would suspect aluminium. Might not be a good contender for a front hub motor.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

OK - this is what I would get since you have got a healthy budget - this is very much top end !

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/186229806245 Bafang G370 wheel £230 (1.6kg motor)
https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?batteries 36V 10Ah bag battery £208 inc charger 1.8kg battery
https://topbikekit.com/ KT 36V 15A controller $82 inc delivery = £60






So lightweight kit , very easy to pedal with no power <£500 (you could get a 10.6kg Boardman Hyb 8.6 with hydraulic brakes for £250 to fit it on)

https://www.facebook.com/share/1YV2FZwWni/

 

[Peter.Bridge]

I don't know but at 15kg I would suspect aluminium. Might not be a good contender for a front hub motor.

 

[Sparksandbangs]

View attachment 64004

Fair enough. Worth checking though.

 

[saneagle]

I don't know but at 15kg I would suspect aluminium. Might not be a good contender for a front hub motor.

His fork is light alloy and it has a Q/R axle, so will need filing to fit a motor. A front motor wouldn’t be my choice on a bike like that. As well as safety and installation issues, you can get weird steering afterwards, depending on the steering geometry. You don't find out until after the job is done, then it's too late.

 

[azy77]

With the additional weight and speed of the ebike kit, rim brakes wear through the rim, then you need a new motor wheel or have to rebuild it with a new rim.

I don't know how many times people come on here with their unpowered bikes, and they argue about how they're happy with their rim brakes. Ebikes are different, as you'll find out. Rim brakes might be acceptable if you're very light.

Was looking at a Bafang kit that's disc brake only else have to pay extra for v brake edition. I get that it will rub away faster and have started looking into discs brakes, no idea about them or which ones are good or even how to install them, might just get Halfords to do it once I decide on a pair.

The Varun bike that I linked to above would be heavy to pedal around without any motor assist

There are almost limitless possibilities when you are converting a bike , each with pros and cons. If you wanted a light kit that was easy to pedal unpowered , and just use the assist on hills, I would be tempted to use a 201rpm AKM-75 front hub motor (1.44kg) or Barang G370 (1.6 kg like @Nealh s) and a Woosh 36V 10Ah bag battery (1.8kg). If it had to be a rear hub, then the AKM100 (2.1kg). Combine with a 36V 15A KT controller and display

For your requirements I don't think a mid drive isn't really suitable - too heavy to pedal long distances unpowered for one thing

The only thing I would say is that your views are likely to change once you have got an electric bike and you are likely to use the assist more than you think - doesn't mean you don't put same pedalling effort in, just you get there faster ! I only changed my view on rim brakes after I had been using my converted kit for a while. So get components that you can upgrade in future !

Thanks for the heads up Peter, I'm inclining towards a rear hub.

If you can handle getting your hands a little dirty, Swytch is never best or cheapest solution. And getting your hands dirty at the outset means no trouble later that you can't resolve yourself.

Very true mate, I've now cancelled the Swytch order, now have to look into disc brakes before even looking at conversion kits. I'm hoping the type of disc brakes doesn't affect the type of kit that can be used.

 

[saneagle]

OK - this is what I would get since you have got a healthy budget - this is very much top end !

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/186229806245 Bafang G370 wheel £230 (1.6kg motor)
https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?batteries 36V 10Ah bag battery £208 inc charger 1.8kg battery
https://topbikekit.com/ KT 36V 15A controller $82 inc delivery = £60


View attachment 64003



So lightweight kit , very easy to pedal with no power <£500 (you could get a 10.6kg Boardman Hyb 8.6 with hydraulic brakes for £250 to fit it on)

https://www.facebook.com/share/1YV2FZwWni/

You should always get a throttle with a KT controller. Remember, you can set it to be completely legal, and it's extremely useful in many circumstances. It's one of the best features of a KT system, and it doesn't make sense to omit it.

Also, I always recommend the block connector versions of the KT controller. It's virtually impossible to test anything with the moulded connectors.

 

[matthewslack]

The motor wheel needs to be the correct width for the frame. If that is right, and both motor and frame have disc brake mountings, should be no problem.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

The alternative is something like a AKM-100 rear hub motor

Was looking at a Bafang kit that's disc brake only else have to pay extra for v brake edition. I get that it will rub away faster and have started looking into discs brakes, no idea about them or which ones are good or even how to install them, might just get Halfords to do it once I decide on a pair.



Thanks for the heads up Peter, I'm inclining towards a rear hub.



Very true mate, I've now cancelled the Swytch order, now have to look into disc brakes before even looking at conversion kits. I'm hoping the type of disc brakes doesn't affect the type of kit that can be used.

I don't think the frame and fork on the Escape 3 have mounting points for disc brakes - there are some adapters available but why not get a motor wheel which can support disc or v brakes (and then you can move the conversion kit to a bike that has disc brakes , like I did when I got sick of the v brakes !)

 

[saneagle]

Was looking at a Bafang kit that's disc brake only else have to pay extra for v brake edition. I get that it will rub away faster and have started looking into discs brakes, no idea about them or which ones are good or even how to install them, might just get Halfords to do it once I decide on a pair.



Thanks for the heads up Peter, I'm inclining towards a rear hub.



Very true mate, I've now cancelled the Swytch order, now have to look into disc brakes before even looking at conversion kits. I'm hoping the type of disc brakes doesn't affect the type of kit that can be used.

I don't want to tell you what to do. I just give advice from my own experience. Many people do all sorts of things with all sorts of bikes and say they're happy with the results, partly because of their blissful ignorance.

The way I see it is that if you're going to do such a project, it's worth spending a bit of time and effort and a bit more money to get a good solution that you'll be happy with for years.

I spent about £30,000 trying every type of bike, motor, controller and battery and other devices, plus all the ready-made ebikes in order to find a bike that I was happy with. I've been using it nearly every day for 11 years and I'm still very happy with it. It cost about £1,100 to build. Over the years I did all the experimentation and countless builds, which is nearly all documented on this forum, it was a massive learning experience. Unfortunately, there was not much of a knowledge base when I started. The point is that if you build a bike that suits you, it'll give years of happy riding.

Everybody has their own characteristics, size, weight, fitness, power, etc that have a substantial bearing on a suitable outcome. They also have different requirements - range, power, types of ride, terrain, carrying capacity, looks, theft prevention, etc. What works for one guy might not work for somebody else. If you want advice on an ideal solution or options, you really need to give details of those things. People shouldn't be giving advice other than general advice until we know these details.