What gears do you actually use?

[frank9755]

I was pondering this today while out e-biking.

The bike has a triple chainring with 28-38-48 and a 14-34 (megarange) freewheel. On an e-bike, it hardly ever seems worth changing the chainring, so I tend to keep it on the middle ring for rolling along 95% of the time.

If I want to go ultra fast I might push it into the top ring, but I only did it once today on a 20 mile ride, down a long hill and would not have cared if I had not had it.

For a couple of really steep bits it was handy to have the small ring to get an extra low gear. This was handy as it allowed me to spin up a 1 in 5 at a reasonably high cadence at 5mph without getting out of my seat! I would miss it if I lived in a hilly area, say where Flecc is, but I could still have got by with the middle ring and just crunched the pedals more, or stood up on them, which many people do anyway.

So I am on middle ring 95% of the time. Of that I would say three quarters of the time I was on the top gear at the back. Otherwise I was in a middle gear like 3 or 4, or in a low gear as I changed down on a steep hill.

I would have been happy with three gears. I've just worked out the ratios, and they are the bottom one at 22", middle one around 50" and top of 74". If I had a fourth, then a higher one - 90-100".

I seem to remember similar from my old (21 speed) Powabyke.
- Is it the same for others?
- What about people bikes like the Cytronex, which have 24 or 27 gears?

 

[Straylight]

I too have the megarange on my wisper, coupled with a 48t chainring, or rather I had, untill today when I fitted my new 53t chainring.

I did this as I found on the very gentle undulations of mid Suffolk, I never had any occasion to use 1st, and was running out of gear at top speed downhill. Before the refit, I was generally somwhere between 5th and 7th, but on a 25mile test ride today was using 4th and sometimes even 3rd! 1st is still pretty useless though, even on the steepest "hills" round here . The motor just pushes through its speed range with little intervention from me, so 2nd is still the lowest necessary, and then only to set off/crest the "hills" - so as not to stress the motor/battery

I'll see how it pans out over time, but may end up switching the freewheel for the version that starts at 28t, but hang on to the original in case I move somewhere with HILLS

P.S. Haven't had a chance to really try out my new 7th gear as the roads were pretty wet and slippery today, but I certainly felt that I could go alot faster than the 27mph I achieved .

 

[wurly]

I tend to travel as fast as a can. If that means the outer ring and a high gear, so be it. It wasn't difficult to reach the 15mph max speed of assist on my first Tongxin converted bike. Now it has a higher rpm motor the top speed is around 23mph of assist. For me that is plenty fast enough.
Now i can control the amount of assist with my current limiter, i find myself using the lower gears more. I am still getting plenty of assistance from the motor, it just means my top speed is down and my battery doesn't get thrashed quite so much. Incidently i can adjust the the level so the green led actually flickers, showing a small amount of assistance rather than the on/off control you get with a throttle, so i can force myself to make use of the gears. I live in a very hilly area.

 

[flecc]

I too don't like lots of gears and have equipped both of my bikes with six, not all of which are used much of the time since I hardly ever need the lowest two on my Q-bike and often skip intermediate ones.

For that reason I use twistgrip gearchangers since they are easier for skipping gears up or down and going instantly to the one wanted. My preference is for the SRAM Shimano-compatible twistgrip changer, accurate and fast.

I think the only reason some e-bikes have 21 or 24 gears is purely to get enough total gear range. Many of the intermediates are duplications as on all derailleur bikes and even where they aren't duplicates, the drive gap covering ability of an electric assist motor means close ratios aren't necessary.

E-bikes mostly need a special kind of gearset or gearhub with few gears but wide ratios to give a good high and low range, but as ever the market isn't big enough for anyone like Shimano to make the necessary investment.
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[frank9755]

Interesting.

What really struck me today was how the motor keeps the bike at a very steady speed - therefore you just don't need to change gear. Apart from the really steep hills (up or down) I was doing 15-16 mph for long periods at a time. On a non-electric you have much greater variation in speed, with gradient and wind, hence all the gears.

When I've used the high speed motor, I tended to keep the bike in top gear for long periods, and again the speed would be relatively constant. Interesting, Mel that with your limiter the speed does vary hence you do use the gears!

I'm a twistgrip fan too. It's funny that Shimano seems to have decided that they are the low end shifters, with those horrible two-lever ones considerd more suitable for the mid- and higher-range bikes!

 

[flecc]

Yes, I think it all underlines just how different e-bikes can be from normal bikes in performance terms, and how much they need dedicated design attention with components to suit their differences.
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[wurly]

I read a comment on the ES forum where someone said the best effeciency of a brushless motor was gained at 75% of the maximum motor speed. I don't know about that, i find that you can definately feel assistance at very low motor rpm. Therefore if you keep the speed down and use less current you are going to get more distance from a charge. All you are loosing is speed and time. I got 36miles from my 7ah SLA's on a ride last week. Seems pretty good to me.

 

[flecc]

I read a comment on the ES forum where someone said the best effeciency of a brushless motor was gained at 75% of the maximum motor speed.

It's rather higher than that, usually more like at 85%, the efficiency rolling off for the last bit of speed, so keeping a bit below maximum does increase the range.

Restricted bikes can confuse the issue though, since the unrestricted maximum speed isn't known, nor the point of maximum efficiency in consequence. In all cases of bikes with throttles it's fairly easy to judge the speed an e-bike rolls most easily at with the throttle eased off a bit, and that's roughly the right point.

With restricted pedelec controlled bikes it's impossible to tell and it has to be left to the bike's software to do its best, and that's especially true of the Panasonic units where the motor runs in pulses with the pedal strokes and not continuously.
.

 

[Mussels]

I agree about first on the Megarange being a waste of time which is why I swapped it with a 28 tooth bottom gear. I am limited to seven gears and it is not quite what I need, it's enough for the commute but I often look for more at the top and bottom.
I have a 75" to 37" range (I think) and a wide variety of hills going to 33% over a bridge on NCN route 1.

Edit: Unlike others above I'm not a fan of grip shift, I have used those and triggers in the last couple of weeks and I much prefer the triggers.

 

[Patrick]

When I used to ride a lot on an unassisted bike with a triple chainring I very rarely used the bottom ring, I was off my bike and pushing by the time things got that steep , I used the top ring a bit more often but I spent most of my time on the middle. So when I came to get myself an e-bike I decided to go for the single chain ring X6 rather than the triple X24.

I use all six gears, most days I don't need the first gear, but on a bad day when I'm feeling knacked I'm glad I've got it. The top gear is a bit low for my liking, but seeing as there are no flat stretches on my commute it's not a big deal.

If I start cycling home unassisted more often as I get fitter then I may upgrade the gears to an 18 speed triple ring system, but as long as I'm using the motor 6 gears is plenty.

 

[Straylight]

I agree with Mussels with regard to the grip shifters, I find triggers so much more user friendly. I'd love to fit one to my Wisper, but would sadly be impossible with its throttle arrangement, I think.

 

[flecc]

I agree with Mussels with regard to the grip shifters, I find triggers so much more user friendly. I'd love to fit one to my Wisper, but would sadly be impossible with its throttle arrangement, I think.

I think much depends on circumstances and bike motor power.

For example, my Q bike is very powerful and I live up a steep hill in a hilly area. When setting off I glide downhill and then am almost instantly at full speed so wanting top gear. But when I climbed up previously I was four gears down, so with a trigger I have to have all those operations to get back into top since they only shift up one gear at a time. With the twistgrip it's a single movement. Being hilly around here with many stopping circumstances often at the foot of a hill, that sort of circumstance can crop up repeatedly while I'm cycling and repeatedly using the trigger to get back up the range quickly is just a pain.

The fact that they shift down in multiples but only up singly is a further irritation on a powerful e-bike that gets almost instantly up to cruising speed, though it makes sense on unpowered bikes of course where each gear is used and useful.

In different territory with less stopping I can well understand triggers being preferred, and road racers who do ride in that continuous manner usually use them.
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[torrent99]

I agree about first on the Megarange being a waste of time ...

Edit: Unlike others above I'm not a fan of grip shift, I have used those and triggers in the last couple of weeks and I much prefer the triggers.

I'm going to be an renegade here and say that I love the first on the Megarange! It's the only thing that gets me and the 2 year old (who weighs as much as a 3 year old) up the final 100yds of Highgate Hill. It'd be nice to have a 1.5gear though as the difference between 1 and 2 can be a bit too big at times.

On the grip shift vs trigger thing, I'm mixed. I like the precision of the trigger/lever, but would like the speed of the grip (I find it harder with grips to determine exactly what gear I'm in quickly).

 

[flecc]

I'm going to be an renegade here and say that I love the first on the Megarange! It's the only thing that gets me and the 2 year old (who weighs as much as a 3 year old) up the final 100yds of Highgate Hill. It'd be nice to have a 1.5gear though as the difference between 1 and 2 can be a bit too big at times.

I have 13 to 34 megarange freewheels on both my bikes, and on the very high geared Torq based T-bike the 34 tooth is very much needed on the steep stuff. On the more normally geared Quando based Q bike the 34 tooth is only needed on the most extreme hills like 1 in 3, though also useful on a standing start on 1 in 4 or 5.

On the grip shift vs trigger thing, I'm mixed. I like the precision of the trigger/lever, but would like the speed of the grip (I find it harder with grips to determine exactly what gear I'm in quickly).

I find the SRAM Shimano-compatible twistgrip far more precise than Shimano's own twistgrips and it's very easy to go exactly to the desired gear every time. The gear indicator window is bigger and far clearer too.
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[Wooky]

I think much depends on circumstances and bike motor power.

The fact that they shift down in multiples but only up singly is a further irritation on a powerful e-bike that gets almost instantly up to cruising speed, though it makes sense on unpowered bikes of course where each gear is used and useful.

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I've noticed that as well, pulling away in second to ease the battery load I'm clicking like mad down to 6th, I thought the click shifts would be easier but I now miss the twist grip.

Terry

 

[Mussels]

I'm going to be an renegade here and say that I love the first on the Megarange! It's the only thing that gets me and the 2 year old (who weighs as much as a 3 year old) up the final 100yds of Highgate Hill. It'd be nice to have a 1.5gear though as the difference between 1 and 2 can be a bit too big at times.

That big gap is in the worst place, on a steep hill I can lose a lot of speed as the final downchange sees my legs spinning too fast to apply pressure.
My answer was to fit a similar freewheel with the biggest cog at 28 teeth instead of the megarange 34 teeth. Then I changed the chainring so I ended up with a slightly lower first gear and a much more usable ratio at the bottom, the cost was a slight loss at the top of the range but it just means I can only pedal to 28mph instead of 30.

I fitted a SunTours freewheel but after seeing the sockets for the removal tool I wish I had stuck to Shimano.

 

[Straylight]

I've noticed that as well, pulling away in second to ease the battery load I'm clicking like mad down to 6th, I thought the click shifts would be easier but I now miss the twist grip.

Now I've gone up to a 53t chainring, I've found that initial mad dash through the gears is slightly less frantic, and it also means that I contribute a little more to the accelleration, which I would suppose is better for the battery.

 

[Wooky]

Now I've gone up to a 53t chainring, I've found that initial mad dash through the gears is slightly less frantic, and it also means that I contribute a little more to the accelleration, which I would suppose is better for the battery.

Pretty sure I couldn't change mine because of the Torque sensor mounting but I've not looked closely.

I've a mega-range rear set, is it possible to change top gear only or does one have to change the whole set?

Terry

 

[frank9755]

Nowadays you just change the whole set. Freewheels are not that expensive though - £5-20 depending on what type.

The hard bit is getting the old one off! That needs a special tool and a lot of strength and leverage to turn it.

 

[Mussels]

Pretty sure I couldn't change mine because of the Torque sensor mounting but I've not looked closely.

I've a mega-range rear set, is it possible to change top gear only or does one have to change the whole set?

Terry

You say torque sensor but it sounds like you have a pedelec sensor and a hub motor, if I'm wrong then so is the info below probably.
Where is your pedelec sensor mounted? Mine is diectly on the spindle so it doesn't matter what I do to the cranks or chainring.
You used to be able to get individual gears changed on a freewheel but I doubt you'd find anywhere that still stocks them, my last new freewheel cost about £6 on ebay so it's not really worth the hassle of changing the part. Also if the gears are worn it would be a good time to replace the chain as well and possibly the chainring. Changing the freewheel is not so simple and you may need a special tool to do it, I can help if it's a Wisper but other bikes will be slightly different.