Where is "Off road" ?

[Trevor Holloway]

I've tried looking on Google maps with no luck yet !

Any suggestions as to where the higher power bikes can be used ?

(Will now duck in case there is flack flying around).

 

[Fordulike]

I've tried looking on Google maps with no luck yet !

Any suggestions as to where the higher power bikes can be used ?

(Will now duck in case there is flack flying around).

Good question Trevor.
Just to add to that, would country parks be classed as off road?

 

[eTim]

Off-road when used in the context of electric bikes, ie there is an off-road button available or extra power can be used when off-road only, is a bit of a misnomer.

Off-road used in this context should actually mean 'private land' ie where you are allowed or have permission to do whatever you like using any vehicle at any age and not even hold a license.

I started a thread about this marketing term and its misuse sometime ago.

 

[flecc]

One of the earliest motor vehicle laws passed in Britain at the beginning of the twentieth century ruled that no motor vehicle was permitted more then 15 feet from the highway without the permission of the landowner. I can't trace it at present, but it's probably still in force, old legislation is rarely cancelled.

Since an e-bike that is outside of the EAPC laws automatically becomes a motor vehicle, that law would apply.

 

[Scottyf]

When I used to do off road motorbiking It was very difficult to find private land you can use for off road purposes. In the end i opted for a load legal off road bike and went green laneing. This still meant conforming to the regulations set by law on bridal footpaths etc...

 

[Jon]

For me i will go anywhere there is few people and will keep going until im asked not to. I have used designated cycle track, country parks and old railways (no longer used and asphalted) etc

 

[tillson]

One of the earliest motor vehicle laws passed in Britain at the beginning of the twentieth century ruled that no motor vehicle was permitted more then 15 feet from the highway without the permission of the landowner. I can't trace it at present, but it's probably still in force, old legislation is rarely cancelled.

Since an e-bike that is outside of the EAPC laws automatically becomes a motor vehicle, that law would apply.

I too seem to remember this law, but can't locate it again. It was the, "15 feet from the highway" bit which rattled something.

It may have been the following law, which could still be highly applicable to these so called "off road" bikes:

On <date> at <parish>, without lawful authority or excuse, deposited DUNG on a highway which consisted of or comprised a made up carriageway, namely <specify carriageway> or WITHIN 15 FEET from the centre of the carriageway.

Contrary to section 148(a) of The Highways Act 1980

 

[flecc]

It was definitely about taking a motor vehicle more than 15 feet from the highway and I remember it well from my early motorbiking days in the New Forest area. I just can't remember the title of that law, but it was passed into law in the first decade of the twentieth century.

 

[mike killay]

Road Traffic Act 1988 section 34
(1)Subject to the provisions of this section, if without lawful authority a person drives a mechanically propelled vehicle—.
(a)on to or upon any common land, moorland or land of any other description, not being land forming part of a road, or.
(b)on any road being a footpath, bridleway or restricted byway,.
he is guilty of an offence.
(2)For the purposes of subsection (1)(b) above, a way shown in a definitive map and statement as a footpath, bridleway or restricted byway is, without prejudice to section 56(1) of the M1Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981, to be taken to be a way of the kind shown, unless (subject to section 34A of this Act) the contrary is proved..
(3)It is not an offence under this section to drive a mechanically propelled vehicle on any land within fifteen yards of a road, for parking purposes.
NB You can drive onto such land to fight fire or save life or similar emergency

 

[flecc]

Thanks Mike, that's obviously replaced the very early 1900s law and generously changed 15 feet to 15 yards in the process.

Interestingly that 1988 road traffic act is one that affects e-bikes as well, since it contains the clause restricting e-bike riding to 14 years old or over.

 

[mike killay]

Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles must meet the requirements of the Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles Regulations 1983. Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles that conform to these regulations are considered to be pedal cycles and as such are allowed to use cycle facilities such as cycle lanes on the road and cycle tracks away from the road which other powered vehicles are prohibited from using.

 

[Scimitar]

It was definitely about taking a motor vehicle more than 15 feet from the highway and I remember it well from my early motorbiking days in the New Forest area. I just can't remember the title of that law, but it was passed into law in the first decade of the twentieth century.

It's probably something to do with the permitted use of a shotgun

 

[flecc]

No Dave, definitely as said for it affected my motorbike use at the time in the 1950s.

Gun laws wouldn't permit a shotgun to be fired so close to the road, even air rifles have a far more restricted distance from the centre of the nearest public road. I can only use mine legally at the rear of my property, but fortunately the squirrels co-operate.

 

[jbond]

Trying to understand the legal status of all the different path classifications is hard.
- Claimed footpath
- Public Footpath
- Public Bridleway
- BOAT
- Restricted Byway
- RUPP
I was surprised to find (I think) that it's not a criminal offence to ride a bicycle on a public footpath. It's a dispute between you and the land owner. I'm still not really clear on what a restricted byway is either. Re the OP, Off-Road is none of the above! In my area there's quite a few BOATs on old roman roads and such like. A lot of them have Police warning signs up about non road legal vehicles (motorcycles, quads) being used on them and threats of confiscation and destruction. This isn't enforced so there's still way too many motocrossers with open pipes and pit bikes being used by the local hooligans. It's almost funny to see a motocrosser being ridden by two kids with no helmets along the public road to get to their favourite play ground. If they can routinely get away with this, then our own fears about marginally illegal e-bikes seem laughable.

 

[NRG]

Excellent article that covers where you can and can't ride your bike:

Cycling and the Law | Bikehub | http://www.bikehub.co.uk

 

[flecc]

But the first paragraph in that article saying that cycling on the pavement is very much against the law can be subject to legal challenge in some circumstances. Here's the information on that, giving reasons why one may ride on pavements at times:

On 1st August 1999, new legislation came into force to allow a fixed penalty notice to be served on anyone who is guilty of cycling on a footway. However the Home Office issued guidance on how the new legislation should be applied, indicating that they should only be used where a cyclist is riding in a manner that may endanger others. At the time Home Office Minister Paul Boateng issued a letter stating that:

"The introduction of the fixed penalty is not aimed at responsible cyclists who sometimes feel obliged to use the pavement out of fear of traffic and who show consideration to other pavement users when doing so. Chief police officers, who are responsible for enforcement, acknowledge that many cyclists, particularly children and young people, are afraid to cycle on the road, sensitivity and careful use of police discretion is required."

Almost identical advice has since been issued by the Home Office with regards the use of fixed penalty notices by 'Community Support Officers' and wardens.

"CSOs and accredited persons will be accountable in the same way as police officers. They will be under the direction and control of the chief officer, supervised on a daily basis by the local community beat officer and will be subject to the same police complaints system. The Government have included provision in the Anti Social Behaviour Bill to enable CSOs and accredited persons to stop those cycling irresponsibly on the pavement in order to issue a fixed penalty notice.

I should stress that the issue is about inconsiderate cycling on the pavements. The new provisions are not aimed at responsible cyclists who sometimes feel obliged to use the pavement out of fear of the traffic, and who show consideration to other road users when doing so. Chief officers recognise that the fixed penalty needs to be used with a considerable degree of discretion and it cannot be issued to anyone under the age of 16. (Letter to Mr H. Peel from John Crozier of The Home Office, reference T5080/4, 23 February 2004)

 

[NRG]

Yes, Flecc but the article goes on further down to explain the exceptions and includes some of the text you posted...

 

[flecc]

That's good NRG, but I think it's a pity they were so emphatic at the outset, it would have been better to have added this; (but see below) as a note to that text.

 

[Trevor Holloway]

There seems to be a distinct lack of participation on this thread from the suppliers of bikes for use "Off road" !

I wonder if they can confirm where their bikes can legally be used ?

Its like a boat manufacturer supplying a boat that is not legal once you put it in the water !

 

[Mussels]

There seems to be a distinct lack of participation on this thread from the suppliers of bikes for use "Off road" !

I wonder if they can confirm where their bikes can legally be used ?

Its like a boat manufacturer supplying a boat that is not legal once you put it in the water !

The mainstream manufacturers/importers have been quite open about this in the past saying that off-road means private land, Wisper has removed the off-road button now as it could put buyers on the wrong side of the law. There are plenty of smaller sellers who flog much faster bikes who will blatantly lie or hide the truth, I don't think they use this forum though.