Why many ebikes exceed UK/EU maximum of 250W

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
19,407
16,387
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
The current UK laws on this subject really need repealing. I can understand the reasons why a one eyed granny shouldn't do 40mph on a shared path, but for an average sensible cyclist on the road common sense should prevail.

Battery capacity, voltage or motor wattage shouldn't come into the equation anyway, that doesn't affect the speed chosen by the rider, merely the potential available.

I doubt if any cyclist, electric or not, could be successfully prosecuted for exceeding a speed limit as there is no requirement for a speedometer therefore no means of monitoring it.

Throttle control should also be legal not just to assist those with certain disabilities but what difference does having to peddle make anyway. In the early 1970's the laws were changed on mopeds removing the requirement of peddles and introducing a maximum design speed of 28mph. Maybe as pedelecs become more popular, there is a danger of new legislation being introduced to bring them into line with mopeds so they can be easily controlled?
the current law does not stop you buying and riding a high powered electric motorbike.
You have to ride it on the roads, wear helmet and pay insurance.
The EAPC law is different, it's a concession to low powered e-bikes to be treated like normal push bikes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Andy McNish

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
19,407
16,387
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
manufacturer or importer of the kits and e-bikes should indicate that their kits or e-bikes are legal or not.
Their label spells out where they stand.
If my kit has a manufacturer's label saying that it's 250W then the kit is presumed to conform to EN15194 or 'road legal'.
Still, a label saying 'EN15194' or certificate of conformity issued by your importer should put your mind at rest.
 

anotherkiwi

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 26, 2015
7,845
5,785
The European Union
I doubt if any cyclist, electric or not, could be successfully prosecuted for exceeding a speed limit as there is no requirement for a speedometer therefore no means of monitoring it.
It has been done in France - a vélomobile owner was fined for breaking the 50 km/h speed limit on his way to work. And in Irun where I ride quite often there is a 30 km/h speed limit for all, including bicycles - it is written on the sign. The rider has to correctly estimate her/his speed if she/he doesn't have a speedometer.

Throttle control should also be legal not just to assist those with certain disabilities but what difference does having to peddle make anyway. In the early 1970's the laws were changed on mopeds removing the requirement of peddles and introducing a maximum design speed of 28mph. Maybe as pedelecs become more popular, there is a danger of new legislation being introduced to bring them into line with mopeds so they can be easily controlled?
There are already e-mopeds, they are called s-pedelecs.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,763
30,349
I doubt if any cyclist, electric or not, could be successfully prosecuted for exceeding a speed limit as there is no requirement for a speedometer therefore no means of monitoring it.
They can be successfully prosecuted if a pedelec exceeds 15.5 mph using any motor power. That's because the onus is on them to only ride a legal machine complying with this exemption from being considered a motor vehicle:

Exemption h.jpg
So no speedometer is necessary. Any machine not complying is considered a motor vehicle needing type approval, registration etc.

Throttle control should also be legal - - - - - - - Maybe as pedelecs become more popular, there is a danger of new legislation being introduced to bring them into line with mopeds so they can be easily controlled?
We used to have throttles, but the law was changed in 2015, banning them on new machines from 2016. So Europe wide there won't be any change since the trend is in the opposite direction.

However, in England, Wales and Scotland there is now a new ruling that a pedelec with throttle conforming with all the other regulations can have a form of type approval and then used without registration etc. So far one make, Wisper, are going to bring out a type approved pedelec with throttle.

Just don't take one on the ferry into mainland Europe, or into Northern Ireland where all pedelecs are banned and have to be registered as motor cycles.
.
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
9,822
3,985
Basildon
That's a good question. This is where things get very messy.
The kit supplier is providing what he calls a 350W kit, maybe with a 350W motor, but if you go on the motor manufacturer's website, I can almost guarantee that you'll find the same motor rated at 250W. Even Bosch used to do something similar where they had the same motors marked 350W and 250W.

You will often see on motor websites, "rated power - 250W/350W" or something like that. How can a motor have more than one rated power? Some would ague that a motor that maxes out at around 24 mph, provides 350w of output power at 20 mph and only 250W at 15 mph because power = torque x speed and output efficiency varies with speed too, so the output power would depend on its application and the rules its working under.

The main thing is the markings on the motor. If it says "350W", it's difficult to say it's 250W, but if there's no markings on it, it can be whatever you want. There's no limit on maximum power and no way to measure the maximum "rated" power, so it's almost impossible for anyone to determine what its rating should be. That's why we're seeing crank drive bikes with ever increasing torque. We all know that power is proportional to torque when the bike has the same speed and gearing. If a bike with 60 Nm is 250W, how can one with 110Nm also be 250W? It's because nobody cares.
 

soundwave

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 23, 2015
15,973
6,292
the bosch performance motors are all 350w and peak much higher and software limited to 15mph but under this speed they can still use max power for hills ect.
 

theo

Finding my (electric) wheels
Mar 22, 2019
6
0
the bosch performance motors are all 350w and peak much higher and software limited to 15mph but under this speed they can still use max power for hills ect.
So these bosch motors are not UK road-legal then??
 

soundwave

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 23, 2015
15,973
6,292
So these bosch motors are not UK road-legal then??
yes as the uk will have 250w stamped on the frame a sclass bike will have the same motor but higher speed limit of 45kph factory set buy bosch.

a dongle will make a 250w bike same as sclass because it wont have the 15mph limit.
 

anotherkiwi

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 26, 2015
7,845
5,785
The European Union
So these bosch motors are not UK road-legal then??
You could read EN15194, it explains what 250 W nominative means. It is a consumer protection thing that guarantees that you buy a motor capable of putting out 250 W for one hour without it getting warm. The 48v max battery thing is a security feature and the top speed limited to 25 km/h a road safety feature.

Any pedelec bike with Bosch, Yamaha, Brose or Shimano painted on the motor will be road legal, big name manufacturers play by the rules*. An s-pedelec class bike is easy to spot too, they have a rear view mirror, quality lights and a number plate carrier. The brake levers also have ball ends and there is usually an "S" or speed somewhere in the name of the bike.

* Kalkhoff is one that doesn't play by the rules, their Impulse motors tend to break down a lot...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Andy McNish