spuds away...

 

Expanding foam in can works very well....so i am told .

 

Imagine the scene of spotty youth wondering why his car won't start, followed soon after by several of his mates all looking, scratching their heads, talking on their mobiles, all wondering why it won't start.

 

Such fun can be had.....

 

 

.... a small potato works very well, allegedly, if like me you are a vegetarian and have no mackerel to hand, especially when pushed up the exhaust with a bike pump.... the engine just will not start...ha..ha, and impossible to remove on the spot, the trick is to not get caught doing it.

You could always purchase some of this stuff

 

Introducing the Stoppa Red MK3 UV Personal Attack Self Defence Spray by MACE

 

Useful as a last resort - legal in the UK.

Apparently frightens the crap out of attackers

 

 

Edit:

 

Here's another one

 

VestGuard UK - Bouncer Spray > VestGuard Bouncer Spray

 

This is one I carry when attending late night alarm call out's

.

 

 

what ever happened to peace and love....

 

 

RALGEX spray BUT is NOT harmless

I would always either report or have stern words with the people. I mean think of it this way, what if they keep thinking they can get away with it, and the next person gets hit, and the consequences are more severe? Answering violence with violence isn't the answer though, I mean if you spray them, or throw something at them, or ram something up their exhaust you are commiting another offence!

I would always either report or have stern words with the people. I mean think of it this way, what if they keep thinking they can get away with it, and the next person gets hit, and the consequences are more severe? Answering violence with violence isn't the answer though, I mean if you spray them, or throw something at them, or ram something up their exhaust you are commiting another offence!

 

Personally I would report any act of serious aggression or violence to the Police immediately.

 

But that doesn’t stop one from acting in self-defence. After all one would have to get away from the attacker to report an attack. I have little faith in passers-by’s these days (would probably steal your phone and money while your unconscious).

 

Unless the law has change, it is not an offence in this country to defend oneself or others from harm. Provided the defence is proportional to the attack.

 

If someone has a defence spray it doesn’t necessary mean they will use it at the first hint of raised voices. Products such as these require responsible use.

 

Therefore, if an attacker grabs a victim and they give the attacker a face full of defence spray, the victim has a good chance of getting away with minimum harm. In such a scenario the victim HAS been assaulted (grab or ruffed up) and the UV marker will help in identifying the attacker days later.

 

This is not a spray and forget product. It is designed to help apprehend violent individuals who have carried out an assault. In such a case the law would do everything it could to help the victim - it's self-defence.

 

So one can have stern words with them but keep your free hand ready to grab your spray for that possible attack.

 

However, if you use a defence spray for attack, spraying someone in the face and then knocked seven bails out of them, you would be done for assault - and rightly so.

 

These are defence sprays not attack sprays, which is why they are legal under the asinine (you can’t defend yourself here) UK law.

.

Edited February 25, 200917 yr by Footie

the defence sprays footie posts (but not anything else) have been approved by the cops, security industry etc.

 

It is not like CS or ammonia or even ralgex (!) - they are not intended to harm anyone but particularly with redstoppa to make a big mess, gum them up and distract them so you can get away and report them to the cops.

 

the spray contains a hard to remove and distinctive coloured dye and a UV marker which the cops can check using readily available Police equipment

 

its actually a smart idea which allows someone to identify an attacker, albeit using somewhat slapstick tactics.

 

Having deployed this stuff, I expect would you certainly would have to get away on your bike very quickly to get to a safe place and/or call a bobby as your average chav is going to be a tad cross at finding themselves besmeared with a load of red slime and might not see the humour in it.

 

It does remind me of the kids' film Bugsy Malone; where they were chasing each other in "cars" which had pushbikes inside them or something similar

That is a very interesting point you make. There are flaws however. The law on self defence states that you can use "reasonable force" to defend yourself. This is where the law can actually work against you. My career background has plenty of dealings with this kind of thing so I am quite passionate about legal matters (you may already be able to tell). Reasonable force is exactly that. In the instance you state would depend on many things. If somebody just grabbed your arm, and you sprayed them with anything (even water) you are technically comitting an offence. You then need to persuade the court that you acted with reasonable force to ensure your safety or the safety of others. Take Tony Martin for instance. His farm got broken into, and he shot the criminal. He went to prison, and there was public uproar. But he shot the guy in the back. That meant that he wasnt in immediate danger in the eyes of the law. Therefor his sentence. Now in the case of a road rage incident, if you are arguing with someone and he gets phsyical with you, who is similar build to you, and he grabbed you, yes that is technically common assault. BUT if you retalliate and cause him harm, ie hit him with a clenched fist/object/mace susbstitue you need to prove to the court that it was reasonable. As mad as it may sound, I have seen many a case whereby somebody who seems innocent gets a whopping fine and a record for "self defence". It is not a Mad Max style world we live in and every one of our actions has consequences........

my blood was up and I had a few not so polite words as I sailed past the boys offside

 

Sorry to hear about your incident. This kind of thing can be upsetting and basically ruins your day. The mistake is to go down to their level and pick a fight with a pig, as, if they are the kind of people who enjoy a bit of aggro, you can't win.

 

When I get cut up I do usually make a point of saying something but I aim to keep it polite and factual - pointing out that they passed too close. Sometimes this really offends people, and I let it drop. If it was a boy racer type car I wouldn't bother saying anything, to avoid that sort of situation developing.

 

Nothing whatsoever in your incident excuses someone trying to knock you off your bike and do you serious injury, it's just those situations are best avoided rather than dealt with afterwards.

Grumpy1 posted:

That is a very interesting point you make. There are flaws however. The law on self defence states that you can use "reasonable force" to defend yourself. This is where the law can actually work against you. My career background has plenty of dealings with this kind of thing so I am quite passionate about legal matters (you may already be able to tell). Reasonable force is exactly that. In the instance you state would depend on many things. If somebody just grabbed your arm, and you sprayed them with anything (even water) you are technically comitting an offence. You then need to persuade the court that you acted with reasonable force to ensure your safety or the safety of others. Take Tony Martin for instance. His farm got broken into, and he shot the criminal. He went to prison, and there was public uproar. But he shot the guy in the back. That meant that he wasnt in immediate danger in the eyes of the law. Therefor his sentence. Now in the case of a road rage incident, if you are arguing with someone and he gets phsyical with you, who is similar build to you, and he grabbed you, yes that is technically common assault. BUT if you retalliate and cause him harm, ie hit him with a clenched fist/object/mace susbstitue you need to prove to the court that it was reasonable. As mad as it may sound, I have seen many a case whereby somebody who seems innocent gets a whopping fine and a record for "self defence". It is not a Mad Max style world we live in and every one of our actions has consequences........

 

I think one could argue the pros and cons until the cows come home.

As it is Rad got away without getting deeply involved but suffered mental upset from the incident as well - so he was a victim twice.

Where force is concerned, at the end of the day, it's all down to what a jury thinks, if it ever goes to court.

Here's what The Crown Prosecution Service has to say about self-defence.

 

Self Defence: Legal Guidance: The Crown Prosecution Service

 

I leave it to the members of the jury to decide

.

I have a slightly different approach these days. I used to get worked up and make a point but over the years it has dawned on me that I can't change the mind of an idiot by a confrontation.

 

So now I take the opposite stance and give way to nutters and aggressive drivers. I even go to the lengths of giving way when I have right of way. I've got a feeling that being nice to people will have a more positive effect than confonting people on average.

 

I hope that these days when

people see me they think 'oh there goes that really courteous cyclist'. I honestly think this is now the best option.

I think you're absolutely right Caph. I shouted at a couple walking on the cycle track a few weeks ago, they didn't hear me coming - that Agattu bell! - and I still feel bad about it. Now I just smile at everybody. Life's too short for aggro, justified or not.

So now I take the opposite stance and give way to nutters and aggressive drivers. I even go to the lengths of giving way when I have right of way. I've got a feeling that being nice to people will have a more positive effect than confonting people on average.

 

 

I think that you are quite correct with this approach and it is exactly what I do. It does go against my instincts though as people shouldn’t be allowed to do as they like at the expense of putting others in danger. However, with the current culture of, “I have a right to do what I like whenever I like” you aren’t going to get very far confronting people.

 

The best approach that I have found is to tread the very fine line of asserting your presence on the road without exposing yourself to danger. This involves giving way to a complete idiot when necessary. It niggles for a few minutes afterwards, but it doesn’t take as long to get over as having had a potentially violent confrontation.

One approach I heard a while ago relating to car driving was that when treated badly be another driver, go out of your way to be courteous to another driver at the next opportunity.

 

Although this is not the natural inclination, it can be surprisingly affective at relieving the stress of the first incident and may well be more affective at improving the overall level of driving. Criticising other people's driving often gets their backs up whereas being courteous, I believe, inclines them to be more courteous to others.

 

Having said that, I can see the argument for sometimes pointing out a danger to a driver who appears to be unaware of it.

One approach I heard a while ago relating to car driving was that when treated badly be another driver, go out of your way to be courteous to another driver at the next opportunity.

 

That reminds me of my attitude when I used to commute to London on the underground and train, usually there was a polite but vicious battle for seats (one person stands up and four people try to manouver themselves into the vacated seat). It was very easy to get drawn in and I often found myself rebelling against it by smiling and offering the seat to my adversaries (if I was feeling particularly agrieved by the whole cattle truck business then I would go out my way to stand up and offer a seat which I'd already "won", you don't half get some surprised looks when you do that).

 

It left me feeling much more relaxed becaused I was in control of the situation. It meant I had to stand, but someone had to and I at least I wasn't stressed by it.

I have a slightly different approach these days. I used to get worked up and make a point but over the years it has dawned on me that I can't change the mind of an idiot by a confrontation.

 

So now I take the opposite stance and give way to nutters and aggressive drivers. I even go to the lengths of giving way when I have right of way. I've got a feeling that being nice to people will have a more positive effect than confonting people on average.

 

I hope that these days when

people see me they think 'oh there goes that really courteous cyclist'. I honestly think this is now the best option.

 

Words of wisdom now coming out in these later posts.

It is wise these days to avoid any confrontation.