That was perfectly legal

 

I am fully aware of the guidelines the police use for prosecutions, speed limit + 10% etc.

 

But are you suggeting that you cannot under any circumstances be prosecuted for exceeding 30mph, say doing 33mph, in a 30mph zone ?

But are you suggeting that you cannot under any circumstances be prosecuted for exceeding 30mph, say doing 33mph, in a 30mph zone ?

 

I don't know, but whenever I do that downhill... I do it with a beautific happy smile on my face; not at all furious looking, to be on the safe side.

 

 

https://vimeo.com/857726500

I don't know, but whenever I do that downhill

 

Me too, been up to 50mph going steep downhill on my eMTB, legal, since the motor cuts out at 25kmph.

Me too, been up to 50mph going steep downhill on my eMTB, legal, since the motor cuts out at 25kmph.

 

Aha! You're a member of the elite and rarely mentioned "50mph Club" - there's a very tempting newly resurfaced totally straight hyper-smooth 2 mile downhill road nearby I've been meaning to descend at high speed, in the dead of night, though it might already be blighted by a deeply potholed moonscape by now.

 

(Hope I'm not encouraging anyone to go breaking their necks etc.)

Edited September 15, 20232 yr by guerney

I am fully aware of the guidelines the police use for prosecutions, speed limit + 10% etc.

 

But are you suggeting that you cannot under any circumstances be prosecuted for exceeding 30mph, say doing 33mph, in a 30mph zone ?

My Wife was pulled up by the police for, according to them, doing an estimated 33 mph on her motorbike. At that time, there were strange things going on in that area between the police and motorcycles. Eventually a policeman was jailed for beating up a motorcyclist because he didn't like his cocky attitude. things went back to normal after that. My wife was following a police car at 30 mph. It started to slow down and pulled close to the edge of the road, so she took it as a singnal to pass. As soon as she passed, the blue lights came on. It was night time so they couldn't see that it was a pretty girl. They were quite agressive until she took off her helmet. They said that at the time she overtook, they were doing 28 mph and they estimated that she was going 5 mph faster than them and that they could book her, but decided to let her off with a warning. She was petrified through the whole experience and still shaking when she got home ten minutes later.

 

A few weeks before, I got a speeding ticket in strange circumstances. I stopped at traffic lights in the inside lane of a two lane town centre road. A police car pulled up in the other lane. When the lights went green, I waited for the police to go first, but he didn't go. After a long wait, I had to procede as there was a queue behind me. On my motorbike in a busy town, it was easy for me to make progress through the traffic, but the police car was getting blocked, so my lead increased until he was about 1/2 mile behind me as I left town. I was very suspicious because of his behaviour , so kept looking in my mirrors to see where he was. Eventually, with him more than a half a mile behind and completely out of sight on a clear road, I turned left through a very small village out onto the open road and away. After about 20 minutes and around 12 miles, I could see the police car behind me again overtaking dangerously without blue lights on. He followed for about 10 minutes, then pulled me up and said that I had been speeding, which I hadn't. After some questioning, he changed his story to me speeding through the village. He said he was right behind me measuring my speed, but he wasn't. He showed me his vascar readout of 40 mph, which he could have put on at any time, like when he was speeding through the village trying to catch me up. I went to a lawyer, but he said that I would have no chance in court, so I was forced to plead guilty and put it down to experience. Not all policemen are honest, though most are OK.

I am fully aware of the guidelines the police use for prosecutions, speed limit + 10% etc.

 

But are you suggeting that you cannot under any circumstances be prosecuted for exceeding 30mph, say doing 33mph, in a 30mph zone ?

 

Yes, I was not quoting a police guideline. I was quoting the DfT's definitive ruling, and it is they who make the law. If the limit is 30mpg, 33mph actual is permitted and not subject to prosecution. If the limit is 70, 77mph actual is permitted and not subject to prosecution.

 

In fact the position is the same in many countries elsewhere, the 10% tolerance widely used. There has to be a tolerance since no speed recording is precise in all circumstances.

 

Of course one has to drive or ride to circumstances, for example fog or pedestrians wandering about in the road, so if they make a speed dangerous, one must drive or ride more slowly. But that of course is a different matter entirely.

.

Edited September 15, 20232 yr by flecc

A friend of mine was recently fined and given points for 33 in a 30 limit, here in Wales (Ceredigion). It seems they are adopting zero tolerance and, beware, 'cos from this Sunday -17/9- all 30mph areas will be 20mph. Apart from outside my house, where there is no pavement, as the 20 limit finishes where the pavement does, about 100metres away. There are great long stretches of straight, good visibilty A road, with wide pavements each side, where you could drive up and down all day and not see a pedestrian, that will be 20. Yet the glorious Welsh assembly insists that this is a life saving measure.

Personally I think they're desperate for extra funds to misappropriate and don't have tax raising powers.

I had a mate who was fined for 31mph in a 30 zone.

That's the law. Recent article below may hint at what's to come.....

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/dont-fine-drivers-for-doing-30mph-in-a-31mph-zone/

 

Plus in Wales most 30mph will drop to 20mph. I think e-bikes may start to stand out when they keep up with cars, especially the kits with a 48v battery..

 

My yose kit which is 250w 36v seems quicker off the mark and higher top speed than all the legal bikes. Most seem to potter along around 13mph. I prefer to peddle with effort and go on by at around 16mph.

My first day after charging I can get 18mph with no wind. Second day around 16.

I think most people ride like this. I've not seen anyone faster but I guess they are around..

 

Are people getting upset with the 48v 1000w kits? Some can go over 30mph which I think is dangerous. I don't fancy that

Ebikes keeping up with traffic might improve relations between cyclists and drivers? It won't happen, but I'd love to see the 20mph limit adopted all over the UK for all vehicles in built up areas, including ebikes, or the limit lowered further to 15.5mph. While derestricted after initially getting my kit, not knowing much about ebike laws at the time, I could easily maintain over 20mph on my 36V BBS01B 250W converted 20" wheeled Dahon folder. Felt like Superman.

 

These days my bike's speed is limited, but it has more balls.

 

Edited September 15, 20232 yr by guerney

I'd love to see the 20mph limit adopted all over the UK for all vehicles in built up areas

 

Let me guess... you don't drive?

Let me guess... you don't drive?

i dont drive and it is fkn stupid and all about control, buy a horse and let it $hit everywhere up town

Let me guess... you don't drive?

 

I couldn't stand all the cyclists. There would be a massive uptake of ebikes with a 15.5mph limit in all built up areas. Cyclists would feel safer not having to hug gutters, clatter over potholes and endure fast close passes. Drivers would feel less infuriated looking at cyclists arses, air quality would improve (if cyclists weren't vegan), birds wouldn't cough as much, people will become ever so slightly less obese and cost the NHS a bit less, a whole new class of cheap lightweight EVs for exclusive city use could emerge, vehicles will be able to stop in time from lower speeds, ebikes would become so cheap people will stop buying those dangerous ninja street ninja missiles etc.

Edited September 16, 20232 yr by guerney

i give the ram rovers about as much room as they give me 2.5mm

I couldn't stand all the cyclists.

 

I don't know how to drive at 20mph. 20mph limit is insane.

Bikes and cars shouldn't use same roads really. It is so much better for drivers and for cyclists when there are dedicated cycle paths.

I don't know how to drive at 20mph. 20mph limit is insane.

Bikes and cars shouldn't use same roads really. It is so much better for drivers and for cyclists when there are dedicated cycle paths.

 

try that down the motorway

i give the ram rovers about as much room as they give me 2.5mm

 

Buy one of these from me for £3,000,000 (inflation's a bitch and sales have slowed). Or you can make your own cheap and nasty version using balls of snot and dandruff - those ram rovers will give allow you 33.999cm+ at least 2.5mm. If not, you may be eligible for a highly unpalatable, unacceptably extremely tiny and impossible to obtain partial refund* (*terms apply).

 

 

Edited September 16, 20232 yr by guerney

problem is i like racing the cars i under take over take and even bang on there windows if i can catch them my handle bars are stronger than there wing mirrors

There are too many people committing too many crimes, most of which are a lot more serious than traffic offences, and not enough police.

Simples.

 

In my experience, this is going to be the case, nothing else.

 

40 years ago, CB radios (an American import) was quite the rage amongst us (then young) folk. Some had home equipment, but the great bulk of my social group, had radios in the their cars. These systems were completely illegal, and were pretty obvious to spot if installed in a car. 5ft whip aerials weren't necessary for in-car radios back then, it was something of a CB giveaway. I don't remember a single person being pulled over, much less prosecuted. It was so endemic, laws were changed to allow FM banded radios, while AM banded remained banned. (AM bands tend to wander.) We either grew out of chatting all night, or being 'legal' meant it lost our interest.

 

E-scooters are a marvelous tool. Relatively cheap personal transport, clean (in theory pollution free) and children don't have to leave them locked up in a bike shed at school, where they can be stolen or damaged. No pressure to use them on roads either. Of course like any technology, mechanical or electric, there are people among us who want to push boundaries. Almost 3 weeks ago, I saw two e-scooters roaring up a hill on the road that has a 30mph speed limit, and they must have been doing 40mph. (No helmets or body protection, prospective Darwin award winners.) I see motor cars doing the same thing on the same road. Motorbikes doing the same, and more frequently. I also see a couple of delivery bicycles fairly regularly on the same road. One at least has dual hub motors and a battery I might struggle to lift. I reported recently, I'd seen one of these fellas moving along without pedalling.....

 

These three examples, are what are often described as "victimless" crimes. Well, as long as the e-scooters and e-bikes don't create, or are involved in accidents.

 

The police are a finite resource. AM banded CB radios are still banned, E-scooters are banned anywhere public. Over-powered e-bikes, also banned anywhere public. We certainly don't need further legislation on the "banning" front. When the finite resource is so stretched it doesn't always respond to shoplifting, (seldom responds it seems) and it generally only provides crime numbers for car theft and burglary all of which are crimes with victims, do we really want to move that limited resource away from crimes with victims, to victimless crimes? Shoplifting means your food bill is likely 5% higher than it should be. Same with many retail situations. Who loses out when a child uses an e-scooter to get home quickly from school (and maybe saves their parent/guardian making a car journey to collect them)?

 

The British government makes mistakes - all the time. One of the biggest, has been to try and cripple the use of cheap e-transport systems. I believe the reasons for this go back further than Trump or Biden. I think these bad decisions go back to 1835, when bicycles (penny farthings) were banned from footways. "Bicycles" of a style we no longer use, were forced onto largely unmade roadways (in the day), some 60 years before Mr Benz produced what we know today as the motor car. That law has never been repealed, although it is (thankfully), largely ignored. If the 'letter of the law' were obeyed, instead of 12 and 13 year olds riding their e-scooters on pavements when getting to or leaving school, they would have to ride their bicycles on the A6129 local main road which has a 40mph speed restriction. It's a single lane each way road, that delivery artics regularly use. What mindset, would have children riding bicycles on main roads with 20-40 tons of articulated lorry passing them at anything up to 40mph and within inches of them?

 

The mainstream introduction of electric vehicles was always going to take profits away from hydrocarbon powered car manufacturers, take huge revenues away from petrochemical companies, and from the government in the form of taxes. Despite the much lauded environmental benefits of "e" power, the government, any UK government, has done nothing to encourage "e" powered vehicles whatever their form. New e-vehicles, which tend to be fairly expensive, now have additional tax applied on purchase. While they make no visible pollution, they no longer enjoy (or will no longer enjoy) zero rated road/vehicle tax either.

 

Petrol or diesel free personal transport, provides no ongoing tax revenues for the government, other than on the price of electricity, which is a measly 5%. At the moment, some 62p of the £1-50 per litre you pay at the pump for your fuel, is tax. Where is the motivation for the Treasury to encourage the use of e-vehicles?

 

Luckily, the resources needed to enforce the petrochemical company demands, are just not available. The government needs for tax collection, are not yet so important they are willing to provide additional money for that enforcement. (Long may that continue.) Restrictions on the use of e-vehicles, should not force us into using petrol/diesel engined vehicles if we choose to use alternatives.

 

I'm not supporting e-scooters that go faster than (say) 8mph, which I think is fast enough. Nor am I supporting over-powered e-bikes. But I don't think our roads are the right places for scooters or bicycles. Especially not for young people. Nor do I think the respective laws on these should be enforced in any way. Not until "reckless" behaviour is seen anyway.

 

(Likely unpopular rant, over.)

Edited September 16, 20232 yr by FastFreddy2

I don't know how to drive at 20mph. 20mph limit is insane.

Bikes and cars shouldn't use same roads really. It is so much better for drivers and for cyclists when there are dedicated cycle paths.

 

100% agree. My diesel car really doesn't like 20mph. I had some experience of driving a small petrol engined car in June, weaving through the streets of London. Was not much easier, and very fuel inefficient. With stopping for lights at roads junctions, I managed 9 miles in 40 minutes. That's less than a 14mph average.

100% agree. My diesel car really doesn't like 20mph. I had some experience of driving a small petrol engined car in June, weaving through the streets of London. Was not much easier, and very fuel inefficient. With stopping for lights at roads junctions, I managed 9 miles in 40 minutes. That's less than a 14mph average.

 

will have to pay the cloud tax in london tho. but if there was that much pollution then we wont get any sun anyway lmfao.

 

A friend of mine was recently fined and given points for 33 in a 30 limit

 

I had a mate who was fined for 31mph in a 30 zone.

 

So drivers are sometimes prosecuted for driving at 33mph in a 30mph zone ...............

A friend of mine was recently fined and given points for 33 in a 30 limit, here in Wales (Ceredigion). <removed> Personally I think they're desperate for extra funds to misappropriate and don't have tax raising powers.

Hi .I'm not doubting what you were told but could you ask for a photo and upload it?

 

A few years ago a motoring forum I use asked if anyone could send them a photo of a "33 mph in a 30 zone" ticket. Lots of people knew "friends of friends" who had got tickets for 31, 32, 33mph but I don't think they ever traced any of the reports back to actually see the proof. They were asking if a ticket for anything less than 34 mph in a 30 zone was an urban myth.

 

Things change and the situation now might be different, my understanding was ACPO guidelines (ie not law so can can be ignored when issuing tickets) were "speed limit + 10% + 2mph" so in a 30 limit under 35mph won't shouldn't get a ticket.

 

[mention=4]flecc[/mention] do you have a link for the Dft "definitive ruling" as I search but can't find it. I can found lots of conflicting info - some from what look like credible sources - that confuse things rather than settle what is legal and allowed, and what will get me a ticket.

[mention=4]flecc[/mention] do you have a link for the Dft "definitive ruling" as I search but can't find it.

 

There isn't a link, which I can well understand. They are hardly likely to publicise loopholes. The information has always been given by the DfT in letters of reply, but they have legal force since the DfT are the legal authority.

 

The last such reply was their confirming that the 10% tolerance applied to all speed limits, including the 15.5 mph pedelec assist limit, the subject of the enquirer's letter.

.

I was told and the wife ( not saying where pleading the 5th amendment) years apart on course that the speed limits are the maximum not a target