March 19Mar 19 Why do you Iran apologists think it is that Iran is feared, hated and loathed by the rest of the Arab world? Why is it that the ordinary people of Iran not connected directly with the graft of the regime, also hate their government. Hate it enough to protest on the streets so that 30,000 of them were killed in the last two months, BY THE REGIME! Why is it that the people of Lebanon hate and detest Iran? For the answer to the last question, just look and see what Iran and the Palestinians have done to Lebanon. It has a massive cancer growing in its cities, towns and villages. A cancer planted there by Iran, which fires Iranian rockets into Israel guaranteeing massive retaliation. Hezbollah. They know they can not win, but they continue to attack Israel anyway because they have that most dangerous to others delusion of all - a belief that no-matter they are killed, they are doing Allah's work. The martyrdom cult is seen all over the middle east fostered by extremist Shia Islam. They even attack their fellow Muslims in setting up martyr militias around the region. Yemen, Lebanon, Gaza, The West Bank, Bahrain, and probably others. It must end and war is the only way to wipe it out, or at least to de-fang it so that it is not supported by diverted oil and gas profits from Iran. The corruption of that regime is massive. How does the son of the previous supreme leader Hamnei, now supposedly Supreme Leader himself, but curiously invisible manage to have a portfolio of property worth £46.5 million in London as well as much more in Dubai, and Europe? Bloomberg claims he has assets of around $3Bn. This is money stolen from teh people of Iran.
March 19Mar 19 Why do you Iran apologists think it is that Iran is feared, hated and loathed by the rest of the Arab world? Why is it that the people of Lebanon hate and detest Iran? For the answer to the last question, just look and see what Iran and the Palestinians have done to Lebanon. It has a massive cancer growing in its cities, towns and villages. A cancer planted there by Iran, which fires Iranian rockets into Israel guaranteeing massive retaliation. Hezbollah. They know they can not win, but they continue to attack Israel anyway because they have that most dangerous to others delusion of all - a belief that nomatter they are killed, they are doing Allah's work. The martyrdom cult is seen all over the middle east fostered by extremist Shia Islam. They even attack their fellow Muslims in setting up martyr militias around the region. Yemen, Lebanon, Gaza, The West Bank, Bahrain, and probably others. It must end and war is the only way to wipe it out, or at least to de-fang it so that it is not supported by diverted oil and gas profits from Iran. The corruption of that regime is massive. How does the son of the previous supreme leader Hamnei, now supposedly Supreme Leader himself, but curiously invisible manage to have a portfolio of property worth £46.5 million in London as well as much more in Dubai, and Europe? Bloomberg claims he has assets of around $3Bn. This is money stolen from teh people of Iran. put me in charge ill sort it in 1hr id nuke the fkn lot kill it bang n set half the planet on fire
March 19Mar 19 I am no fan of Netanyahu and have said so here before ,I am sure. However, anyone who thinks that Iran ought to be left alone to develop nuclear weapons and attack Israel, is a lunatic with suicidal tendencies or someone at the end of their life with no relatives to worry about. Iran has WELL DESERVED regime change for the murder of its own citizens alone. When considering its determination to ruin all around it with violent militias which make a misery of life for those living anywhere it can reach, the case is even stronger - much stronger. How do you fancy an IRGC and Supreme Leader with nuclear weapons and long range missiles? Only someone with no stake in teh future or a delusional pyschological condition would shrug at such a prospect. Netnayahu is a nasty piece of work, and I have long though so, but Iran would NEVER have been troubled by Israel had it not spent the last 46 years attempting to destroy Israel and its citizens. What do you really expect of Israel, a country which for all of its faults (I mean those right wing settler lunatics and their enablers) is made up significantly of the survivors and descendants of perhaps the greatest genocide in history? To a very large extent, Israel voted for Netanyahu BECAUSE of Iran and its proxies. People are afraid there. They are afraid because of what Iran will do and has been doing using Hezbollah and HAMAS to attack Israel from just over the border. As for the Jews - you need to understand something important about Jews and pacifism. Where did peacefully complying with the orders to get on the trains and walk into the 'shower rooms' at Treblinka, Dachau, Belsen and Majdenek get them? No - the Jews walked like sheep to extermination in the past. Not anymore. Mess with the Jews these days and you will get a rocket through your window and who cares in Israel if your grandmother was visiting when it arrived. You won't find many pacifists in Israel. They know where it leads. If the Mullahs didn't want trouble with Israel, why did they devote a significant part of their GDP to creating, funding, training and equipping HAMAS? Why did they persist in the plan to build long range missiles and nuclear weapons, all teh while chanting 'Death to Israel'? These chants were not just rhetoric - they meant it, and showed that on Feb7th 2023. Only tiresome lefty fools , and Islamists would object to this logic. If you don't want BIG TROUBLE - don't attack Israel. Simple. Israel does not attack Oman, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia or any other state that is not attempting to destroy it. When attacked, you MUST defend yourself or you will be annihilated. say an extraterrestrial visited the middle east. and you told him israel has nuclear weapons and iran does not. and you gave a brief description of each of these nations behaviour over, say, the past few years: which one do you think he would label the aggressor? And which one would he be more concerned about having nuclear weapons?
March 19Mar 19 put me in charge ill sort it in 1hr id nuke the fkn lot kill it bang n set half the planet on fire You need to take your medication and to sit in a darkened room. Stay off the psycodelic drugs too.
March 19Mar 19 Author I am no fan of Netanyahu and have said so here before ,I am sure. Nor am I an apologist for Iran since I have a deep hatred of all religions and religious based politics. But in a discussion like this l keep to the subject and its root, the theft of the Palestinians country by the United Nations in response to US pressure provoked by American Jewry. This was surely the greatest crime that can be suffered by any nation of a people who had done no wrong to remotely deserve such a terrible punishment. Then followed by over seventy years of cruel Israeli mistreatment of any protest while denying the Palestinians any means of self defence or any source to seek justice. Inevitably the Palestinians frustration would lead to ever more extreme responses, those supported in turn by other Islamic countries, including the most undesirable like Iran, a situation entirely brought about by the US backed Israeli's appalling behaviour over that seventy plus years. So please stop trying to portray the Israelis as wronged innocents. They are not, they are a criminal state with further criminal intent, such as the ongoing theft of much further land, like the West Bank which is part of Jordan who kindly allowed Palestinians to flee there and will be happy for them to have that as the basis for a new state of their own. Israeli theft won't stop there, they obviously have their expansionist sights firmly on Syria, Lebanon, Gaza and beyond. .
March 19Mar 19 Nor am I an apologist for Iran since I have a deep hatred of all religions and religious based politics. But in a discussion like this l keep to the subject and its root, the theft of the Palestinians country by the United Nations in response to US pressure provoked by American Jewry. This was surely the greatest crime that can be suffered by any nation of a people who had done no wrong to remotely deserve such a terrible punishment. Then followed by over seventy years of cruel Israeli mistreatment of any protest while denying the Palestinians any means of self defence or any source to seek justice. Inevitably the Palestinians frustration would lead to ever more extreme responses, those supported in turn by other Islamic countries, including the most undesirable like Iran, a situation entirely brought about by the US backed Israeli's appalling behaviour over that seventy plus years. So please stop trying to portray the Israelis as wronged innocents. They are not, they are a criminal state with further criminal intent, such as the ongoing theft of much further land, like the West Bank which is part of Jordan who kindly allowed Palestinians to flee there and will be happy for them to have that as the basis for a new state of their own. Israeli theft won't stop there, they obviously have their expansionist sights firmly on Syria, Lebanon, Gaza and beyond. . Tell all that to Oman, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, Kuwait, Jordan, Azerbaijan, and Iraq, all of whom have been showered with explosive missiles by Iran. You justify terrorism. Israel did not steal the land, its people have lived there for thousands of years. That post is just the spouting of hard left America and Jew hating polemicists like Mad Ken Livingston. Pointless balderdash.
March 19Mar 19 Tell all that to Oman, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, Kuwait, Jordan, Azerbaijan, and Iraq, all of whom have been showered with explosive missiles by Iran. You justify terrorism. Israel did not steal the land, its people have lived there for thousands of years. That post is just the spouting of hard left America and Jew hating polemicists like Mad Ken Livingston. Pointless balderdash. indeed, do, and they will say something like this: https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20260319-oman-fm-us-has-lost-control-of-foreign-policy-entered-war-that-is-not-its-own/
March 19Mar 19 I see the massive liar and lunatic Trump is now claiming he had no prior knowledge of the Israeli bombing attack on Kharg Island. The Israelis deny that, and it is inconceivable that Trump was not informed. It was only when Trump and Geobells Hesketh realised what a stupid idea it was that Trump ran away from what he had agreed to. Trump is by far the worst liar in politics anywhere - and that includes Putin - who has devoted his whole life to spreading lies and deception.
March 19Mar 19 indeed, do, and they will say something like this: https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20260319-oman-fm-us-has-lost-control-of-foreign-policy-entered-war-that-is-not-its-own/ Whether or not Trump was deluded into the stupidity of allowing an Israeli attack on gas installations on Kharg Island, is nothing to do with the central question of whether Iran is a dangerous menace to all around it. While it could be said that some of the countries on my list hosted US military bases, around half of them do not and have been grossly attacked, without warning or provocation. Earlier someone suggested that Israel's nuclear weapon would be the equivalent of Iran having one - That is utterly bonkers. Israel's wars are ALWAYS in response to serious and murderous attacks by Islamist killers - for the most part, in recent times, since 1979, Iranian proxies, trained, equipped, funded and encouraged by the regime in Tehran. As for Flecc's suggestion that Israel has designs on Lebanon, Syria and Gaza - only as a means of clearing out terror gangs to the extent that they can nolonger fire Iranian and other rockets into Israel. If Israel was stealing a lot of land, it has made a poor job of it. This map shows Israel to the same scale as Great Britain. This one shows The West Bank and Gaza in blue and Israel proper in grey.
March 19Mar 19 You need to take your medication and to sit in a darkened room. Stay off the psycodelic drugs too. ill blow up the moon then and just think if some hippy came to earth said they was god and told everyone what to do every country would blow him to bits as well. so if i made a anti matter bomb that could wipe out the hole planet im god by default and do as ur told Edited March 19Mar 19 by soundwave
March 19Mar 19 Big Bully Israel. Israel population: 10,100,000 people. Iran Population: 93,000,000 people. Land area: Iran has 8.9 times the population and 80 times the land area of Israel. Below shows occupied territories in response to attacks from Gaza, West Bank and Golan Heights in Syria - Edited March 19Mar 19 by Tony1951
March 19Mar 19 Author Tell all that to Oman, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, Kuwait, Jordan, Azerbaijan, and Iraq, all of whom have been showered with explosive missiles by Iran. You justify terrorism. Israel did not steal the land, its people have lived there for thousands of years. That post is just the spouting of hard left America and Jew hating polemicists like Mad Ken Livingston. Pointless balderdash. Utter nonsense, it's you who are justifying Israeli terrorism, past and present, by lying even to yourself since you well know the truth about the Hebrew move into the long established land of Canaan. It was never the Hebrew's land, they only ever lived there en masse from circa 4000bc, until the Romans as rulers expelled them some 2000 years ago on account of their extremes of disruptive behaviour, in effect causing their own expulsion. .
March 19Mar 19 Author As for Flecc's suggestion that Israel has designs on Lebanon, Syria and Gaza - Carefully omitting Jordan's West Bank where the theft is well known and proven, condemned and ruled against by the UN. .
March 19Mar 19 This gets more hilarious as we go on. Now we have revisionist history claiming that the land now known as Israel was not occupied by Jews since the time of the Romans. Here is a bit of a history lesson fro Flecc who seems to have adopted a Trumpian approach to the facts: https://share.google/aimode/YYTe3HIZVzZNnOkCR But I need to go out now to do a favour for a farmer friend who wants some rabbits shot. He stopped me the other day while I was riding one of my electric bikes and asked me to do something about thinning them out before they breed massively. I went walking this morning to try to observe and film deer again, but I could not find them. Other times I can get quite close. Edited March 19Mar 19 by Tony1951
March 19Mar 19 Carefully omitting Jordan's West Bank where the theft is well known and proven, condemned and ruled against by the UN. . Get your eyes tested. It was shown in blue and in a subsequent map is shown in red and labelled. Israel is a tiny country, which has been continually persecuted and suffered murderous attacks. Edited March 19Mar 19 by Tony1951
March 19Mar 19 Author Get your eyes tested. It was show in blue and in a subsequent map is shown in red and labelled. Omitted from your text of course, as I quoted. .
March 19Mar 19 Whether or not Trump was deluded into the stupidity of allowing an Israeli attack on gas installations on Kharg Island, is nothing to do with the central question of whether Iran is a dangerous menace to all around it. While it could be said that some of the countries on my list hosted US military bases, around half of them do not and have been grossly attacked, without warning or provocation. Earlier someone suggested that Israel's nuclear weapon would be the equivalent of Iran having one - That is utterly bonkers. Israel's wars are ALWAYS in response to serious and murderous attacks by Islamist killers - for the most part, in recent times, since 1979, Iranian proxies, trained, equipped, funded and encouraged by the regime in Tehran. As for Flecc's suggestion that Israel has designs on Lebanon, Syria and Gaza - only as a means of clearing out terror gangs to the extent that they can nolonger fire Iranian and other rockets into Israel. If Israel was stealing a lot of land, it has made a poor job of it. This map shows Israel to the same scale as Great Britain. [ATTACH=full]65657[/ATTACH] This one shows The West Bank and Gaza in blue and Israel proper in grey. [ATTACH=full]65658[/ATTACH] suspect we're not going to see eye to eye on this, as before. it's a too binary dichotomy (israel victim/not). From my point of view you have been comprehensively gaslit. like most of the developed world. until recently. stating the obvious, but killing civilians is always a bad strategy. it never wins wars. there's a reason the entire world, practically, refuse to support this war. a silver lining to it is that it makes the destructive role of the israel/us alliance in the middle east abundantly clear.
March 19Mar 19 Author This gets more hilarious as we go on. Now we have revisionist history claiming that the land now known as Israel was not occupied by Jews since the time of the Romans. Here is a bit of a history lesson fro Flecc who seems to have adopted a Trumpian approach to the facts: https://share.google/aimode/YYTe3HIZVzZNnOkCR Deliberately not quoting what I ACTUALLY posted: "It was never the Hebrew's land, they only ever lived there en masse from circa 4000bc, until the Romans as rulers expelled them some 2000 years ago on account of their extremes of disruptive behaviour, in effect causing their own expulsion." I don't need any history lesson from you with your deliberate distortions. .
March 19Mar 19 suspect we're not going to see eye to eye on this, as before. it's a too binary dichotomy (israel victim/not). From my point of view you have been comprehensively gaslit. like most of the developed world. until recently. stating the obvious, but killing civilians is always a bad strategy. it never wins wars. there's a reason the entire world, practically, refuse to support this war. a silver lining to it is that it makes the destructive role of the israel/us alliance in the middle east abundantly clear. Did you notice at all thst 30 000 civilians were deliberately murdered in February by their own government in Iran? No big outcry then. Big ptoblem thpugh when a very very much smsller number, modtly those inyimstely associated with the lradership and IRGC, are killed in strikes specifically aimed at leadership and IRGC tsrgets and missile factories. Of vourse the difference there id thst 'the Jooos' did it and the wicked Americans.... Edit. A lot of typos.... i am outside waiting for rabbits to come out again.
March 19Mar 19 Deliberately not quoting what I ACTUALLY posted: "It was never the Hebrew's land, they only ever lived there en masse from circa 4000bc, until the Romans as rulers expelled them some 2000 years ago on account of their extremes of disruptive behaviour, in effect causing their own expulsion." I don't need any history lesson from you with your deliberate distortions. . This is Ken Livingston history. I posted the facts earlier with references. https://share.google/aimode/YYTe3HIZVzZNnOkCR It specifically makes clear that though many jews were dispersed, many remained and occupied the land subsequently. Your version is an anti semitic, hardleft shameful piece of revisionism. Pure poison and false. You very muvh DO need s history lesson. Even in 1947, about 630,000 of the population of the whole of Palestine were Jews - about 30% of the whole of population of an area which was larger than the area they ultimately declared as israel. Jews made up 55% of the population of the land actually declared as Israel. Just had two Apache attack helicopters fly over me. Edited March 19Mar 19 by Tony1951
March 19Mar 19 https://www.twz.com/air/usaf-f-35-makes-emergency-landing-after-allegedly-being-hit-by-iranian-fire
March 19Mar 19 Did you notice at all thst 30 000 civilians were deliberately murdered in February by their own government in Iran? No big outcry then. Big ptoblem thpugh when a very very much smsller number, modtly those inyimstely associated with the lradership and IRGC, are killed in strikes specifically aimed at leadership and IRGC tsrgets and missile factories. Of vourse the difference there id thst 'the Jooos' did it and the wicked Americans.... Edit. A lot of typos.... i am outside waiting for rabbits to come out again. [ATTACH type=full" alt="65662]65662[/ATTACH] We're back in binary dichotomy. Nobody (least of all me) condone iran regimes brutal suppression. But Israel killed 75000 civilians in gaza. Nothing justifies murder. And comparing murders is macabre. But, if i were st peter at the pearly gates I'd find Israel killing of civilians in foreign territory marginally more culpable than desperate acts of a regime suppressing an internal threat. Speaking of which, used to plink rabbits (at earlier attavistic time) with 22 weirauch, lethal out to 50m, but only with very clean shot, what do you use?
March 19Mar 19 We're back in binary dichotomy. Nobody (least of all me) condone iran regimes brutal suppression. But Israel killed 75000 civilians in gaza. Nothing justifies murder. And comparing murders is macabre. But, if i were st peter at the pearly gates I'd find Israel killing of civilians in foreign territory marginally more culpable than desperate acts of a regime suppressing an internal threat. Speaking of which, used to plink rabbits (at earlier attavistic time) with 22 weirauch, lethal out to 50m, but only with very clean shot, what do you use? You quote the total likely death toll of the Gaza war without distinguishing between Hamas and others. I regret the civilian deaths in the Gaza war and have often been exasperated at the scale of it. Sensible estimates suggest that between 30,000 and 40,000 were civilian deaths. This is too high for my liking to put it mildly. However, This is an existential war of survival - and to return to the underlying theme here, a war initiated by the actions of the Iranian regime. NONE of those civilians would ever have been killed had HAMAS not invaded northern Israel on 7th October 2023 and murdered, raped and captured a huge number of Israeli civilians and some isolated IDF people. About 2000. What is more, virtually none of those civilians would have been harmed if Hamas had not based itself under and inside their homes, hospitals, schools and markets. This is a well established tactic of theirs. Hezbollah does the same thing, firing rockets from people's backyards and ensuring that retribution causes civilian death. In WW2 we lionised and regarded as heroes, men who flew and crewed Lancaster bombers over Germany to bomb Nazi cities and infrastructure. They killed millions of German civilians in defeating the foul regime and industrial machine which powered it. Should we have held back and lost the war? At the time, many pointed out that the Germans had elected and followed the Nazis and that they worked hard to ensure their outrages were successful. This is true, but rather simplistic. The moral case is more complex perhaps, but teh very same thing is said in Israel about the people in Gaza. They did choose Hmas to lead them and a very large number support them. Are they not also partially responsible even if they do not carry weapons individually and act against Israel? It might be argued that they are as involved as were the German civilian population during WW2 and we bombed them night after night until their cities were rubble and most people believed that this was a necessity and well deserved. There is a horrible dilemma in every war, and some times combatants go beyond what they should do, sometimes because they are unsure who the other combatants are. This is particularly hard when like HAMAS and Hezbollah, the terrorists hide among civilians. I can say without doubt that the current operations in Iran of the total dead, the Americans and Israelis have so far managed to kill a tiny proportion of civilians. The operations are clinical and precise, and have largely taken out guilty men. Some people closely associated with them have also been killed such as family members. How else could the decapitation of the regime have been carried out? On rifles and rabbits - If you change your forum settings (profile I think) I will happily discuss firearms with you, but it is not really a subject for the forum. You can't receive private messages at the moment so I can't answer your question that way, which I would have done. This post has been edited at 20.09 . Edited March 19Mar 19 by Tony1951
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