I've followed this with great interest, as I'd like to electrify my Cannondale. I agree with the school of thought that says battery low down and in the middle is good (as do Kalkhoff, seemingly). Having a bunch of stuff high up at the back is bound to have an adverse effect on handling - even low down it still would (think heavy panniers on a bike compared with nothing - tail wags dog).

 

However, I can't fancy the location that Wisper have come up with as it seems to be exerting far too much leverage on a relatively small area of seat tube, and tubes can break....(bitter experience).

 

Hi Hugh.

 

In theory, your comments about battery location are no doubt correct but my experience, both with and without panniers, is that it makes little perceivable difference to the handling of the bike.

 

Perhaps you as a Cannondale rider are more aware than occasional leisure riders of all the little nuances of bike handling but I'm not aware of those Cytronex owners complaining about any dilution of the bike's handling qualities resulting from the addition of motor and battery. Many of those who choose to ride Cytronex models are experienced in riding sporty bikes so I'm sure if the handling characteristics were adversely affected, we would all have heard about it.

 

Looking around at what's available in the way of kits, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find something better than the Cytronex system for your particular bike and the kit is coming to market shortly, I believe.

 

I stand to be corrected in my view by those members here who own or previously owned Cytronex models but I'm confident that the general consensus will be that Cannondale and Trek models so equipped stack up well against other electric bikes.

 

Regards,

Indalo

Also as for handling and feel, well that may be important for those of us considering the Tour de France or the next local club race meet but for every day commuting or leisure riding it matters not one jot, a rack mount position is perfectly fine and more sensible.

For every day commuting the feel and handling are far more important than cosmetic details, I'd rather the bike is more enjoyable to ride than prettier for pedestrians to look at.

For every day commuting the feel and handling are far more important than cosmetic details, I'd rather the bike is more enjoyable to ride than prettier for pedestrians to look at.

 

Exactly!

 

Just back from test ride 5 (appointment at hospital - 7 mile return) There will be no long term test for the forseeable as I just got out of hospital week before last with a DVT in leg...so only short rides for now

 

All I can say this is a different style of E biking, reading Indalos post above re Cytronex struck a cord and I guess my bike is nearer to that then the generic standard heavier E bike. But it has a bigger battery and does 22mph + Yippee!lol

 

rolled up at hospital and just locked the bike and put battery in my ruck sack, added security and so easy...... I never in 2.5 years did this with other bikes because of the weight and hassle

 

I cannot express how light and enjoyable this bike is to ride...I overtook everyone I came across!

 

I will hazard a guesstimate on range to be about 25-30 miles? (16 stone - unfit - falling to bits) Which will match the range of our forthcoming Bosch KTM nicely by what eTim has said. I will stress that I ride at full power and push on.....so I would think once we get away to Croatia in the summer , more leisurely riding and better power management I should get 35 maybe 40? Again, but this is different then generic e bike where if power off you can still ride the thing.....

 

I carried my heavy lock and cable and me bits in a ruck sack as I have no panniers yet..to be honest it was a very nice way of riding, did not notice weight on back at all

 

Thats it for now folks!

 

P.S. my inbox has been emptied, so please send recent messages again as I have not seen them...

Edited June 10, 201114 yr by eddieo

For every day commuting the feel and handling are far more important than cosmetic details, I'd rather the bike is more enjoyable to ride than prettier for pedestrians to look at.

 

Thanks Andrew, this is why we chose function over form, although as I say if people prefer the more standard look the superb DaaHub Dock mounting system will enable the battery to be mounted at the back off the seat post. Which is so much more sensible and beneficial to riding characteristics than the simple rack mount.

 

I have nothing against rack mounts on lower bikes, 20" wheels etc, but they become ungainly and effect riding quality on 26 and 28' bikes.

 

All the best

 

David

David, many thanks for replying to the points raised in the thread (and also for sending over the diagram) its appreciated. However, the battery mounting still sucks no matter how you dress it up...two years to develop? Surely in that time you could have come up with a second on bike mounting arrangement and not a 'universal' one...Also as for handling and feel, well that may be important for those of us considering the Tour de France or the next local club race meet but for every day commuting or leisure riding it matters not one jot, a rack mount position is perfectly fine and more sensible.

 

So one cheeky question: Do you sell the kit without the battery?

 

Hi NRG, I feel you should maybe try out the DaaHub Dock, mounting system before you condemn it? It is absolutely superb, the battery and mount work so well together it is absolutely amazing, not a rattle to be heard even over rough terrain and so easy to remove and re-install the battery. It was originally designed for seat post rear mounting but with a little bit of engineering initiative we give our customers a choice! A rack mount is more sensible maybe for the manufacturer but the DaaHub Dock is more secure and simply genius, far better for the customer. Although it is a bit rude in the forward position if you have that sort of mind! Here's some ammo for you, instead of the DaaHub Dock you could call it the DaaHub Dick!!

 

Re bike balance and handeling, as Mussels (who is probably the most experienced electric bike rider I know) has already pointed out the ride and feel of an electric bike is massively important to every rider, especially the long distance commuter. And DaaHub has been designed with these people, our customers, in mind.

 

Re your cheeky question, of course you can! But they are the same price!

 

All the best

 

David

Hmm, now there's a tantalising tit bit !!

 

And how Oiseaux! I have 2 on the way to the UK for testing, you simply drop out the 15.5mph wheel from an Alpino or DaaHub and fit the 30mph one, I think we can use the same controller, but it would need to be switched from 15.5 to 30. We can only get a 1 year warranty at the moment but are working on it. The motor will be in anodised red with NOT FOR ROAD USE engraved on the side. The idea is you take your DaaHub to the off road site on your legal wheel and swap it over when you get there for some fun! Obviously range is greatly reduced.

 

We feel there is a new sport in here somewhere?

 

All the best

 

David

LOL! Quite right David I should try it before opening my big mouth DaaHub Dick has a certain ring to it but I wont be in a position to try this out until the end of the year...well if I *must* buy the battery as well I suppose I should

 

Re bike balance I understand and respect all the points raised and agree in frame mounting is best for balance, the Haibike and Storck Raddar are two production bike examples I can think of that exemplify how it should be done, IMHO the in frame mounting of the Daahub gets it wrong, sorry but thats how I feel.

 

I still like rack mounting for the reasons I gave earlier, I don't think I'm that sensitive to handling and have no issues with it on my Alien or Peugeot...me thinks there is a little bit too much 'purism' getting in the way of practical implementation... I have a sneaky feeling that if I felt the same way I'd question mounting the motor in the front wheel and perhaps never look at a hub drive again and stick to crank drive

 

Anyhow, time to move on...

 

 

Hi NRG, I feel you should maybe try out the DaaHub Dock, mounting system before you condemn it? It is absolutely superb, the battery and mount work so well together it is absolutely amazing, not a rattle to be heard even over rough terrain and so easy to remove and re-install the battery. It was originally designed for seat post rear mounting but with a little bit of engineering initiative we give our customers a choice! A rack mount is more sensible maybe for the manufacturer but the DaaHub Dock is more secure and simply genius, far better for the customer. Although it is a bit rude in the forward position if you have that sort of mind! Here's some ammo for you, instead of the DaaHub Dock you could call it the DaaHub Dick!!

 

Re bike balance and handeling, as Mussels (who is probably the most experienced electric bike rider I know) has already pointed out the ride and feel of an electric bike is massively important to every rider, especially the long distance commuter. And DaaHub has been designed with these people, our customers, in mind.

 

Re your cheeky question, of course you can! But they are the same price!

 

All the best

 

David

One of the biggest contributors to the way my bike handles is the front hub itself - it is so much slower when turning L and R. The DaaHub is lighter so better in that respect.

 

Now for the off-road hub - count me in, I want one. Will it work OK in a 20" wheel ref speed?

.........

 

We feel there is a new sport in here somewhere?

 

All the best

 

David

 

I think carrying the off road wheel while riding on the road will definitely be a new sport and a very exciting one at that !! Can't you just forget the red signage and rely on peoples integrity and common sense for which e bike riders are renowned !!

...me thinks there is a little bit too much 'purism' getting in the way of practical implementation... I have a sneaky feeling that if I felt the same way I'd question mounting the motor in the front wheel and perhaps never look at a hub drive again and stick to crank drive

A good crank drive kit would be great but I'm not sure that exists yet, to me the hub kit's simplicity and reliability makes it my favorite. For me crank drives have a major conflict between keeping it fairly legal and not compromising the gears for people who want to pedal faster.

Exactly!

 

 

 

But it has a bigger battery and does 22mph + Yippee!lol

 

 

I will hazard a guesstimate on range to be about 25-30 miles? (16 stone - unfit - falling to bits) Which will match the range of our forthcoming Bosch KTM nicely by what eTim has said. I will stress that I ride at full power and push on.....so I would think once we get away to Croatia in the summer , more leisurely riding and better power management I should get 35 maybe 40?

 

 

Does the Phallus bike do 22mph assisted?

 

If it does 22mph assisted then it will be faster than the Bosch KTM, I wish I had a bigger, more powerful, faster Phallus !

 

The idea is you take your DaaHub to the off road site on your legal wheel and swap it over when you get there for some fun! Obviously range is greatly reduced.

 

We feel there is a new sport in here somewhere?

 

You could have a simple tag-along fork like a simplified tag along kids bike to tow the performance wheel to the off-road site. (If it's got no drag of course. )

Does the Phallus bike do 22mph assisted?

 

If it does 22mph assisted then it will be faster than the Bosch KTM, I wish I had a bigger, more powerful, faster Phallus !

 

I think the point is that eddieo's new bike looks like it has a big phallus mounted on it......

I wish I had a bigger, more powerful, faster Phallus !

 

Hmm....I know what you mean

Whats new? I thought all our 'big boys toys' were extensions of our batteries :)

I think the point is that eddieo's new bike looks like it has a big phallus mounted on it......

 

Is that with Eddie on or off the bike!! ;)

 

Sorry Eddie!!!! :o

 

Best regards

 

David

 

For me crank drives have a major conflict between keeping it fairly legal and not compromising the gears for people who want to pedal faster.

 

There is an answer to that, which with more crank drives might be twigged by a manufacturer. It merely needs the gearchanger having a cut-out like a brake cut-out, but operating on the top or top two gears.

 

That would give power assist to the legal limit but with a gear or two of pedalling speed above that for extra pure cycling speed.

Cheeky Monkeys:p

 

ride no 6 (the sun came out)

 

I guess I will have to learn to manage my battery use more efficiently, probably like a lot of you are used to already......A different mind set

 

Bike progresses nicely on power setting 3 (max 5) in fact I think maybe power 2 will be enough for when we are touring around on holiday or if I am out purely exercising. but on full power the bike is Sooo much fun!

 

This is ebiking as I always envisaged it...But if it was not for the motorhoming and carrying/travelling aspect, I think I might have stayed with bigger battery bikes like the 906. The 906 is like a limousine, a comfortable beauty with a big fuel tank (Big Bazookas probably to NRG:D)

 

I will get better at battery management, it is I guess what a lot of you have to do with smaller batteries anyway.....I will just learn to manage my riding more efficiently/economically. That is the beauty of larger wisper bikes you don't have to THINK, oodles of power on tap.....In 2.5 years use I never ran out once

 

If I run out of power with this bike it is no big deal as I can still ride it home. It is so surprising how different an experience this bike is.....

Edited June 10, 201114 yr by eddieo

There is an answer to that, which with more crank drives might be twigged by a manufacturer. It merely needs the gearchanger having a cut-out like a brake cut-out, but operating on the top or top two gears.

 

That would give power assist to the legal limit but with a gear or two of pedalling speed above that for extra pure cycling speed.

 

Interesting Flecc......and could that be done retrospectively by someone who knows what they are doing....like you for example ?

 

Lynda

Easiest with a hub gear bike with twistgrip gear change Lynda. The hub gear sprocket is most easily changed to a much smaller one to increase the gearing for speed, and a cutout microswitch could be arranged to operate in the gear indicator window showing the gear in use.

 

Best done commercially of course, and there would have to be equivalent trigger gearshift cut-out controls since they are more popular than the twistgrip type.

Thanks Flecc......in my ongoing search for the perfect bike I now know that I must have hub gears......so far I have decided that I wont compromise on hub gears, range or bike weight......and I do love the panasonic system, but the Tonaro Esprit is tempting if the weight of the new models is lower, cos then I can have my throttle as well !!

Lynda

But Lynda have you tried XT gears? they are sooooooo nice.....

 

My new KTM bike had 8 speed hub gears, crank drive and is approx 20kg (bought with wife in mind)

 

Dont know what poor old NRG will make of it though, with its red nosed seat........ enough to bring on a seizure me finks! poor man seeing nobs everywhere!

 

cos then I can have my throttle as well !!

Lynda

 

Seems a bit masochistic to me, wanting to be throttled.

For gods sake eddieo....please dont tell me your next bike has a red nob on the end of it ????

And you try to say I am obsessed :)

 

( NOT as obsessed as eddieo) Lynda

Seems a bit masochistic to me, wanting to be throttled.

 

Oh haha.......HAVE ...not WANT TO BE......

Honestly you men now seem to have me down as a' gangly bits' obsessed masochist......and all I do is quietly ride my little bike around (naked of course ) ROFLMAO !

 

Lynda