Could someone please explain to me why so few people in our great country build their own ebikes. We once lead the world in engineering, but that was sadly a long time ago! Our friends in the USA, Australia, Canada, Germany etc. have left us far behind. We just buy the off the peg offerings, and moan about them at length. Go on the endless-sphere forum and see what they are doing.
Could someone please explain
- Thread starter Grizzly Bear
- Start date
Might be a lack of space. Our little island is jam-packed with tiny houses and not-so-tiny people, and the luxury of a decent workshop at home is probably quite rare.
I know there are other reasons, but this is probably not the place to elaborate too much.
Rog.
yeah I think it's the other reasons too, we have turned into a nation of pen pushers with no hand skills! so sad!!!
Grizzly Bear
Yes it is noticeable that the counties that you mentioned do seem to have more DIY bike builders, at least when you look at the endless-sphere forum. But there are a few on this site that build their own or at least put conversion kits on existing bikes.
There are certainly a lot of knowledgeable members on the Pedelecs forum; but as you have mentioned, we in the UK appear to prefer the readymade option. My feeling is that this country has undervalued its engineers, and looked towards money men and bankers, instead.
I would like to do more but at the moment I have no decent workshop facilities. I have a couple of bikes I’ve done myself one with a Bafang hub motor. The other I am just rebuilding is a chain drive system in a FS frame. Like you have done the batteries are going in the frame triangle. I really like the look of your battery box designs; I am working on fibreglass box for the Headway/PSI cells, but I am still waiting for a delivery from China.
Yes it is noticeable that the counties that you mentioned do seem to have more DIY bike builders, at least when you look at the endless-sphere forum. But there are a few on this site that build their own or at least put conversion kits on existing bikes.
There are certainly a lot of knowledgeable members on the Pedelecs forum; but as you have mentioned, we in the UK appear to prefer the readymade option. My feeling is that this country has undervalued its engineers, and looked towards money men and bankers, instead.
I would like to do more but at the moment I have no decent workshop facilities. I have a couple of bikes I’ve done myself one with a Bafang hub motor. The other I am just rebuilding is a chain drive system in a FS frame. Like you have done the batteries are going in the frame triangle. I really like the look of your battery box designs; I am working on fibreglass box for the Headway/PSI cells, but I am still waiting for a delivery from China.
Hi vhfman
I am so glad someone else is having a go, any advice you want just PM me.
I know I'm going to get slated for my comments, but I truely believe in what I'm saying.
Griz
I am so glad someone else is having a go, any advice you want just PM me.
I know I'm going to get slated for my comments, but I truely believe in what I'm saying.
Griz
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in our country engineering skills aren't valued as much amongst younger people like they once were. (I'm still in my 30s and most of my friends are that age or in their 20s).
Amongst so-called "middle class" youths its often seen as "chavvy" to be something like a mechanic (bike, car or motorbike) and below them. its viewed as "working class lads stuff..." Amongst all social classes its seen as "geeky/nerdy/boring" to get too involved in research/experimentation or any form of medium/long term study as opposed to just bodging together something that works. Thats for "old boffins". so many who do have mechanical or practical skills do not develop or expand them.
And those who don't care about being viewed as geeks/nerds want to work on things like web design and software development. (I know loads of youths who can do wonderful stuff with a PC but struggle with the concept of soldering irons or even basic electricity
)Also younger people these days by the time they get to their 20s are often juggling jobs with looking after multiple kids - and not always part of a two parent family so don't have time for "hobbies" as much or the cash to spend on ebike components.. plus building an entire ebike or even working on a normal one isn't as much instant gratification as doing something on a computer, especially when it involved waiting for parts from foreign lands etc, doing maths and pre-planning to work out what you need etc...
to be fair I think many older people do DIY stuff here but on the foreign sites there are loads of people in their 30s well as Europeans, Asians and Americans don't have the same prejudices...
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ALEX
I'm really worried about our country, we don't make anything anymore, where's the money coming from? The bubble will burst, and soon I think. I work for one of the last engineering companies in my area, and we are struggling!! We have lost all the skills because they have not been passed on, the old guys are dying off, and taking them with them to the grave!!
Griz
I'm really worried about our country, we don't make anything anymore, where's the money coming from? The bubble will burst, and soon I think. I work for one of the last engineering companies in my area, and we are struggling!! We have lost all the skills because they have not been passed on, the old guys are dying off, and taking them with them to the grave!!
Griz
I think that the culture in Britain has changed so much since the WWII when there was more of attitude of ‘make do and mend’, let's have a go we can do that. As you say hand skills or practical skills seem to be regarded with less importance than the ability to know the latest marketing or sales jargon. Not sure that ‘pen pusher’ are very 21st century, computers have done away with pens.
As you may see from my handle, one of my other hobbies is amateur radio. Over the years that has changed from the days I first started in the 60’s 70’s, when the equipment in the main had to be built by hand, with a reasonable understanding of radio and electronics, to the position now, where most are no more than operators and know little of what goes on in the shiny black box with buttons and displays.
There is an attitude now where it is deemed good to be a user rather than a doer. The TV programs like Top Gear where it's fronted by jokey journalists who whenever they attempt to do anything practical it's turned into a lack of skills laugh. When they did a program competing against the German presenters, there was a distinct feeling that the Germans thought the Brits were like naughty school boys.
Where does Britain make it's money. Banking and making up numbers!
As you may see from my handle, one of my other hobbies is amateur radio. Over the years that has changed from the days I first started in the 60’s 70’s, when the equipment in the main had to be built by hand, with a reasonable understanding of radio and electronics, to the position now, where most are no more than operators and know little of what goes on in the shiny black box with buttons and displays.
There is an attitude now where it is deemed good to be a user rather than a doer. The TV programs like Top Gear where it's fronted by jokey journalists who whenever they attempt to do anything practical it's turned into a lack of skills laugh. When they did a program competing against the German presenters, there was a distinct feeling that the Germans thought the Brits were like naughty school boys.
Where does Britain make it's money. Banking and making up numbers!
I fear it's too late, I have skills that I will take with me, the best one is doing the best job you can, you will be respected for it. I respect people who do their best.
I bought a ready made electric bike. I could have designed and built my own controller and even wound my own motor but I don't see the point in reinventing the wheel, I have a busy life and do enough problem solving and solution finding at work to keep me happy.
I want to enjoy my electric bike so I'm restricting the work I do to jobs that take less than half an hour each, otherwise it will become a bind. Someone else can do the trial and error stuff.
There have been some very clever people on this forum whose electronics knowledge is much better than mine, often you won't notice until you ask a difficult question. It's not all moaning about poor service.
I want to enjoy my electric bike so I'm restricting the work I do to jobs that take less than half an hour each, otherwise it will become a bind. Someone else can do the trial and error stuff.
There have been some very clever people on this forum whose electronics knowledge is much better than mine, often you won't notice until you ask a difficult question. It's not all moaning about poor service.
I'm talking hand skills, we've lost them mate! I'm sure anything can be done on paper, I'm not having a pop. I just feel us proper engineers are unaprieciated, Brunel must be turning in his grave!
Griz
Griz
Griz:
I was about to launch into a protracted rant about the reasons for the decline in manufacturing in Britain, particularly in precision engineering, until I noticed the time, so I will just say this.
In my tiny workshop stands an old 4.5" Boxford centre lathe. This machine was rescued when the Dorcan Skill Centre in Swindon was closed down many years ago, and is still empty to this day.
My personal tribute to the last generation of Swindon youngsters who would learn the skill of machining metal, was to leave the thick layer of chewing-gum attached to the underside of the suds tray in place.
All the best Griz
Bob
I was about to launch into a protracted rant about the reasons for the decline in manufacturing in Britain, particularly in precision engineering, until I noticed the time, so I will just say this.
In my tiny workshop stands an old 4.5" Boxford centre lathe. This machine was rescued when the Dorcan Skill Centre in Swindon was closed down many years ago, and is still empty to this day.
My personal tribute to the last generation of Swindon youngsters who would learn the skill of machining metal, was to leave the thick layer of chewing-gum attached to the underside of the suds tray in place.
All the best Griz
Bob
I wouldn't say they are totally lost as I know a fair few young people working in construction and engineering or with such interests, but the street culture is such they have to treat it as a "guilty pleasure" amongst their peers. but those lads (and girls too!) are there. Many things are still made in Britain, particularly in East Anglia. OK not high tech things like cameras and computers or even bicycles but stuff is still being made in places like Thetford, Sudbury, Haverhill, Stowmarket etc.
As long as books, libraries, small workshops and curious people are around skills can be relearned and new ones added.
What has been lost in Britain is a sense of pride in work, doing a decent job, working as part of a team, bringing projects through to completion within resource constraints, solving problems and keeping the client/customer satisfied.
That goes for the money men and office staff as well. if the bankers were that bloody good we wouldn't be in a economic depression, even the sportspeople youths look up to are rubbish (consider our abysmal efforts at football recently!)
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Absolutely agree with you Griz, the engineering skills I learnt many decades ago have hardly been taught in many years now, of course in so many mechanical fields only parts changers are necessary now so the need has greatly reduced.
As others have mentioned though, facilities in our crowded and expensive housing country are often lacking, and that has somewhat restricted my activities for some while.
At 74 I'm not too worried about the future though, I'm leaving others to worry about that.
.
As others have mentioned though, facilities in our crowded and expensive housing country are often lacking, and that has somewhat restricted my activities for some while.
At 74 I'm not too worried about the future though, I'm leaving others to worry about that.
.
Would that be China tea or Indian? Where is the English tea leaf? (NO,no, no - not the rhyming slang version). We have to import the leaves because we are incapable of making them ourselves in this country.... but we can still make a good cup of tea
Colin
No your right, there are more English "tea leafs" than English Engineers, hence the huge growth of the security industry!
Thank God it's Saturday, and I've got a bike to build, now where did I put my big bastard file?
Griz
I'm not an engineer but I have slowly migrated from bench fitting to electronics to computers, I could have done something myself but I have a young family and don't have the time. The only people with the time and space to do it are usually 50+ as they have more expensive houses and the kids have gone.
I have a nice size workshop now but need to wait until the kids don't need constant attention, even then I'd probably not attempt what you have done unless it fulfills a specific need that I can't get elsewhere.
Brunel had the innovation, he didn't do the donkey work.
I was born in 1972, and taught a fair few practical skills (which I still use to this day) by my late father. He was Chinese, not unlike a certain Mr Ching in his demeanour (hardly surprising as they both came from Malaya and were born in the same era)
For younger people (below 50) time and in many cases family is an issue. Either the kids they've produced, or a lack of "proper" family structures!
But even though my Mum and Dad stayed together for all of his life, he stopped doing as much carpentry and building stuff by hand when he moved out of London and took a better job in the petrochemical industry so he could support me and my sister. As he grew older, he also did less DIY service on his cars and got the garage to do it (despite being a motoring enthusiast for decades)
I could build an e-bike but also do not have the time, plus my Wisper is just right. Any "moans" were to do with minor issues that the company made sure were put right very quickly.
BTW in East Anglia smaller manufacturing businesses are faring better than the service industry through the recession...
Round here there are lots of smaller family run businesses, operating in niche markets or things which are too bulky to be sent over from foreign lands cost effectively (especially with transport costs increasing).
there is a company up North which blends tea from Asia, and the Chinese buy a lot of it!
TBH I would not be surprised if first final assembly and later parts manufacture of bicycles returns to the UK in my lifetime. Transport costs are increasing, as are labour costs in China along with lead times.
(hardly surprising as they both came from Malaya and were born in the same era)For younger people (below 50) time and in many cases family is an issue. Either the kids they've produced, or a lack of "proper" family structures!
But even though my Mum and Dad stayed together for all of his life, he stopped doing as much carpentry and building stuff by hand when he moved out of London and took a better job in the petrochemical industry so he could support me and my sister. As he grew older, he also did less DIY service on his cars and got the garage to do it (despite being a motoring enthusiast for decades)
I could build an e-bike but also do not have the time, plus my Wisper is just right. Any "moans" were to do with minor issues that the company made sure were put right very quickly.
BTW in East Anglia smaller manufacturing businesses are faring better than the service industry through the recession...
Firms cautious over recovery prospects - Business - East Anglian Daily Times
Round here there are lots of smaller family run businesses, operating in niche markets or things which are too bulky to be sent over from foreign lands cost effectively (especially with transport costs increasing).
there is a company up North which blends tea from Asia, and the Chinese buy a lot of it!
TBH I would not be surprised if first final assembly and later parts manufacture of bicycles returns to the UK in my lifetime. Transport costs are increasing, as are labour costs in China along with lead times.
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