i guess this is a different crank drive

[Psycosis]

I was looking up a prettier less obvious pedal assistance metod and came across this. Its a good concept and avoids having too much stuff over the wheels, plus the weight increase isn't huge either.

Gruber Antrieb - Gruber Assist - Fahrradantriebe » retrofit

Does anyone have an idea on pricing for this?

 

[MAB]

Does anyone have an idea on pricing for this?

£1800

ElectricMountainBikes.com: FOREST GLIDER

Hope this helps?

Mike.

 

[Psycosis]

Well that rules that out

What about this crazy thing
PiCycle - Pimobility

 

[flecc]

If you do a forum search for gruber assist you'll see many posts about this previously.

The Picycle also had a thread some while ago which you can read on this link.
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[Psycosis]

Why can't more bikes have the battery hidden in the frame and not cost £2000+
I know this was done on a load of Chinese bikes a while back, but it seems to have falled by the wayside.
I want a hidden battery but don't have the wedge for an optibike or a gracie bike. Any idea for something that doesn't look rubbish and that isn't too expensive.

 

[Fordulike]

Check out the voice over on the video in the technology section.
Makes me wanna go for a smoke and a pancake
Wonder if they fix washing machines too!!!

 

[flecc]

Why can't more bikes have the battery hidden in the frame and not cost £2000+
I know this was done on a load of Chinese bikes a while back, but it seems to have falled by the wayside.

Not the advantage that it might superficially seem with a bike frame.

First a battery can't so readily be taken out and charged separately while still using the bike, second the battery cannot be swapped out on the road for more range. The only way round those is with some sort of large monocoque frame where a battery box can be slotted in and out quickly, but then it no longer looks like a normal bike so defeats the purpose. Even then a fixed space housing means that battery advances needing a slightly different size, taller for example, are ruled out.

Personally I can never understand the objection to batteries showing, I'm not ashamed to ride an e-bike and a separate battery is so much more convenient.
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[simonbarnett]

Personally I can never understand the objection to batteries showing, I'm not ashamed to ride an e-bike and a separate battery is so much more convenient.
.[/QUOTE]

I'm not ashamed of showing the battery in principle, but I do think they're ugly in themselves (more so the big Wisper/Ezee ones than the Panasonics). Also, they either lengthen the wheelbse or put weight on the rack. I just like the look of "normal" bikes better.

There are some expensive "battery hidden in frame" solutions like the Koga Myata Tesla and the Sparta Ion and I think izip have some cheaper ones with odd styling.

But to my eye there's nothing to match the beauty of the Cytronex system, light and discrete and starting at around £1400. It wasn't around when i started on ebikes, but was a serious temptation when I changed bikes a year ago. Doubts on range and power swung it back to the ProConnect but I@d still be tempted, especially if those were improved.

 

[flecc]

I'm not ashamed of showing the battery in principle, but I do think they're ugly in themselves (more so the big Wisper/Ezee ones than the Panasonics). Also, they either lengthen the wheelbse or put weight on the rack. I just like the look of "normal" bikes better.

I think it's mainly a matter of what one is used to, the battery showing doesn't look like a normal bike, but I don't see why it should since e-bikes are not normal bikes. I don't find a battery any more ugly than a petrol tank on a motorbike for example.

In fact the wheelbase is barely lengthened on many designs, some tweaks to the frame geometry seeing to that. They just appear longer. It was about a extra inch on my eZee Torq 1 and Giant Lafree, compared to the Ridgeback and Marin bikes I had been using previously. Having said that, I don't know why more e-bike makers don't put the battery in the frame triangle's wasted space, BionX and Izip have done that successfully in the past.
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[rosjen]

I think it is good idea and one that can be replicated using a more powerful cyclone crank motor under the seat. A machine shop could make an extended motor crank shaft and modified pedal crank shaft with the gears. Doesn't seem too hard and would cost a lot less than £1800 - but more demand would see this product come down in price. Personally I think they have a winner here and this could be the future of e-bikes. If the space is an issue for power e-bike makers just have to increase the tube size.

Personally, I think people want cycle bikes to look like cycle bikes - the sooner e-bikes stop looking like battery carriers with large hubs the sooner will we see people leaving their cars at home - Like it or not, there is a stigma attached and non e-bikers think it is nerdy.

 

[Bigbee]

Why can't more bikes have the battery hidden in the frame and not cost £2000+
I know this was done on a load of Chinese bikes a while back, but it seems to have falled by the wayside.
I want a hidden battery but don't have the wedge for an optibike or a gracie bike. Any idea for something that doesn't look rubbish and that isn't too expensive.

We have an electric bike with the battery built into the frame.Its got Dapu (ush) motor and electronics.Its in style of a mens 26 inch road bike. Im waiting for a new battery for it ,the bike will be around £600. You're not far from us,I can send you photos next week if you like?

 

[lemmy]

Like it or not, there is a stigma attached and non e-bikers think it is nerdy.

If non e-bikers think think e-bikes are nerdy (and I don't see much more than occasional evidence of that) then **** them.

Personally I am in a difficult position since I have both an e-bike and a non-bike.

Last night my non e-biker self got up, went into my shed and vandalized my e-bike. Now my e-biker self is not speaking to my non e-biker self and refusing to ride my non e-bike in protest.

This morning I had to drive to the paper shop. Very annoying.

Seriously, I cannot imagine what it must be like to have one's choice of transport dictated by what other people think. Who cares?

 

[flecc]

Personally, I think people want cycle bikes to look like cycle bikes - the sooner e-bikes stop looking like battery carriers with large hubs the sooner will we see people leaving their cars at home - Like it or not, there is a stigma attached and non e-bikers think it is nerdy.

I don't agree at all on this. Car drivers will mostly not be in the slightest concerned about whether an e-bike looks like an ordinary bike or not, many of them will not even appreciate the difference. Non e-bikers don't think it's nerdy, cyclists are a tiny proportion of the population and only a small proportion of that tiny minority will think e-biking nerdy.

Over the last thirty years the concerns about traffic danger have led many and now most parents to prevent their children cycling, and since cycling usually begins around ten years old, as many as half the car drivers on the road will never have cycled in their lives and have no appreciation of what makes a bike.

As I've so often noticed, cyclists frequently seem to have an exaggerated idea of the prevalence and importance of cycling in Britain and think their knowledge of bikes and cycling is common. In fact cycling is a tiny minority activity overall which in some areas is not far short of invisible.
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[eddieo]

while out for a ride yesterday I saw about 12 kids undergoing bike instruction with a teacher fore and aft.......there is hope

I would prefer a more conventional and lighter e bike, but more then happy enough with the wisper until something new arrives. That will probably be a wisper as well

 

[simonbarnett]

while out for a ride yesterday I saw about 12 kids undergoing bike instruction with a teacher fore and aft.......there is hope

I would prefer a more conventional and lighter e bike, but more then happy enough with the wisper until something new arrives. That will probably be a wisper as well

I went to see ETS in Camden today for the trike- see other thread.

But I took the opportunity to try the Wisper Alpino. Great build quality, comfortable and nice discrete controller . Rides well but felt to me surprisingly underpowered- could easily take that 500w motor they decided against allowing .

Also tried the A2B for a laugh. Felt weird sitting up high on top of it and it really doesn't encourage pedalling. It's a bit noisy and the "off road" switch needs to be kept pressed with the throttle wide open- all a bit awkward. Power's strong in that mode.

They had very neat conversion kits using the Bafang 8FUN which they call Sparticle and fit for you at £750. Drawback is its only a 24v battery but seemed quiet and reasonbly powerful.

I did spot an Izip folder with battery in frame for relevance to this thread

 

[flecc]

But I took the opportunity to try the Wisper Alpino. Great build quality, comfortable and nice discrete controller . Rides well but felt to me surprisingly underpowered

You're the third person I've seen to say this about the low power, seems it's not at the Suzhou Bafang level in this respect.
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[HarryB]

You're the third person I've seen to say this about the low power, seems it's not at the Suzhou Bafang level in this respect.
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I am one who was surprised at the lack of power - just above tongxin levels say 450 watts peak I think, though I have no technical details to back that up. David is upping the controller so that should help.

Eddieo - I have my Emotion Sports Max now and it is highly recommended. Great bike and I will try to do some pictures/write up soon. The looks and quality feels in a different league to the Wispers I think or it could be it just suits me better (it is a very different bike).

 

[simonbarnett]

I am one who was surprised at the lack of power - just above tongxin levels say 450 watts peak I think, though I have no technical details to back that up. David is upping the controller so that should help.
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I was interested because I'd never tried a hub powered bike. As the Wisper has so many fans here, I thought it would be the most interesting to try. It wasn't weak but a lot less than I expected and, to my surprise, less than the A2B. I'm heavy, but then so are others (including David ) and the A2B did better for power. Maybe it's the new motor, but it'd be a surprise for them to have gone backwards .

I think it would take more to tempt me away from the ProConnnect. Now where did David hide those 500w motors ?

 

[eddieo]

there is only so much that can be done within the 250 watt legal restraint...People aren't daft and would not be buying the Alpino if it was that weak a performer. Mussels seems happy enough with his.

If you want to go for a more powerful illegal bikes fair enough but you have to compare like with like. Jumping of an illegal bike onto a legal one is obviously going to be a bit disappointing.

My wisper with SB motor moves my 16 stone along well enough! so happy to stay within the law

 

[flecc]

Simon's bike has a 250 watt motor rated at 400 watts peak and Harry compares to the 250 watt Tongxin at a bit over 400 watts peak so the comparisons were valid, they weren't against illegal bikes. The 905 series has over 500 watts peak from it's SB motor so it seems the Dapush has less. Maybe the new controller promised will correct that.
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