Kalkhoff Pro Connect Allround info needed battery and mode of operation

[NeilP]

Ah it is a clear resin..that is where I was getting confused. I could not see the resin in the pic, thought that was a bare board...double damn

 

[NeilP]

Here is the bar controller for it.
Appears to be sealed unit, tried gentle prying but it seems glued or screwed, screws must be hidden. Anyone know?

The mode button does not seem to work so wanted to open it up.

But did wonder if maybe mode selection becomes auto disabled when battery indicator becomes low, sort of limp home, preventing high power with low pack.
Anyone any ideas?

 

[NeilP]

If anyone had a working battery for one of these, could they maybe tell me if the middle pin shows a voltage on it. Maybe a control voltage dependant on battery charge state? I could simulate this for now without proper battery and see what state of charger indicator shows if I try that

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I seem to remember discussing this about 18 months ago, when a guy successfully either re-celled his battery or used an alternative. I searched, but I can't find the thread. Flecc has a good memory for these things. Maybe he can point you at it from this reminder.

 

[NeilP]

I have been looking locally but have not seen any similar around my local area. Going to England today, Oxford, so will try and get in to the e bike store there, i know they do packs and know about re packing etc

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I found this thread that has the connector details, but it's not the one I was thinking of:
http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/13060-where-can-i-buy-panasonic-bosch-batteries.html

 

[flecc]

I seem to remember discussing this about 18 months ago, when a guy successfully either re-celled his battery or used an alternative. I searched, but I can't find the thread. Flecc has a good memory for these things. Maybe he can point you at it from this reminder.

Member Orraman posted his successful use of a Cyclone battery on his Panasonic unit, and that's the only thread I know of like this. He reported using just the front and rear platform connectors for the positive and negative connections, leaving the central meter connection for the handlebar unit unused.

Otherwise I only know of this clarification thread I posted on all the connection information gathered together. This thread needs to be read through to post 16 to get all the information concerning other users involved.
.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Thanks Flecc. That was the one I was thinking of. It's surprising that no one's taken this further.

 

[50 Hertz]

Thanks Flecc. That was the one I was thinking of. It's surprising that no one's taken this further.

I don't think it's worth it. My original 10Ah Panasonic battery is almost five years old and it still performs perfectly adequately on my 20 mile round trip commute. It would probably be good for 30 miles. I don't know how much longer it will last, but the signs are encouraging.

Given the longevity of the original battery and the price that they can be obtained from German retailers, I think it makes sense to stick with the battery pack designed for the job. The savings yielded by a gaffer tape, cable tie, old duffle bag plonked on a bike rack, lash up don't make it worth spoiling the look of the bike. The neat Panasonic motor / battery integration is something worth preserving for a modest additional outlay. Especially when spread out over 5+ years.

 

[NeilP]

If I had a pack I would simply re pack with LiPo but I do not even have an original pack, and as you say not worth a naff gaffer tape job hanging off the back of the frame.

but also for a bike that is that slow it is not worth spending £500 on a battery pack for it. That will almost buy another 84 volt 20Ah LiPo pack for my main bike.



But going back to my post no.22 further back. Anyone got any info on the handle bar controller unit pictured. It has sustained visible surface damage before I got the bike, so that may be an issue. But running at first 24 volt and then ramping up to 44, I could only ever get the middle Assist Level lamp to be lit. All three flash on when "ON" pressed, but after that it stays set at the middle level..and pressing the mode button achieves nothing.
I had hoped to open the unit, but it seems to be a sealed unit. Any insight in to this?

 

[flecc]

I doubt if there will be any info on this Neil, that total sealing is typical with Panasonic. They even fully encapsulate their charger circuits.

 

[NeilP]

Guess I'll have to go in destructively to see if the mode switch needs cleaning.

But surely someone can answer the question of how the mode button works? does it become disabled when the charge state wire is not connected?
Knowing that will determine if I need to ope the unit because the mode button is not working, or if this is normal behaviour when power is applied with no charge state wire.

 

[50 Hertz]

Guess I'll have to go in destructively to see if the mode switch needs cleaning.

But surely someone can answer the question of how the mode button works? does it become disabled when the charge state wire is not connected?
Knowing that will determine if I need to ope the unit because the mode button is not working, or if this is normal behaviour when power is applied with no charge state wire.

Where do you live? Surely the easiest thing to do would be to put a Panasonic pack on the bike and see what does and what doesn't work? You can borrow my battery if you are close by.

Batteries are available from about £240 here. The 8 Ah should be good for about 25 to 30 miles and the higher capacity 16 Ah are available for around £380.

If the motor works, you potentially have a nice bike. I really like that older motor, the power phases down in a very subtle way. So subtle you can't tell where the cut off point is. It makes for a very natural ride.

By altering the size of the rear sprocket, you can adjust the assist cut off speed.

 

[NeilP]

Oh, that is a lot cheaper than I found.

I am in jersey, and have not seen any others about. I am on the lookout though.

I do go up to UK a few times a week..Oxford, Southampton or Biggin Hill generally. maybe borrowing a battery if any one was near these airport locations and could lend me one for a few days or week or so. I fly the jersey Air Ambulance, so never know when and where I am going to get a flight.

Thanks for the link

 

[flecc]

I think the mode button will work without third battery connection. In reference to the link I gave earlier, if it didn't I'm sure Orraman would have reported that, given how thoroughly he covered all the other details here. Both of his 26 volt Panasonic unit bikes (Technium and Gitane) have switched power modes. Since he rode a number of times with the Cyclone battery on the Gitane, it's unlikely that he would not have switched the power mode at some time.

 

[Robint]

Thanx for great info, I wont be hacking my K
but I do hate that torque cadence effect when climbing a sharp hill say 1:10 and having to turn a corning (into pub car park)
I just wish I had a button bypass that would apply full power for that short spurt
I wonder is there a way to trick the torque sensor into giving max assist?

Cheers

Robin

 

[flecc]

If you have the Panasonic power unit, I'm afraid not Robin. The "walk-alongside" optional low speed throttle also suffers from this lack of power with the torque sensor not in play. The only way to get maximum power is to apply maximum pedal pressure.

If it were possible to to dynamically access the current states of the split coil pedelec sensor as torque was applied to the amorphous alloy torque sleeve, it would be possible to build a simulation circuit to mimic the full power signal. However, with no access to do that short of butchering a unit, it's not practical.
.

 

[Robint]

"*&&*^^&%$^%^%£^" These guys thought of everything

Cheers

Robin