Lets Talk Thottles

jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
Ok on my current EBrompton build I have a large thumb throttle which came with the kit.



It was fine to get me started, but its big bulky and has a power and battery inidcator lights that I don't need. Because of this it takes up too much room on the small Brompton handle bars. Also are thumb/grip throttles dual i.e. left or right or do you have to buy different ones depending on what side of the handle bar you want to mount them ?

The other problem is that the power only really kicks in at 80%. In short I need to change it.

To be honest I love the control on the Cytronex where you push one button to start assistance and a second button that gives you high and low power. No holding thumb throttles or twisting throttle grips with the resultant strain that gives if done for long periods. That said I would then also need to fit a brake with a cutout to kill power. The Brompton brakes are are riverted on so I would need to drill out the rivet to remove one. I may have to do that anyway to make room for a thumb throttle we will see.

So my options are :

1. Basic thumb throttle

2. Half grip throttle ?

3. Full grip throttle ?

I guess pedelec might be an option but I think I want either the Cytronex or one of the three options above. So comments from people on the use of the above would be good. Also I want to make sure that it has a varied control through the whole movement. Looking round some are labelled Halls Effect where as my Tongxin is just the three wire brushless type motor which I think is why some of the throttles have this 80% power thing ?

This may be down to my controller though in that it might be designed for Halls Effect motors as theyre are lots of spare wires that have been snipped ?

Anyway please chip in and any links you have for buying these.

PS I paid $6 for this one with my kit. The mark up to £20 for these things is a lot!

Regards

Jerry
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,559
30,848
I haven't got a specific throttle suggestion, just making the observation that all Hall effect throttles have a fierce
on characteristic with very little power gradation. It's the nature of the change from one end magnetic field to the other that is fierce, the field strength balance tips suddenly.

A resistance potentiometer to provide the 0 to 5 volt signal will give a much smoother transition but has the
possibility of loss of track contact with resulting unpredictable outcomes and safety implications.
.
 

jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
I haven't got a specific throttle suggestion, just making the observation that all Hall effect throttles have a fierce on characteristic with very little power gradation.
Thanks Flecc, as I have experienced.

I just did a search on the forum (as I should have done before posting :eek:) and there is loads of previous discussions about throttles.

So Flecc how do you know if its a Hall effect throttle or not ?

Regards

Jerry
 

NRG

Esteemed Pedelecer
Oct 6, 2009
2,592
10
From my own limited experience I much prefer the split throttle, I think Flecc has a DIY conversion page on his site. Throttles can be left or right handed, I don't know if these would work with your setup:

Parts for eZee bike

Lastly unless your controller tapers off power using the Pedelec I wouldn't use it. On my Peugeot the controller just cuts power so assistance is either on or off, really annoying when you reach max. RPM of the motor.
 

jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
Thanks Herb. I spoke to Frank and now he is in China the cost with postage is the same as the Alienocean equivalent, which is currently my favourite anyway.

Just finidng out what people think of the twist grip ones.

Regards

Jerry
 

Herb

Pedelecer
Nov 9, 2009
106
0
I have just edited my previous post to include a link to the throttle used on my Brompton.

I find this throttle control very easy to use.

Herb
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,559
30,848
So Flecc how do you know if its a Hall effect throttle or not ?

Regards

Jerry
You can only be certain by opening either the leads-in area to see if they just go to a bead like Hall effect device, or alternatively by opening the main area to see if there's one or two magnets in there. Some use a magnet at each end of the arc so the fields vary between, other throttles use a single long curved bar magnet so it's the end to end fields that act upon the sensor.

Here's the link to my split throttle page mentioned above. These can make fine control much better and I can walk alongside my bike on throttle control and regulate the speed precisely using this:

Split Throttle control mod

You can also buy these half width throttles.
.
 

JamesC

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 1, 2007
435
5
Peterborough, UK
Flecc's split throttle mod was taken up by several forum members owning Torqs and Quandos.

The full grip throttle fitted as standard on these bikes tended to transmit vibration from the front wheel hub motor, leading to quite significant numbness on longer trips.

The Torq Mk 1 (high gearing) in particular needed careful throttle control to avoid cutouts when hill climbing.

The split throttle (or short throttle) allows the body weight to rest on a soft solid grip, and provides much more control through to thumb and forefinger for accurate poistioning of the throttle.

This long thread on Comfort Grips captures the theme quite well.

James
 

1967geezer

Pedelecer
Oct 9, 2009
36
0
Maidenhead, UK
Jerry, thanks for asking this question, saved me having to do it :)

I would also very much like to incorporate the cytronex-style push button control into my forthcoming DIY conversion... I hope more information is forthcoming :)

*edit* the nearest to a cytronex I have found so far is actually on the page that Herb linked to, bit it is rather clunky. If you are after a sleek fitting (as I am) it would probably not suit.



Chris.
 
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andrewgardner

Pedelecer
Jul 29, 2009
66
4
Thumb throttle for me the hall effect type with the spring taken out with a small section of grip like a washer against it to offer a bit of ressistance.
so it's a bit like cruse control.
 

jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
Thanks guys lots of feedback and ideas.

I like that cruise control thingy. I think it would work with any controller according to this

CRUISE CONTROL UNIT - EV TECH, INC.

Also I like andrewgardner's solution. With either of these though I think I would have to fit a brake cutout which would involve replacing one of the Brompton ones that are rivetted on. I do have a couple of these cutout brakes spare and my controller has a connection for them.

Your a top bunch :p

Regards

Jerry
 

andyh2

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 8, 2008
297
1
I had one of those throttles with my original Tongxin kit. I had space for it on cruiser bar set up but didn't like having to hold open all the time. After controller blew I got eCrazyman controller with that smaller thumb throttle which takes up less space, but does not have on/off switch or battery indicators along with pedelec control from Frank.

Very nice set up. The 3 position switch of the pedelec allows very low motor input at start up, so tongxin not overloaded, or when assistance not needed, mid position seems to suit steep hills and 3rd full power position fine for normal running. And if for some reason I want power without pedaling the throttle is there to override the pedelec sensor.

I was very impressed with my Agattu, but I didn't get on with the power reducing at higher cadence, whereas with this set up I can pedal at higher cadence and have full assistance.
 

jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
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jerrysimon

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 27, 2009
3,292
112
Cambridge, UK
Ok now I have sorted my brake cutout and fitted one to the Brompton I am gonna try the simplest solution i.e. take the spring out the thumb throttle as per andrewgardner suggestion.

I emailed Justin at ebikes.ca (he's the guy who designed the cycle analyst) as they stock the cruise control as well the CA which can be setup for cruise control. He suggested the spring removal option as well providing I use a brake cutout. Its good to know that some suppliers don't just want to take your money!

Regards

Jerry