New Super Light Tongxin Motor Design/Kit

[Perbear]

Firstly, connecting the meter up in series on the positive side and running the motor and then stopping it drops and stables out at 00.10 with the setting on mA. So is that 100mA ?

[After a minute or so it drops again stables out at around 00.03 so 30mA ?

From your picture and text the current is first 0.10 mA and then drops to 0.03 mA which is the same as 30 microamperes (uA).

30 uA will discharge a fully charged 9Ah battery pack in approx. 35 years so this seems to be a very well designed standby system.

The battery management system in most ebikes will draw much more current than this

 

[jerrysimon]

Lol thanks.

I am still awaiting another motor to turn up (this time with 28h) and one of the new controllers with throttle. Been waiting over 3 weeks or so now as apparently they are still sorting out the throttle addition to the stock controller.

I love it when you order stuff from China, everything is available until you pay for the parts and then they advise that it may take them a little while to manufacture them before they can send them out, sigh...

As I have said much patience is required when dealing with Chinese sellers.

Regards

Jerry

 

[jerrysimon]

Finally got a tacking number for this some five weeks after placing the order. I have found this is pretty typical with most orders from China, though in this case there were issues with the design in terms of adding a throttle option to the controller.

Much as I like this smaller motor and controller, I think the throttle will be the icing on the cake in terms of giving more exact control over the system rather than the delay and over run of the existing pedelec system.

That said, I am uncertain if the throttle option will be independant or rely on the pedelec function being connected up.

Regards

Jerry

 

[piotrmacheta]

I got my tracking number (and yours by accident I think) yesterday as well. I have a throttle version and a controller built into the hub version coming so looking forward to trying them out. Like Jerry I have no idea how the throttle option will work but may need help to get it working and I'm planning to fit it to the Swifty scooter - just because I can! The other will be fitted to my Cannondale race bike and be pedelec only so should be a neat and simple installation to retain the looks and light weight of the bike. Ooooh, too much going on in my life and too little time to play with it.

 

[jerrysimon]

My wife phoned to say it has been delivered.

The wait for manufacture may have been long, but you can't fault thier 24hr (incl time difference) delivery!

Regards

Jeremy

 

[jerrysimon]

Well just tried it out and I am really confused. Tried the new controller and when I pedal like before the motor powers up. However with the throttle connected nothing seems to happen when I use it

How are pedelec and throttle usually linked ? Does throttle over ride pedelec ?

Beginning to wonder if there really is a throttle circuit inside there

Ok just read an earlier email exchange I had and I think throttle and pedelec are interlinked in some way and this is not a throttle only option

"Right now we can do the motor with throttle function, but you should reserve the function of pedal assistance. Cause there's no hall sensor in the motor, so we can not do the only throttle function."

Maybe the throttle controls how much power is supplied when pedaling, sigh.....



Regards

Jerry

 

[jerrysimon]

Yep the more I think about this the more I think this is the case. The throttle merely adjusts the amount of power applied to the motor when the pedelec sensor is operational.

All it not lost though as this may be able to be used set the power of assist when pedaling, which I would also had thought would be good as part of the system.

Regards

Jerry

 

[jerrysimon]

Anyone got any ideas ? I have tested it again and the throttle appears to have no function at all no matter whether the motor is running with pedelec or not

I have tested the throttle circuit and I have 5v on the common to +ve connection and 0v (maybe a few mv) on the common to -ve

I have emailed them as well to ask how it works.

PS I have tried three different throttles so know its not a dodgy throttle

Regards

Jerry

 

[jerrysimon]

I had a reply back

"Dear Jerry,

The throttle function should be based on pedaling, when you are pedaling, then you can adjust the speed through twist the throttle. I have attached the picture (this shows the three pin connect) of wire to connect with throttle, the red one is +5V wire, green is signal and the yellow is earth wire.
Today I have checked with the QC worker, he said he checked the controller before delivery, it could work. So pls. check whether you have connected with the right cable. If there are any questions, feel free to contact me."

So my assumption was correct. If I can get it to work then I was hoping to then use the throttle to control power.

At least the company is very responsive and always replies to emails


Regards

Jerry

 

[jerrysimon]

Ok finally sorted it out. A kind member pmed me with some ideas that helped me figure out what was happening.

Basically the throttle only becomes active when the crank (pedelec) is first turning slowly. You can then use the throttle to increase speed so probably good to help on speeding up take offs or to increase speed if you suddenly slow down and then need more power. Before I got it working I was spinning it up to full speed and the throttle was not doing anything. Basically pedelec ALWAYS has priority

This makes it less flexible in that as soon as you are pedaling faster the pedelec takes you up to full speed anyway.

Even if you still have the throttle held at this point releasing it does not slow you down.

From all this I can't see what the throttle adds over and above a faster take off or speeding up when pedaling slowly. As soon as you stop pedaling the throttle makes no difference and the motor stops.

Regards

Jerry

 

[dingrpdl]

I can see how this setup would be helpful in a single-speed bike with tall gearing where cadence is low when starting off.

Richard

 

[jerrysimon]

That's true

Jerry

 

[piotrmacheta]

Just been catching up on the emails. I got my motors yesterday (they couldn't be delivered on Thursday as nobody was home) - wow, that was quick from China.
On my scooter I was going to put the pedal sensor on the front wheel and the motor on the back because I got the impression that the throttle operated power/speed when the pedal sensor was turning (ie throttle over-ride the pedal sensor) but unfortunately it looks like it doesn't. Therefore I don't think it will work on the scooter and it'll shoot off and it won't ever stop - gulp.
Any ideas on how to get throttle only working on this?
Can you tell me what wire colours I connect for throttle there are no instructions?
The built-in controller hub is amazing in that it just has one cable coming out of it - I'm looking forward to fitting that to the racer.

 

[jerrysimon]

The only way you are going to stop the scooter in that setup is by either connecting up the cutout to an ebrake/and or have a switch to turn it on/off.

Ideally for a scooter I think a throttle only setup would be required.

PS thinking about it the switch would need to fail closed to turn the motor off by default (an always closed push and hold to open type) or as you say it would go off into the distance lol

Would probably fall over and stop though.

Regards

Jerry

 

[blanche_aline]

I have been out on a few rides and everything is working ok. The only thing I noticed was that the motor does make a "clunk" sound if you stop pedaling when running at full speed. I have now also received a reply from Tongxin about which side to fit the disk.

"We haven't tested to put the magnetism disc on right side pedal, our technical worker suggest you to put it in correct way. Cause there's a clutch inside, When you put the speed sensor on the correct way, when you start pedaling, the clutch close, then the motor runs, but when you stop, the clutch open."

As we said a set of instructions would have been good.

This "clunk" noise could be the clutch. If you slow cadence down rather than just stop pedaling then the shut down of the motor is then silent when you stop pedaling.

I finally found time to go through this whole thread and read this interesting remark of yours.

I noticed this clunk-sound on my "old" 180W Tongxin (built in by Cytronex) too, but only on two occasions so far (only done 500km though) and until I read your post I didn't like it at all:
the first time it occured when I was riding the bike with a malfunctioning controller (yes I know I shoudn't have done that...) and the clunk-sound occured several times in a row when I was torturing myself on a steep rise and the motor unexpectedly got started by the controller... I really thought then that I seriously damaged it as it sounded quite alarming and as if something was jamming inside.

Today (with a new controller) I got it under much less dramatic circumstances: I took a sharp bend with some considerable speed, apruptly stopping pedalling out of high cadence and if I'm not totally mistaken the sound occured just when I started pedalling again with high cadence a few seconds later. If this sound is related to the clutch at all it could be when the opening and closing action occurs nearly simoultaneously.

 

[jerrysimon]

Just wanted to add this link for those who want to use these new light weight motors (the ones with an external control) but with priority throttle control, three speed switch, cruise control etc.

Basically its achieved with a third party programmable controller

Jerry

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I finally found time to go through this whole thread and read this interesting remark of yours.

I noticed this clunk-sound on my "old" 180W Tongxin (built in by Cytronex) too, but only on two occasions so far (only done 500km though) and until I read your post I didn't like it at all:
the first time it occured when I was riding the bike with a malfunctioning controller (yes I know I shoudn't have done that...) and the clunk-sound occured several times in a row when I was torturing myself on a steep rise and the motor unexpectedly got started by the controller... I really thought then that I seriously damaged it as it sounded quite alarming and as if something was jamming inside.

Today (with a new controller) I got it under much less dramatic circumstances: I took a sharp bend with some considerable speed, apruptly stopping pedalling out of high cadence and if I'm not totally mistaken the sound occured just when I started pedalling again with high cadence a few seconds later. If this sound is related to the clutch at all it could be when the opening and closing action occurs nearly simoultaneously.

I've had this same clunking with my Cute Q100 motor, It feels like a major mechanical problem with the clutch or gears like there's teeth missing on the gears to make it jump. The actual cause was a faulty phase wire connection so that connection was breaking down under very high loads - like hill-climbing. I squeezed the barrels tighter in the bullet connectors and the problem is solved.

 

[piotrmacheta]

Apologies for resurecting an old thread but it's a good one. I've finally fitted the small Goldant motor to my race bike (aka Cytronex) and as there were no instructions I don't know which wire is the +ve and -ve to connect battery. I have the hub with built-in controller and it has a coaxial cable to connect the battery. Any ideas (Jerry?). One thing I'm amazed at is how free-running the motor is.

The scooter project is still not sorted as I'm waiting for my friend to open out the drop-outs but will let you know how I get on.

 

[jerrysimon]

Its in one of my other threads about the motor. As I recall (please check) the center wire is +ve.

I had to guess if I recall!

PS I have just fitted my other 36h Goldant to a Swift Xootr 20" bike and it really flies with the stock controller. I will post some pics later. One of the reasons why I stuck with the pedelec controller on this bike, is because the bike flies along and I like to ride it underpowered. As you say the freewheel is very good and riding it unassisted means the freewheel comes into its own.


Regards

Jerry

 

[piotrmacheta]

Thanks Jerry, centre was positive in your previous thread. I connected a battery to the Goldant with the built in controller and it bleeped at me as expected but I can't seem to get the hub working whatever I do with the pedal sensor. I have fitted it as per your pics. Any ideas? Have I missed something? I'm wondering if the sensor isn't working. I have the bike upside down and am turning the pedals but the motor doesn't respond. Even turning the hub wheel at the same time doesn't seem to help. I noticed that there is a red glow from the hub and wondered if that was normal.
Thanks for any help you can give.