Prices of the electricity we use to charge

[lenny]

 

[Woosh]

This is what happens in a democracy when politicians ignore the ordinary people.

If all you do is listening, we'll go nowhere.
Starmer has to find workable solutions. Farage doesn't.

 

[Ghost1951]

I watched Attenborough's new film last month in Hexham. It was too long, and too self referential for my liking, but the message he was putting across was shocking and enough to make you despair of the human race and its impact.

The most important points could have been made in twenty minutes EASILY. The film was an hour and a half long. The message was stark. We saw huge forests of kelp and plant life, stuffed with fish in areas where bottom trawling was not carried out. The scenes looked literally like tropical jungles of plants and masses and masses of fish and sea creatures. That is what the shallow ocean should look like. THEN, we saw the same areas after the bottom trawlers had been over them. There was nothing left. The place looked like Gaza and worse. Just shattered remains and rocks and dead stuff. It was the Garden of Eden transformed into a desert of ruination. There were no fish.

Before bottom trawling -



The catch taken in causing this disaster, was mostly thrown over the side of the big factory ship that was dragging ploughs of steel plates over the sea bed and killing everything that was there. Thousands of horse power devoted to literally destroying the sea bed and everything that was there. The site of dead sea creatures of every kind being tossed over the side was appalling. All they wanted was the scallops.



I remember going on a fishing and cottage holiday with my sons on the Isle of Skye thirty some years ago. We took a small boat up there and tried for mackerel. We were talking to the locals who fished up there and they were up in arms about foreign trawlers which for a year or two back then were bottom trawling Loch Dunvegan for scallops. They were saying back in the 1990s that once that loch had been stuffed with mackerel in the summer so that in ten minutes you could catch a bucket full and take them home, but that now, since this hooligan trawling on the bottom had gone on, the lock was virtually dead. Everything was destroyed where they went.

This should be banned.

 

[Woosh]

now, since this hooligan trawling on the bottom had gone on, the lock was virtually dead. Everything was destroyed where they went.

This should be banned.

You should know that France bans fishing for scallops from 15 May to 1st October every year to protect the species while uk doesn't.
---
Marine Protected Areas (MPAs)

France has over 500 MPAs covering both coastal and offshore zones.

These zones often ban or limit fishing to allow ecosystems to recover.
France also limits days at sea and engine power in some fisheries to reduce pressure.

 

[Ghost1951]

You should know that France bans fishing for scallops from 15 May to 1st October every year to protect the species while uk doesn't.
---
Marine Protected Areas (MPAs)

France has over 500 MPAs covering both coastal and offshore zones.

These zones often ban or limit fishing to allow ecosystems to recover.
France also limits days at sea and engine power in some fisheries to reduce pressure.

France needs to be out of OUR waters NOW!

They are among the most predatory fishing fleet in these parts.

I can't go to France and start commandeering grapes or fruit and just picking it. How come we have EVER allowed French and other foreign European trawlers to come here and fish in our territorial waters. FK 'EM!!!!

The most outrageous thing I heard this year as an insult to Britain, was that before we could bring our forces to the European defence pact - we had to lay down before that stumpy bas tard Macron, and let his fishing fleet rape our sea bed for another twelve years.

It's a joke. Our armed forces may have been hugely weakened, but along with the French, we have the only credible armed forces in Europe right now. The idea that we would be expected to make concessions to bring our army into harms way to defend them is an outrage.

I HATE these European politicians so much, I would sever ALL connection with them.

I don't care how much trade we lost. I don't care if my income was halved.

 

[flecc]

I watched Attenborough's new film last month in Hexham. It was too long, and too self referential for my liking, but the message he was putting across was shocking and enough to make you despair of the human race and its impact.

The most important points could have been made in twenty minutes EASILY. The film was an hour and a half long. The message was stark. We saw huge forests of kelp and plant life, stuffed with fish in areas where bottom trawling was not carried out. The scenes looked literally like tropical jungles of plants and masses and masses of fish and sea creatures. That is what the shallow ocean should look like. THEN, we saw the same areas after the bottom trawlers had been over them. There was nothing left. The place looked like Gaza and worse. Just shattered remains and rocks and dead stuff. It was the Garden of Eden transformed into a desert of ruination. There were no fish.

Before bottom trawling -

View attachment 63448

The catch taken in causing this disaster, was mostly thrown over the side of the big factory ship that was dragging ploughs of steel plates over the sea bed and killing everything that was there. Thousands of horse power devoted to literally destroying the sea bed and everything that was there. The site of dead sea creatures of every kind being tossed over the side was appalling. All they wanted was the scallops.

View attachment 63450

I remember going on a fishing and cottage holiday with my sons on the Isle of Skye thirty some years ago. We took a small boat up there and tried for mackerel. We were talking to the locals who fished up there and they were up in arms about foreign trawlers which for a year or two back then were bottom trawling Loch Dunvegan for scallops. They were saying back in the 1990s that once that loch had been stuffed with mackerel in the summer so that in ten minutes you could catch a bucket full and take them home, but that now, since this hooligan trawling on the bottom had gone on, the lock was virtually dead. Everything was destroyed where they went.

This should be banned.

The answer is obvious, we must develop fish farming by dealing with its problems.

We used to take all our meat from the wild, many in Africa and the Amazon still do, but that was and remains unsustainable, so we developed animal husbandry to high degrees of sophistication. We need to do the same with fish, a few already have for a variety of fish species, but much more needs to be done.

Of course some maintain a better answer is substitution by artificial means, but having tried every meat substitute to date, I rate all of them as total failures and can't imagine how we'll be any better with fish substitutes.
.

 

[Ghost1951]

The answer is obvious, we must develop fish farming by dealing with its problems.

We used to take all our meat from the wild, many in Africa and the Amazon still do, but that was and remains unsustainable, so we developed animal husbandry to high degrees of sophistication. We need to do the same with fish, a few already have for a variety of fish species, but much more needs to be done.

Of course some maintain a better answer is substitution by artificial means, but having tried every meat substitute to date, I rate all of them as total failures and can't imagine how we'll be any better with fish substitutes.
.

I completely agree.

I saw some video the other day. It was on Simon Reeve's series about Scandinavia. Norway, I think, but can't be certain. The relevant scenes were showing a huge enterprise which involved a massive ship, containing very large open water tanks. They were pumping sea water through these netted cages on the ship. They had solved the biggest problem of shallow water fish farms in lochs and fiords, which is bad pollution of the water environment from hundreds of thousands of fish excreting waste into a shallow water, usually part enclosed environment. Because this massive vessel can move about the open sea, none of that concentrated waste problem happens.

They were also zapping the sea lice pests off the salmon with an automated laser device, so the fish welfare problem was solved and without over use of drugs and pesticides (or the fish equivalent).

This video isn't the one I saw, but it deals with some of the same issues.