Q75 / Q85 Query

[jerrysimon]

Yes you have the correct female on the battery. The middle male deans is the wrong way round and you don't need the other female deans. You solder that (the male) directly to the controller and then you can plug the longer male pins into the female of the battery. Positive always goes on the bottom horizontal pin which you have correct. There are tiny - and + marks on the plug if you look closely.

This shows a male plug being soldered.

[video=youtube_share;xZU9rtACdZY]http://youtu.be/xZU9rtACdZY[/video]

Jerry

 

[Joneser]

Thank you Jerry
Hopefully will get a chance to rig this up and test the motor this weekend.
Joneser

 

[Joneser]

Well thanks again Dave and Jerry for your advice. A milestone today. After soldering Deans and making the fuse I connected it all up with the Q75, held breath, turned throttle and hey presto the motor whirled. It was supposed to be with the S06P but I used the KU63 instead because the S06P throttle connections weren't compatible. So I need to learn about connecting small wires. Anyway my worry is still the free wheel. I guess I won't know until its laced into a wheel but it does seem a bit stiff. Also quite noisy. Wondering whether I should have gone Tongxin. Still, will persevere.

Advice on the small wire connections would be appreciated and tools for the job.

Also to mention I got sparks sometimes when connecting the battery to the controller. Is that normal / ok or not? Feels like I should have a switch and only turn it on when it is all connected.

 

[jerrysimon]

Yes you will get sparks when you connect the controller to the battery. I usually put a switch in the circuit and use that to switch on after I have connected the battery to the controller. There are circuits that you can use to eliminate the spark but I find a switch fine and have never had one fail with the arcing that must go on in the switch. Maplin do some nice toggle SPST, 125V, 15amp ones which are the ones I use.

10A Toggle Switches : Toggle Switches : Maplin Electronics

The Tongxin will be quieter, infact you won't hear it when you are using it on your ride, but you will likely get more torque from your Q75. Good if you have a lot of hills.

Small wires are easy. Strip them, twist together, wick in some solder, wrap a piece of insulating tape round them and then use heat shrink (make sure you put the heat shrink on the main wire before you start) to seal it all up neatly.

Regards

Jerry

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Sparks when you connect the controller are normal. There's big capacitors in it that suck up the power as you connect.

The stiff free-wheel means that your're missing a washer on the axle, so that you clamp it when you do up the wheel-nut. Loosen the wheel-nut on the free-wheel side anf see if it becomes free. If so, you need a washer 12mm inside dia and 20mm outside dia. You can file down a standard 12mm washer or file out the hole in a 10mm one.

Forget all thst about the free-wheel. I thought it was a rear motor. Not thinking straight.

The motor will free-wheel OK when you instsll it.

 

[Joneser]

Thanks Jerry and Dave.
yes my commute is v hilly for 3 miles then quite easy for 7. So good torque and free wheel combo is ideal.
So last steps are:
1 switch
2 small wire soldering
3 in line brake sensors (waiting to arrive)
4 local bike shop to lace wheel
5 battery and controller bag / location
Getting there!
Regards
Joneser

 

[Joneser]

Well the hidden wire brake sensors arrived today.
It looks like there are hwbs connections on the S06P controller but not the KU63.
I don't know if the S06P works yet as I didn't test it because of the different throttle connections, which Jerry advised I solder together. Alternatively BMS did include a little bag of little connections bits and pieces so am wondering if they knew it needed changing. Does anyone know where I can learn about fitting those little connectors? Even if I end up soldering it I would like to learn.
I suppose the brake sensors is a simple matter of disconnecting the brakes and threading them through. Would be good to know if they worked first. Suppose I could test it by moving a wire through. Anyone got tips on these brake things?

Another query whilst it pops into my mind - I ordered a thumb throttle with on off switch in the hope that the switch would work like Cytronex. But the switch had no effect when I tested it. Maybe because I soldered the small red wire to the big red wire. But there didn't seem to be anywhere for the little wire to go.
Cheers
Joneser

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The hidden wire brake sensors plug straight into the S06P. Dome of the KU63s have two connectors on each brake line: a two-pin and a three-pin, so I'd need to see a picture of yours to advise. It woyld be much easier to use the S06P because the PAS control is much better, and you only have to join the three throttle wires for it to work. With the KU63, you have to make additional wiring/switching for the ignition wire (thin red at battery connector).

The brake snsors will work. Why shouldn't they? You just slide them over the cable at the brake caloper end. You'll need to shorten the cable outer by 50mm,or use a new cable inner from Wilkos (about £1).

The red switch on the throttle isn't connected to anything. You don't need it with the S06P because the LCD has an on/off switch and battery display. For the KU63, you have to wire that thin red wire that I mentioned above, to the yellow throttle wire, and the green and brown (together) to the battery positive. The switch will then switch the controller on/off and the KEDs will go on/off with it.

 

[Joneser]

Thanks Dave
I look forward to having time to absorb the detail of your advice.

Btw I didn't mention that I do not want to connect the PAS. I asked BMS if the S06P works without it and they said yes (they said controller is torque simulation only), although I'm nervous until I see it in action.

Joneser

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Thanks Dave
I look forward to having time to absorb the detail of your advice.

Btw I didn't mention that I do not want to connect the PAS. I asked BMS if the S06P works without it and they said yes (they said controller is torque simulation only), although I'm nervous until I see it in action.

Joneser

That doesn't make sense. It takes about 5 minutes to fit the PAS, and it makes the bike a lot more comfortable to ride. Why pay all the extra for the SO6P, and then not use its features? The torque simulation and speed/power limiting only work on the PAS, not the throttle.

 

[Joneser]

Dave
I bought the Q75 because it was lightest, and the BMS website said:
"Note: Only S06P and LSW-675 controller fits this motor."
So I bought the S06P without really knowing what I was getting.
I got the KU63 for the Q85 fold up conversion.
Then noticed on BMS website that "KU63 works on all hub motors".
Out of the electric bikes I've tried I preferred the throttle only, as power linked to pedals felt odd especially when it flicks on and off around 15mph. I liked the feel of front wheel drive by constant motor power controlled by my hand and rear wheel drive from my legs.
Thats where I've got to.
Am open to new things and if the PAS is easy to fit (or if I have to to make it work) then I'll give it a go!
Joneser

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I think you'll like the PAS on this one much better. You need a crank puller and a BB tool to fit it. The Right (drive) side BB has a left-hand thread and the left side has a right-hand thread.

Bike cycle tool crank extractor remover puller pedal | eBay

Bottom Bracket BB Tool (Shimano Fitment) NEW! | eBay

 

[Joneser]

I think you'll like the PAS on this one much better. You need a crank puller and a BB tool to fit it. The Right (drive) side BB has a left-hand thread and the left side has a right-hand thread.

Bike cycle tool crank extractor remover puller pedal | eBay

Bottom Bracket BB Tool (Shimano Fitment) NEW! | eBay

Thanks for the links Dave.

Re PAS I'm not clear on the operational relationship between PAS and throttle. I don't want electric power unless I'm going up steep hills / going into headwinds etc?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The throttle always over-rides the PAS under any conditions. The default setting for the S06P is speed control. You set the LCD to say level 2, which might equate to 12 mph. You pedal away from a stop and you get a ramping up power to accelerate you. As you approach 12 mph, the power reduces to zero as you go past it. Then you come to a hill and start to slow down. The further your speed reduces from 12mph, the more power the controller feeds in in an attempt to maintain your speed. If it's still not enogh, you can select a higher level. The levels are speeds, and the greater the difference between your actual speed and the level's programmed speed, the more power you get. This way that it works, to me, is very logical and convenient.

You can also choose torque simulation mode from the advanced setup that changes the levels from speed control to power control, where you get the same power regardless of speed, depending on the level. This isn't so convenient because you have to keep changing the power as circumstances change. This makes it more like a normal bike, but with more power from your legs. I don't get why someone would want their bike to behave like a normal bike.

 

[averhamdave]

d8veh - how do you check the LCD control in "advanced mode" to see if its either "speed control" or "torque simulation"? I remember the instruction I got with mine were along the lines - ".... don't mess with the advanced settings unless you know what you are doing" - so I've left well alone.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I haven't got my laptop with me, so no axcess to the linkks. Go to BMSB website, find the controller and click on the "downloads" tab at the bottom where they have two instructions for normal and avanced settings.

 

[Joneser]

The throttle always over-rides the PAS under any conditions. The default setting for the S06P is speed control. You set the LCD to say level 2, which might equate to 12 mph. You pedal away from a stop and you get a ramping up power to accelerate you. As you approach 12 mph, the power reduces to zero as you go past it. Then you come to a hill and start to slow down. The further your speed reduces from 12mph, the more power the controller feeds in in an attempt to maintain your speed. If it's still not enogh, you can select a higher level. The levels are speeds, and the greater the difference between your actual speed and the level's programmed speed, the more power you get. This way that it works, to me, is very logical and convenient.

You can also choose torque simulation mode from the advanced setup that changes the levels from speed control to power control, where you get the same power regardless of speed, depending on the level. This isn't so convenient because you have to keep changing the power as circumstances change. This makes it more like a normal bike, but with more power from your legs. I don't get why someone would want their bike to behave like a normal bike.

Thats very interesting thanks for explaining. I agree with your second paragraph which is why I was sceptical of PAS. The speed control does sound logical but out of interest how does the PAS know how fast you are going, surely this can only be determined by the controller knowing how fast the front wheel is turning?

 

[Joneser]

Well I finally got a saddlebag big enough for the 5Ah Forzatec battery so I tried it on my commute yesterday and it was a total flop - ran out half way into the easy leg of the commute. Charged it for 4 hours at work but it stayed at 15V so cycled home with no power.

At least I have my A123's which are amazing little things.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

15v means that the BMS has shut off. You need to find out how to coax it back on. It sounds like your battery wasn't made properly. Can you get at the multi-pin BMS connector to measure the cell voltages, or will that invalidate your warranty? What do you plan to do with it?

 

[Joneser]

15v means that the BMS has shut off. You need to find out how to coax it back on. It sounds like your battery wasn't made properly. Can you get at the multi-pin BMS connector to measure the cell voltages, or will that invalidate your warranty? What do you plan to do with it?

Well its all wrapped up in that blue stuff.

Before asking Forzatec I thought I'd see if the forum had any ideas first.

I guess if Forzatec ignore me I could try opening it up.