Which conversion kit?

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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It's not illegal. Don't scare people or give them misinformation. It's only illegal if you have the speed limit set to above 26.5 km/h actual speed.

But an ebike, in which the speed limit can be set to beyond 15.5mph, easily by the user (as opposed to the manufacturer), is illegal. Or is that incorrect? Whether or not it can be done by the user through the display or firmware, is immaterial. The fact that it can be done easily by the user, is the part which makes it potentially problematic legally, during any post accident inspection. Or doesn't that matter?

Say for example, that I had an accident where I killed or injured someone - if my hands were still working, I could quickly set the speed limit back to 15.5mph through the display, before it was carted off to be inspected by the Police. I'm sure that sort of thing would be anticipated by Police forces.

As for your charge of scaring people with misinformation - as far as I'm aware - I plead not guilty, Your Honour.

My Bafang arrived (UK ordered) with the throttle set at 17kmh, it arrived illegalised for the UK. Here are my original settings and the modified:


41826
 
Last edited:

sjpt

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 8, 2018
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Should have been "though" not "through"
There is an edit button for corrections/changes like that, near bottom right of your post after posting.
(I use it a lot, just noticed I originally called it an 'exit' button in this post)
 

montwo

Pedelecer
Feb 11, 2019
56
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But an ebike, in which the speed limit can be set to beyond 15.5mph, easily by the user (as opposed to the manufacturer), is illegal. Or is that incorrect? Whether or not it can be done by the user through the display or firmware, is immaterial. The fact that it can be done easily by the user, is the part which makes it potentially problematic legally, during any post accident inspection. Or doesn't that matter?
Which law are you basing this on?
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
8,405
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Basildon
But an ebike, in which the speed limit can be set to beyond 15.5mph, easily by the user (as opposed to the manufacturer), is illegal. Or is that incorrect? Whether or not it can be done by the user through the display or firmware, is immaterial. The fact that it can be done easily by the user, is the part which makes it potentially problematic legally, during any post accident inspection. Or doesn't that matter?

Say for example, that I had an accident where I killed or injured someone - if my hands were still working, I could quickly set the speed limit back to 15.5mph through the display, before it was carted off to be inspected by the Police. I'm sure that sort of thing would be anticipated by Police forces.

As for your charge of scaring people with misinformation - as far as I'm aware - I plead not guilty, Your Honour.

My Bafang arrived (UK ordered) with the throttle set at 17kmh, it arrived illegalised for the UK. Here are my original settings and the modified:
All bikes can be derestricted through software, so by your logic they're all illegal.

Somebody already pointed out that off-road switches that remove the speedlimit at the touch of a button are illegal. Do you know what a switch or button looks like? It's not a wire connected to a PC, neither is it two wires connected to the controller, nor is it a sequence of buttons, nor is it an app in a mobile phone.
 

soundwave

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 23, 2015
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Which law are you basing this on?

Derestriction, ‘off-road’ switches or modes and dongles

The Department of Transport say that electric bikes fitted with off-road switches or modes, that enable a bike’s motor to continue assisting to speeds beyond 15.5mph, do not comply with UK EAPC law. The term ‘off-road’ suggests that these bikes can be ridden on parkland, forests or other places away from main roads, which isn’t accurate. E-bikes with increased motor power (continuous rated power above 250w) or increased speed (with motor assistance not cutting out at 15.5mph) cannot be used legally as bicycles anywhere on land accessible by the public; when riding on private land you would need permission from the landowner.

tho it has never been enforced and no one has had there bike taken by plod so id not worry about it unless you kill someone.


really the only difference to my bike and a diy kit is i have to pay £150 for a dongle to remove the speed limit but i cant add more power to the controller.
 

soundwave

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 23, 2015
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the fact that you can go in to the settings and change the speed and power limits means it is not road legal even set at 15mph because it can be changed buy the end user same as every kit you can buy on ebay.

i cant do that so need a dongle and every company that has made a locked system for kits has gone bust lol.

i doubt you could find one on ebay ;)
 

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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Gosh. Well let's start with the fact that my BBS01b kit arrived illegal, with the throttle set at the UK illegal speed of 17km/h... which necessitates the user - if he/she/it wants to - to modify the settings on the controller's "firm"ware (not quite "soft"ware) to make it UK legal. The software to enable that to happen is provided freely by Bafang, who don't regard the UK market important enough to restrict modification of the parts of the firmware relating to speed limits, using throttle or PAS.

It's interesting that the this is phrased so loosely: "Derestriction, ‘off-road’ switches or modes and dongles "
It's designed to catch anyone they want to catch. The word "Switch" wasn't enough, so they added the vague word "Mode", to which they added "Dongles", which in my case (BBS01b) is the display, because it fulfils that function.
 

montwo

Pedelecer
Feb 11, 2019
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Gosh. Well let's start with the fact that my BBS01b kit arrived illegal, with the throttle set at the UK illegal speed of 17km/h...
Your throttle was connected when it arrived?
This is surely a joke. If you're going to make a legal claim then quote the law, don't rely on 'Gosh!'
 

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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Your throttle was connected when it arrived?
This is surely a joke. If you're going to make a legal claim then quote the law, don't rely on 'Gosh!'

"Gosh" was my expression at the general furore over what is, after all, quite a grey area, and one which has been unsufficiently illuminated in various parts of this forum before - it all comes down to interpretation of the law, who is doing that interpretation, why, and the momentum behind it ie if someone dies or is injured, the vagueness of "Derestriction, ‘off-road’ switches or modes and dongles ", works to the prosecution's advantage. It actually doesn't personally bother me a bit! I love using my BBS01b.

No I didn't have to connect the throttle. I just wish Bafang would have seen fit to lock the speed-limit related parts of their firmware for the UK market, to make that area less grey.

In any case, for the OP - this discussion contains useful information regarding controversies to be aware of, to help their buying decision.
 

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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I wasn't aware that Bafang sold directly to the public, uk or otherwise.

They seem to rely on wholesalers and dropshippers. Bafang could customise for the UK market - it obviously isn't big enough, compared to the EU, which seems to be what my firmware settings, are set for.
 

montwo

Pedelecer
Feb 11, 2019
56
28
Bafang could customise for the UK market - it obviously isn't big enough, compared to the EU, which seems to be what my firmware settings, are set for.
What do you understand to be the differences?
uk regs are based on eu ones and are almost identical. Anything legal in the eu will be legal here.
 

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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What do you understand to be the differences?
uk regs are based on eu ones and are almost identical. Anything legal in the eu will be legal here.
It seems to vary depending on what country you're talking about. I live in the UK and don't give a jot.
 

pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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The regs are eu-wide. The uk regs are based on them and are almost identical.

The throttle speed limit varies... 17km/h seems pretty arbitrary - not set up UK legal on arrival.
 

soundwave

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 23, 2015
11,114
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at the end of the day no one cares anymore what you do with it is up to you!
 
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pentiumofborg

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 13, 2020
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The other anoying thing is the Bafang software - you have to use a fairly newish PC or laptop for it to work.