Thanks for the updates David. I can understand you not wanting to send a bike short of the final spec for review, but really look forward to an independent view on the bike.

 

11 tooth sprockets are a bit extreme as they wear fast, the tight chain radius also being rather inefficient. On the other hand, Shimano's 7 speed freewheel incorporating an 11 tooth top is a stronger product with better bearings. On a 6 speed like Shimano's Cadet freewheel, the 13 tooth top sprocket is a better choice on wear and efficiency grounds.

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905e

 

On a 6 speed like Shimano Cadet freewheel, the 13 tooth top sprocket is a better choice on wear and efficiency grounds.

.

 

Thanks for that Flecc, yes we agree a 13 tooth top sprocket will be best.

 

Frank another point worth mentioning is the motor from Germany is only 200w and the bike does NOT have quick release front wheel.

 

Also the comment regarding 905 was correct at the time of asking but we have now amended the specs.

 

Best regards David

David,

 

Really? The ebay listing said it was 250W...

 

Frank

I must correct the previous post. The 905se from Germany does have the 13amp battery and the 250w motor not 200w, it is clearly printed on the motor.

 

John

I've just checked the motor on mine and it says 250W too.

But David should know...!

 

David, regarding quick release front wheel - if you are thinking of putting one on, you might want to read this first

 

Frank

I've just checked the motor on mine and it says 250W too.

But David should know...!

 

David, regarding quick release front wheel - if you are thinking of putting one on, you might want to read this first

 

Frank

Exactly Frank, David should know! I have sent you a PM regarding this.

 

John

How embarassing!

 

Yes they are 250w! Standard for Germany not the UK bike.............. oooops!

 

Thanks for the tip on QR front wheel Frank! We will make the amendment straight away.

 

Best regards David

That's a pleasure - we don't want any nasty accidents showing up on You-Tube do we!

 

Now, David, what exactly do all those red and green buttons do? No-one seems to be able to tell me! In particular, which ones would I press if I wanted to go as fast as possible?

 

Thanks

 

Frank

In particular, which ones would I press if I wanted to go as fast as possible?

 

LOL

 

I like that !! :D

 

Cheered me up no end after a pretty poor day

 

Superb!

No, really

 

Still laffin ......

 

 

Frank, I'd say press all the green ones and shut your eyes, but whatever you do then, don't forget where the red ones are.

.

If only it were so simple!

 

I suppose that at least continues the trend for each person to have a different answer for what these mysterious buttons do!

I think I've got it.

 

If anyone else is confused (and they are!), my understanding is that the red one on the right seems to enable the throttle, the green one on the left derestricts and the red one on the left restricts speed.

 

The pedelec operation only seems to operate up to the restricted speed.

 

So, to go fast, you press the red one on the right, then the green one on the left, then twist the throttle!

 

Frank

Buttons buttons everywhere!

 

Hi Frank

 

You will be delighted to know that the new model only has two buttons one on the left and the the other, you guessed it, is on the right. The right hand button will turn the power on/off and the left de-restrict on/off, however.....

 

On the model you have the right hand button turns the throttle on/off, the right hand green button turns the de-restrict on/off and the red button turns the power on/off.

 

If you push them all at once it operates the ejector saddle, so beware!

 

Best regards David

Thanks David,

 

I think I scored 1.5 out of three on that test!

 

Am I right that the de-restrict only works with the throttle, not pedelec? I'm trying to get another mark to get above 50%!

 

Frank

German bikes 250W/UK200W? Ebay

 

Yes they are 250w! Standard for Germany not the UK bike.............. oooops!

 

Best regards David

 

So that means the 250W is only on the 905SE/Germany,

and 905SE/UK only has 200W?

 

By the way - they are on Ebay again: 330196847924

Interpretation

 

Please also consider that bikes bought in from Germany will need to be serviced by the German dealer, we can look after the bike here but there would obviously be a charge, and any warranter issues would be forwarded to Germany.

Best regards David

 

...and presumably Germany would forward the warranty claim to the manufacturer?

 

Warranty is held and to be granted by the manufacturer of a product, that is Wisper UK. According to European law of free trade every Wisper retailer has to fulfill the guarantee, independent of which country he is in.

Warranty is held and to be granted by the manufacturer of a product, that is Wisper UK. According to European law of free trade every Wisper retailer has to fulfill the guarantee, independent of which country he is in.

 

Thank you for the clarification - this is what I would have expected.

I managed to get a chance to ride my Wisper into work last week. A combination of a business trip and flu having previously prevented me doing it for a couple of weeks.

I'll do a more detailed review when I've got to know it better, but my initial view is that there are some very good points about it and some less good points.

 

Good bits

1. Speed - It's fast. Normally cruise at 17-19 mph and often get above 20. I got to work in 47 mins - compared to 51 on Powabyke and 54 on Powacycle and 56 on my unpowered bike. I expect that time might improve as I still had a bit of flu, caught a few red lights and am still getting the hang of the Wisper. Distance is 12.5 miles so, assuming 5 mins lost at red lights, average speed =17.9 mph.

2. Range from the new 13Ah battery - I did about 28 miles (detour on the way home) unrestricted with very liberal use of the throttle, and the battery had plenty of charge left. I've done a few more miles since and its still not ready to charge (I'm conditioning it). I expect it will be good for 40 miles. Obviously this range will decline with age, but I'm pleased with this sort of performance, especially given the cold weather, which has really reduced the range of my Powacycle NiMH batteries.

3. Brakes - I'd not had experience with disc brakes on bikes before, but the one on the Wisper is great. I can't remember a better brake on any bike.

4. Ride - It's not a bad bike to ride. Slightly harsh, which I guess is the aluminium, but it feels light and agile, steers well and is rideable with no power. With the forks locked it feels pretty rigid and solid. Feels well balanced with the rear motor.

 

Not so good.

1. Controls - three buttons control the mode (pedelec/e-bike/derestricted) which gives 9 combinations. It's not clear if a button is on or off and they are easy to flick by accident when changing gear or using the bell. Much of the time riding the bike is spent trying to work out which mode it is in and whether I have accidentally changed mode (hence potential for speed to increase!)

2. Controller operation. Simply, the bike delivers more power than needed initially but, after a short time under load, the controller reins it back in. It means the bike is not very satisfactory as a pedelec only, and I can understand why the Germans didn't want to sell it. It works much better as an e-bike with throttle (subject to 1 above).

3. Battery difficult to remove. Can't be removed at all without taking the seat out.

4. Quality of some components poor. In particular, rear brake (I had to replace it before using), seat (awful 'sofa' type, women's shape, completely out of keeping with the style of the bike) and speedo/battery indicator (basically its useless as a speedo (unreadable and gives incorrect readings - if you could read it!) and as a battery indicator (voltage based so shows full until empty) but has some use as an indicator of battery load (showing if the battery is under too much pressure, which helps you to work out when you are in de-restricted mode)).

5. Gearing. Mine is fitted with the 14-34 7-speed megarange, not the 11-34 mentioned in the spec on this site. the 14-34 gives just about enough top range but requires a higher cadence than many riders will be comfortable with. The 11-34 would be a better choice to take advantage of the big chainwheel.

 

I've not tried it on a significant hill yet. It copes very easily with short, steepish ones. It managed ok with a longer, moderate one (Holland Park Avenue), but needed use of throttle.

 

Frank

Thanks for the very full report Frank, it sound like it will have a near identical speed performance to the Torq once you have the buttons all sorted. Clearly, like the Torq originally, it's going to need some ongoing further development to reach it's full potential.

 

I know that Wisper are trying to source a decent hinged seatpost to improve the battery removal, but it's proving difficult to find one that doesn't add disproportionately to the bike's weight.

 

Those horrible wide saddles seems to be a problem everywhere, the Quando I bought had one, and I just suffered the same on the Kalkhoff I tested, and as indicated in that review, I'd have to change that.

 

Hopefully they'll also attend to the other things. Freewheels with 13-34 and 11-34 are easily obtained and either would be better to extend the bike's comfortable pedalling scope. Quite why they bothered with providing a poor speedo when there are so many excellent and cheap ones on the market is difficult to understand, likewise I'm surprised that the contrast between those front and rear brakes wasn't acted upon. Despite all their protestations to the contrary, I really doubt if they do properly try out the bikes they design in China, since make after make arrive with these very obvious flaws.

 

However, the battery seems good news, and that's going to be very fundamental for your satisfaction.

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Edited December 24, 200718 yr by flecc

An excellent report Frank.

I wonder if you have ridden a Torq and how you thought the 905se compared?

I found it far more comfortable than a Torq with the rear wheel motor and front suspension forks combination, judder and vibration are virtually eliminated. I agree the controls are confusing at first, I use mine derestricted all the time, so once they are set, I don't touch the green and red on the left. As for the saddle, it is not the best, but not the worst by a long way and I prefer not having a hinged seat post as I charge the battery in situ, in any case removing the seat pillar if you need to remove the battery is quite easy as it is quick release. I haven't had any brake problems to report. I would agree with Frank’s comments on the instrument console as far as the speedometer is concerned, but find the battery/power meter very useful. The gearchange is very smooth and the ratios seem to suit me personally. To date I have only ridden about 100 miles on it, but I am quite happy with it so far.

Starting next week my son is going to use mine to commute to work, so that will put quite a few miles on it.

On the subject of saddles, I really like the one on my Kalkhoff and find it very comfortable, but that is probably because I weight 15 stones and am 6'1", so I need a bit of cushioning and I am going to change my 905se one for a Selle San Remo which I previously used on a Torq.

 

John

 

On the subject of saddles, I really like the one on my Kalkhoff and find it very comfortable, but that is probably because I weight 15 stones and am 6'1", so I need a bit of cushioning and I am going to change my 905se one for a Selle San Remo which I previously used on a Torq.

 

John

 

Body size and weight does affect things as you say John, but also the riding stance matters. I like to ride with my legs going to nearly straight at the bottom of a pedal stroke to get the maximum output, and because I'm 11 stones and fairly slim build, the saddle width on these wider saddles impedes the back of my thighs as the leg straightens.

 

Lots of riders these days, especially on MTBs, seem to ride with saddle low and legs well bent all the time, so saddle width would never affect them in this way, probably why manufacturers are happy with wide saddles for the mass market.

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Flecc,

 

Yes - I think battery and motor performance are the critical things, and they are good so far.

 

I'm sure your point about lack of testing is right. The same thought ocurred to me. There are some quite obvious things that could have been picked up.

 

I have to say I'm not a big fan of hinged seatposts, but maybe it would be better to have that option. However, there would be plenty of room to get the battery out, if it were designed that way.

 

John,

 

I've ridden a Torq but only a short trial; in fact my first ever ride on an electric bike, all of 9 months ago! At the time I wasn't able to compare it to anything so can't remember how it compares. However the one obvious benefit of the Wisper is the rear wheel drive. I keep the forks permanantly locked and the ride is fine - no motor wheel 'hammering'

 

Good to hear your views that the Wisper compares favourably!

 

Frank

I am another Wisper owner. It is good to see David of Wisper picks up points for the forum.

 

I go along with all Frank has said. The speedomenter seems to be a current meter so does not tell you much. I have been given a Catseye speed computer for Christmas so that should give me a pretty good indication.

 

The rear light also needs a change, before mass production, to the other side for anything UK! It also needs to be a bit more powerful and dropped a bit lower. Simple small pannier bags obscure it! I fitted my own LED version to the seat post.

 

I have to say I don't like the seat - comfortable for sitting may be but not much good for pedalling.

 

I also would like to see a slightly different arrangement for charging. You have to pull out a rubber plug with a thin rubber ring pull which has already torn away ... and you have to pull out another plug before you can get the charger in. A better ring pull and some offsetting between the two plugs would be better.

 

Apart from the confusing controls, and it is very easy to accidentally get into the wrong mode, I am happy with the bike.

 

It would also be nice to have an English instruction book in due course. Sigh!

 

John

I had a 905e and replaced most of the parts on it. Very disappointing. I've been considering a new 905se but, based on what I've read here on this very useful forum, it sounds very similar to the 905e in build quality, bits needing replacement, useless bits like the power meter/speedo etc. Plus of course, it's a lot more expensive. From what I've read here, posted by another user, the Kalkoff Pro-Connect, due out next March (so ready for spring!) will cost about the same as the Wisper 905se but appears actually to be the 'superior bike' that Wisper claims theirs is. It looks a lot more roady than the Wisper but I found that my 905e, whilst looking a bit off-roady, was in fact not suited to anything except a normal road as off road made bits fall off and the spokes loosen all the time. http://www.kalkhoff.de/bikes/bilddetail.asp?bild=kh_proconnect_pedelec_ret08.jpg[/url]

Here's a link for that Pro-Connect for you Jimmy. Click on the photo to get the enlarged image.

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