One thing that could greatly increase the popularity of cycling and e-biking is beyond our control of course.

 

I'm speaking of that feature of the almost forgotten past, long UK summers with blue skies and sunshine.

 

"Summers" like this one just departed are a killer for cycling popularity but ideal for the motor trade, reinforcing all of Britains preferences and prejudices.

 

Global warming a E-Bike Killer? Or maybe the lack of sunspot activity which is also regarded in some scientific thinking as having a effect on our present climate, in which we could be heading for a mini ice age, and nothing to do with the present economic climate?

 

ps E-powered sledges might be the future

Edited November 10, 201213 yr by jazper53

Certainly doesn't seem to be the economy. As I said above, bad weather is ideal for the motor trade and in evidence of that is the fact that car sales have held up much better in Britain than in other countries (reported on the news in the last 48 hours). The money has obviously been there for car buying, far more than is necessary to buy e-bikes.

 

And of course bad weather is disadvantageous to public transport as well. Do I want to wait at a bus stop in winter and then hang around a cold and windy bus/tram interchange point when I could be warm and comfortable in my car? You bet I don't!

Certainly doesn't seem to be the economy. As I said above, bad weather is ideal for the motor trade and in evidence of that is the fact that car sales have held up much better in Britain than in other countries (reported on the news in the last 48 hours). The money has obviously been there for car buying, far more than is necessary to buy e-bikes.

 

And of course bad weather is disadvantageous to public transport as well. Do I want to wait at a bus stop in winter and then hang around a cold and windy bus/tram interchange point when I could be warm and comfortable in my car? You bet I don't!

 

Car sales may be up from previous all time lows. It is also said that most of these sales are financed on HP, increasing further debt in this country.

Car sales may be up from previous all time lows. It is also said that most of these sales are financed on HP, increasing further debt in this country.

 

But the deposits alone can more than cover the cost of a very good e-bike, so the point I made remains valid.

But the deposits alone can more than cover the cost of a very good e-bike, so the point I made remains valid.

 

What deposits, most car finance deals do not require deposit ie:

 

Car loans - New and Used Car Loans service in the UK - Car Loan 4U

Yes, I'm aware of those deals, but they certainly aren't all done that way, many if not most being with around one third deposit. Often that deposit comes from the part exchange in, but that's still a cash potential which could be used to buy an e-bike.

 

Even on no deposit purchases, a couple of months installments covers the cost of a budget e-bike, so sorry, the point made remains valid, cars are the preferred purchase of the two in the UK and arguing against that is tilting at windmills.

It always baffles me why the government looks to "new car sales" as some kind of marker of how well the economy is doing. I dread to think what percentage of new cars are purchased with HP ?!?! No one is actually purchasing a car with cash, they are just racking up a loan ! ...every time I see a new car on the road, I just see another little pile of DEBT driving around...

Come now jazper, that's just an assumption and a very wrong one at that. I've bought seven new cars over the last 18 years, all for cash, the last one in May 2011, and I'm far from the only person doing that. Many others buy with substantial deposits, for example many of those VWs, SEATs and Skodas you've seen on the roads in recent years have been bought on VW's own terms scheme, a third down and interest free over thirty-six months. Just because there are no-deposit schemes doesn't mean everyone is using them, especially when they don't get much interest on any cash they have anyway in recent years.

 

There may be three millions unemployed, but there are ten times that many employed and often earning good money so well able to afford cars. So the government are wise to use the majority purchases to measure the economy.

.

Edited November 10, 201213 yr by flecc

A lot of it was wasteland though, plus low grade industrial land. Add the fact that it was in the eastern side of London and the social realities of that made the abuse of the locals interests easy. These factors are precisely why it was built there!

 

Trying that in the middle class areas would never succeed, and Britain is a majority middle class country.

 

Much of the Olympic village was built on Hackney marshes,anyone who knows that area was it was a virtual no go area and London was well rid of that centre of low life crime.

The Olympics in every respect was a succesfull regeneration of a derelict area.

When I was down at Eurobike (Bavaria,Southern Germany) I was so impressed by the cycle tracks adjacent but remote from auto roads,it has all been done so well,not affecting the beauty of the countryside-if I lived in that area I would ride a bike every day.

Thinking of my home town,to my thinking the approach to cycle routes is completely wrong-the current cycle track routes seem to be taking an edge from a road,painting it red with cycle logos but it only appears when possible,when it is not possible you have to feed back and mix with the cars and lorries,its probably safer not to have any.

Why can't we build a cycle ring road around every town,take 3 mtr of farmland adjacent to A roads in a circular pattern around the town,tunnels under crossing roads and then have say 2 proper cycle routes into the town centre with a security camera protected bike park at the centre. OK I respect that to get to the 2 cycle routes into town will involve some additional riding round the cycle ring road but if that was safe riding I am sure we would all be prepared for that.

Would the lottery fund it?

Dave

Kudoscycles

I think the problem would still be the cycle routes into town though Dave, few towns and no cities making that possible without extensive bulldozing of businesses and homes. Long sections are sometimes possible, but invariably there's that awkward major obstruction from time to time preventing completion. Which in a sense is what we already have, lots of disjointed bits.

 

Given that compulsory purchase and bulldozing would be necessary, can that be justified for such a minority of the population? Politically I very much doubt it, and maybe it's morally wrong too.

Flecc,Then maybe the cycle parks need to be on the edge of towns and we will have to walk the last bit,but maybe that defeats the object of owning the bike. Its all a compromise but anybody who visits the lovely scenery of Bavaria cannot fail to notice the scenic cycle routes through the countryside and into towns and villages,how did they achieve it?

Dave

Kudoscycles

Most continental countries have far more space than we have and have built accordingly in the past, giving more tolerance for later additions. However, it's not all wonderful there. I remember seeing an online video in Holland showing cars and bikes travelling fast through a scary in-town bottleneck, as bad as anything I've seen in the UK. I wish I'd kept the link. So even for them it isn't always possible to have good conditions for cyclists, and there is an inclination by our cyclists to illustrate the best continental circumstances for propaganda reasons, ignoring the bad.

 

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, though I accept the continent is often much better at it than us.

I remember seeing an online video in Holland showing cars and bikes travelling fast through a scary in-town bottleneck, as bad as anything I've seen in the UK. I wish I'd kept the link...

 

Recently saw an article in a local newspaper here in Melbourne about cycling in the Netherlands. But I don’t know if the article was over hyped or not, since I haven’t been to the Netherlands myself.

 

Here is an excerpt:

 

More cyclists on the road means more congestion and "bicycle rage" often flies across the handlebars.

 

The statistics show just how dangerous it has become: a quarter of all deadly accidents in the Netherlands involve cyclists, the Cycling Association said.

 

Some 200 died on Dutch roads last year, the majority of them elderly, an increase of 28 from 2010. And the problem is getting worse since the Dutch authorities decided to broaden bike path use to include over a million mopeds, which are allowed to zoom past cyclists as long as they stay under a speed limit of 25km/h.

 

Full article here:

Dutch cycling utopia under threat

 

BTW: I prefer to read The AGE here because it is a non-Murdoch owned newspaper...!

Edited November 10, 201213 yr by twain

Making ebikes "Stealthy" - not looking as if they Are ebikes, has to be contraproductive to making them popular, surely.

 

 

 

On this point about a trend not being obvious and therefore undermining the effect of a trend, it might be useful for the e-transport industry to come up with a single badge or label, which all e-transport could be seen with.

 

I'm thinking of the way computers sport badges which say 'intel on bored', or 'core 2 duo'. These badges makes the less obvious, obvious. There's also the relatively minor issue of li-poly batteries, which are safer now than they were, but might still need to be flagged in some way.

 

'Li-pol on board' or 'power 2 transport' -

 

Any takers?

And! In addition to all the above, the complete lack of a support network of firms who can fix the things when they go wrong, which in my experience they frequently do. In my city c.60,000 pop. there is not one e-bike repairman. If my daughter (for whom I act as unpaid mechanic) had been on her own, both the e-bikes she has owned would have been scrapped within a very short time, for want of repair. A great hobby, challenging and technically interesting, but everyday mainstream transport for the masses, no I don't think so. AG

And! In addition to all the above, the complete lack of a support network of firms who can fix the things when they go wrong, which in my experience they frequently do. In my city c.60,000 pop. there is not one e-bike repairman. If my daughter (for whom I act as unpaid mechanic) had been on her own, both the e-bikes she has owned would have been scrapped within a very short time, for want of repair. A great hobby, challenging and technically interesting, but everyday mainstream transport for the masses, no I don't think so. AG

 

Absolutely right AG. The average hub motor bike is generally quite unreliable in most users hands, only really suitable for the technically competent. The more sophisticated and more reliable crank drive bikes which bike shops can maintain are mostly far too expensive for most mainstream customers to consider.

 

And of course there's the bogey of high prices for their often short lived batteries.

 

At present e-bikes in Britain are largely enthusiast items rather than wholly practical reliable transport.

Absolutely right AG. The average hub motor bike is generally quite unreliable in most users hands, only really suitable for the technically competent. The more sophisticated and more reliable crank drive bikes which bike shops can maintain are mostly far too expensive for most mainstream customers to consider.

 

And of course there's the bogey of high prices for their often short lived batteries.

 

At present e-bikes in Britain are largely enthusiast items rather than wholly practical reliable transport.

 

Maybe the question we should ask, from an industry/business point of view, is which section of the market is going to be more likely to see e-bikes as an attractive purchase and viable mode of transport, and so have the higher/fastest market growth potential.. that could be the older generation/retired people... you could argue this group maybe has more disposable income too and more time available to use their bikes.

 

Or perhaps with those disabilities or injuries who can't pedal a bike and want an easy and cheaper way to out and about and exercise. It could also be people more concerned with health and fitness too, as consumers become more concerned about that and so more willing to spend on an e-bike seeing it for that purpose, as an alternative to a treadmill or going to a gym.

 

Being a business man myself selling a health product, my products are only low price and so appeal to a much wider market than e-bikes...but it's interesting how I've seen growth in specific niche markets.

Edited November 12, 201213 yr by morphix

Is there a possible business opportunity here? Are there few ebikes because there are no repairmen, or no repairmen because there are no ebikes? Like all businesses, there would be problems, notably getting hold of spares and or information in a timely manner. There are numerous bike shops who will not touch ebikes. They could become your friends, passing on jobs to you in exchange for an occasional bottle of whisky. It would be tough getting started, but if you were reliable, and reasonably priced, you would soon build a name for yourself. Remember you would still be free to refuse any job you did not like the look of.

It is the sort of business that would suit someone working part time, or a retired person. Initial capital investment would be fairly low, consisting of some tools and test gear, and a garage or even a garden shed. Working from home keeps overheads low, and saves commuting. It would be useful to have some statistics showing what faults cause the most frequent problems

It could also be a sideline for a LBS that is feeling the recession. Any thoughts?

Is there a possible business opportunity here? Are there few ebikes because there are no repairmen, or no repairmen because there are no ebikes? Like all businesses, there would be problems, notably getting hold of spares and or information in a timely manner. There are numerous bike shops who will not touch ebikes. They could become your friends, passing on jobs to you in exchange for an occasional bottle of whisky. It would be tough getting started, but if you were reliable, and reasonably priced, you would soon build a name for yourself. Remember you would still be free to refuse any job you did not like the look of.

It is the sort of business that would suit someone working part time, or a retired person. Initial capital investment would be fairly low, consisting of some tools and test gear, and a garage or even a garden shed. Working from home keeps overheads low, and saves commuting. It would be useful to have some statistics showing what faults cause the most frequent problems

It could also be a sideline for a LBS that is feeling the recession. Any thoughts?

 

OOh.....nice one Neptune, thankyou for that .......Ive got a fairly big garden shed this could be my new business idea.

 

As long as Im free to refuse any job I didnt like the look of......magic....AND I can use a screw driver

 

IF.....by any stretch of the imagination......I get a problem repair I find I cant deal with....I can always ask for help on here......simples :D

 

( sorry....could this be the aftermath of flu addling my brain lol )

 

Lynda

Lynda stop nicking work of me, times are hard enough as it is.

 

Also you need a big one like mine........toolbox that is

Lynda stop nicking work of me, times are hard enough as it is.

 

Also you need a big one like mine........toolbox that is

 

 

 

Ah....sorry Dave.....perhaps we could work together......especially if you have a digital probe ? ......you do all the work and I will take half the profits ?

 

I will just send them all up to you.....

 

Sound like a good idea....shall I WhatsApp you the contract ?

 

( I think this flu bug must have done my brain some good after all )

 

Lynda

Lynda just go back to bed you not right yet tut tut telling everyone about me probe huh

Absolutely right AG. The average hub motor bike is generally quite unreliable in most users hands, only really suitable for the technically competent. The more sophisticated and more reliable crank drive bikes which bike shops can maintain are mostly far too expensive for most mainstream customers to consider.

 

So how do the millions of Hub bike users in China manage ?

No No....honestly I feel MUCH better now that we have this new business off the ground .

 

And besides, I thought ALL electric bike mechanics had to have digital probes......you never said it was your own personal secret weapon

 

Contract on its way..... :D

 

Lynda

So how do the millions of Hub bike users in China manage ?

 

Good point GaRRy........

 

Lynda