If that bike had been equipped with brakes, it would have collided with the pedestrian at a lower speed than what it did.

that's not a fact. We don't know whether he would have attempted to use the brakes. I think not because I judge from my perspective, where I only tend to use the brakes as a last resort, moreso when I'm on my road bike.

 

have a look at this everybody. To us, it looks frightening. Note the emergency stop that the guy does at 1:53. Along the course, they must do all sorts of other extreme braking too.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N-I8fpBx-4

That's very noble of you. I suspect that had it been one of your loved ones who had been killed, you would have been outside the court spitting at the prison van and screaming obscenities as the defendant was driven past.

 

That's a fair point and is exactly the reason why justice is supposed to be blind. Otherwise it is just vengeance. Actually in this matter I probably would not have been spitting etc I can speak from some personal experience in that a car misdriven by a young man mounted a pavement and broke the femur of my wife some years ago. We deliberately avoided any of the court case and allowed due process to take its course.

We think he was a nutter to do so, but he and many of the other dispatch riders do it all the time because they know that they can control their bikes safely.

 

I still think that he never intended to stop. Instead, he was trying to steer around her to preserve his momentum. He wrongly assumed that she would look up, see his approach and avoid putting herself on a collision course.

 

The two extracts I've quoted show what is wrong. Those despatch riders don't do what they do safely, they put their priority over everyone else's safety. They often have minor contacts with people and vehicles and they routinely scare people with the suddeness of their arrival and actions. That's especially true when they do the illegal and thus unexpected, like suddenly crossing red lights and taking to pavements at speed, skimming close to pedestrians.

 

At the very least it's thoroughly bad road manners and they are every bit as thoughtless as the jay-walking pedestrians. The difference is that their thoughtlessness is at speeds that can seriously injure and kill.

 

Pedestrians are a special case among road users, requiring greater levels of care and consideration. They include the young and vulnerable, the elderly or disabled with impaired physical functions and the mentally impaired, and some of those conditions are not readily detectable. In addition walking is such a fundamentally automatic function that it lends itself to preoccupation with other things more than any other form of locomotion, increasing the likelyhood of doing something unwise. Cyclists having a small visual profile and being silent are especially likely to suffer from such mistakes.

 

So like any road user, cyclists should conduct themselves in a manner best able to cope with any eventuality. It's important in fact and in law that every class of road user is reasonably able to stop in time to avoid collision with anything suddenly confronting them. The law makes little allowance for the mistakes of others as a defence, whether we agree with that or not. Those who cause death on the roads will suffer the legal consequences.

.

Edited September 23, 20178 yr by flecc

that's not a fact. We don't know whether he would have attempted to use the brakes. I think not because I judge from my perspective, where I only tend to use the brakes as a last resort, moreso when I'm on my road bike.

 

have a look at this everybody. To us, it looks frightening. Note the emergency stop that the guy does at 1:53. Along the course, they must do all sorts of other extreme braking too.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N-I8fpBx-4

 

I think you are dredging the bottom of the excuses barrel with the, "we don't know if he would have used the brakes" thing. That's on a par with, maybe the woman committed suicide by "fixie", we will never know, so no one is to blame.

 

It is a fact that a track bike cannot be slowed using pedal resistance alone as quickly as a bike equipped with fully functioning brakes.

that's not a fact. We don't know whether he would have attempted to use the brakes. I think not because I judge from my perspective, where I only tend to use the brakes as a last resort, moreso when I'm on my road bike.

 

have a look at this everybody. To us, it looks frightening. Note the emergency stop that the guy does at 1:53. Along the course, they must do all sorts of other extreme

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N-I8fpBx-4

The video is frightening and their activity is highly dangerous particularly to themselves. The only consolation is that automobile traffic in Manhattan is very sluggish. And they do a slow down at pedestrian crossing. Note the discipline of the pedestrians ... no jaywalking.

Alliston being a courier is barely relevant, and in any case his claimed employment has been called strongly into question.

 

Seems he worked for a few days as a courier, despite telling the jury he had done the job for eight months.

 

http://road.cc/content/news/229482-charlie-alliston-potentially-facing-perjury-charge-over-claim-he-worked-courier

From the article above, the picture of the cyclist which is emerging is that of a chancer, an unreliable person and a dishonest man. This fits perfectly with the profile of someone who would take a gamble with the safety of others for their own gratification.

Have a look at this, then think about where and when you would have stopped:

Yes, that's a great video showing how stupid pedestrians can be. And then you can watch one of hundreds like this, showing just how stupid the cyclists are:

 

Yes, that's a great video showing how stupid pedestrians can be. And then you can watch one of hundreds like this, showing just how stupid the cyclists are:

 

 

The problem is the human factor. We are erratic, unpredictable and prone to making errors. This is compounded by a small element sincerely believing that they are in possession of superior skills which set them apart others, thus licensing themselves to behave recklessly. The best drivers, riders, pilots etc are those who recognise their own and others vulnerability in making errors.

 

As far as transport is concerned, the sooner we are taken out of the decision making process by machines, the better.

Autonomous bikes ! Oooo goody goody:cool:

 

Defensive driving/riding is the only way to go, as any surviving motorcyclist knows very well.

As far as transport is concerned, the sooner we are taken out of the decision making process by machines, the better.

 

Well, other people maybe. Just post war when I could ride a motorbike 25 miles through the New Forest from Bournemouth to Southampton seeing almost nothing else on the roads, it was perfectly safe.

 

Goes to show that it's other people who are the trouble.

.

I used my new dashcam for the first time and saw this woman walking along the road whilst using her phone. Will they never learn!

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGuz6V89QCU

I used my new dashcam for the first time and saw this woman walking along the road whilst using her phone. Will they never learn!

 

And on the wrong side too, not facing the oncoming traffic.

 

She was probably wanting to avoid the snow covered pavement, but walking on the other side would have been safer.

.

And this one.. she must have had a good new year's eve party the night before this near miss.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkmbqYgYxFY

And this one.. she must have had a good new year's eve party the night before this near miss.

You don't need to be drunk or hungover to do that. You just need to arrogantly not understand what right of way is and think you're Lady Muck. A lot of people cross roads like aristocrats for whom traffic must slow down. But your explanation is probably correct in this case.

You just need to arrogantly not understand what right of way is and think you're Lady Muck. A lot of people cross roads like aristocrats for whom traffic must slow down.

 

Apart from roads under motorway regulations and special roads I can't think of an example of where motorised users have "right of way" over pedestrians, quite the opposite in fact.

 

wheeler

Apart from roads under motorway regulations and special roads I can't think of an example of where motorised users have "right of way" over pedestrians, quite the opposite in fact.

 

wheeler

I thought vehicles had right of way with respect to pedestrians crossing roads and pedestrians had right of way when it came to cars crossing pavements.

I thought vehicles had right of way with respect to pedestrians crossing roads and pedestrians had right of way when it came to cars crossing pavements.

Yes cars do have right away when pedestrians cross road. But that won't stop driver going to court if pedestrian is killed or injured.

Yes cars do have right away when pedestrians cross road.

 

I don't think this is the case. While the Highway Code says (for pedestrians) 'If traffic is coming, let it pass' it also makes very clear that the rules in the HC 'do not give you the right of way in any circumstance'. Pedestrians and horse riders have the 'right' to use the carriageway. Cars do not have that right as they first must be proven to be roadworthy, licensed, insured and driven by a person deemed competent before they're allowed on the carriageway.

 

In the case of this young lady, you have to wonder why she didn't just hesitate for the clear space after the second car. It doesn't take too much common sense to realise that a large lump of metal heading at you is likely to hurt if it doesn't pan out how you expect.

 

Gaz

Edited January 2, 20188 yr by Gaz

I thought vehicles had right of way with respect to pedestrians crossing roads and pedestrians had right of way when it came to cars crossing pavements.

 

Most roads (highways in England) are "all purpose". This means that all users, motorised and non motorised, have a right of way on the road, however no class of user has any right of way over another. You cannot infer a right of way over another road user simply because your mode of transport is faster and heavier. The roads are an equally shared resource whether you are walking, cycling, riding a horse, driving a car or a 44 tonne truck.

 

The Highway Code Rules 204 - 225 deal with road users needing extra care and 1-35 are rules for pedestrians.

 

wheeler

Well, other people maybe. Just post war when I could ride a motorbike 25 miles through the New Forest from Bournemouth to Southampton seeing almost nothing else on the roads, it was perfectly safe.

.

"We wont ask which war".

Was that the punchline you were waiting for? Hehe

Mikel

You were caught on a speed camera

 

http://dialyourride.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/excelsior1.jpg

"We wont ask which war".

 

You were caught on a speed camera

 

It was this Excelsior bike and I was 16 at the time:

 

http://cybermotorcycle.com/gallery/excelsior-1951/images/Excelsior-1951-04.jpg

And this one.. she must have had a good new year's eve party the night before this near miss.

 

Though not as bad as virtual blindfolding and plunging into really heavy traffic with a child: