March 29, 20224 yr To eke out range even more I now set the cut out to 20km/h which is a tad under 12.5 mph, no matter what I set the cut off to it doesn't stop me nearly reaching 20 mph unassisted nor make my speed illegal.
March 29, 20224 yr Author I was out on my Ebike yesterday and a bike went the other way, the guy had clearly fitted a small petrol engine in the frame, it was doing about 15mph but making a right racket, l wouldn't have wanted to be any nearer! Respect for his ingenuity but l think he needs to fit a silencer These are kits that can be bought online. Petrol engines for bicycles were very popular in the early 1950s, at one point there were over a million on the road in Britain. Between 25cc and 50 cc, some were in the back wheel, others above front or rear wheel driving the tyre tread by a friction roller. They all had to be registered and taxed with a rear number plate, insurance and ridden with a full motorcycle licence. There were no in frame ones then, those have only appeared more recently. .
March 29, 20224 yr at 120rpm at the cranks my bike can hit 35mph on the flat in 8 years not 1 road race bike can keep up if i floor it and drives um up the wall as see me behind them on a fs mtb they try to fly off but im still stuck to there back tyre then its turbo time and i leave them for dust lol .
March 29, 20224 yr I was out on my Ebike yesterday and a bike went the other way, the guy had clearly fitted a small petrol engine in the frame, it was doing about 15mph but making a right racket, l wouldn't have wanted to be any nearer! Respect for his ingenuity but l think he needs to fit a silencer There's an ejit around town here with one, mtb with it within the diamond.
March 29, 20224 yr i cant keep that pace for long lol but the motor can do it i avg around 80-90 rpm just depends if i can be bothered to race them. i can still just about get 25 miles in turbo but its started showing its age as was new in jul 2016 and cant really use my other 400w batt as in life support mode until i can find a way to recell it and not brick the fkn bms
March 29, 20224 yr ROund here if you look carefully - and you do need to look carefully - most of the ones out during the day seem to be legal However once it gets later on you can see quite a few that seem to require suspiciously little in the way of pedalling - and some with fairly massive hub motors that have to be way over any legal limits. I was talking to a sensible seeming bloke about my age the other day who noticed the battery on mine and asked what I thought of it as he has one as well. I replied that I loved it and he asked me how fast I had been on it. When I said the motor cuts out at 15.5 he started telling me how to override the limits. APparently he has had his doing over 40 with no pedalling! The LBS has hinted that they could fit a throttle if I wanted - nod not wink wink and all that However, round here - at least when I am out and about - they do seem to mostly be ridden reasonably sensibly - the worst riding is just from the normal teenagers riding in a black hoodie (hood up), black jeans, black shoes , at night - often doing a wheelie down the wrong side of the road.Oh- naturally no lights or helmet - nearly forgot that bit:eek: Should be pointed out a massive direct drive hub motor is not a sign of being illegal. They have to be large whether supplied with nominal power of around 250-400W or up to 2000W etc. In fact it can be the same hub motor with only the controller changing and some controllers have a legal mode (pedelec+15.5mph approx). They don't have any internal nylon gears to destroy if too much power is applied they have no moving parts at all apart from the bearings in the axle so its a motor type that isn't really power restricted its down to the controller really. Their larger size does dissipate heat better but I would guess that is the big factor when you really up the watts. They can be fully legal or can be seen zapping around at 35mph without pedalling.
March 30, 20224 yr Thought his thread was about Pedelec legality? Seems like a load of middle aged sour grapes to me! Enjoy your own bike stop worrying what about others are doing. If your own bike is legal why worry...... Simples If its not legal, why worry..... Simples.
March 30, 20224 yr If its not legal, why worry..... Simples. If it's not legal no great worry per se. The problem is when its being ridden irresponsibly. This is a problem whether the bike is or is not legal, but much more common on illegal bikes. It's a problem for several reasons. Danger to others. Giving ebikes a bad name, and (as a result) causing extra restrictions that will impact responsible legal users. p.s. Many of us haven't been middle aged for some time.
March 30, 20224 yr If it's not legal no great worry per se. The problem is when its being ridden irresponsibly. This is a problem whether the bike is or is not legal, but much more common on illegal bikes. It's a problem for several reasons. Danger to others. Giving ebikes a bad name, and (as a result) causing extra restrictions that will impact responsible legal users. p.s. Many of us haven't been middle aged for some time. Agree, but TBH, a lot of posters come on forums and spread fear, doom and gloom, when there is no need. A high percentage of Pedelec riders use "modified" kit with no fear or issues, so why worry, just ride and enjoy for now! Sure irresponsible behaviour could invoke change in the law. That happens everyday??? You are not going to stop "scumbag Yoofs" riding illegal Pedelecs, mopeds, motorcycles, cars etc, like idiots. Its part of modern life! P.S. I am well passed middle age.... Or is mid 60's middle aged now? LoL! Edited March 30, 20224 yr by MontyPAS
March 30, 20224 yr Author P.S. I am well passed middle age.... Or is mid 60's middle aged now? LoL! It is to me, I'm 86 ! .
March 30, 20224 yr P.S. I am well passed middle age.... Or is mid 60's middle aged now? LoL! Of course it is! You're not a pensioner yet. Compare stages 7 & 8: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erikson%27s_stages_of_psychosocial_development#Care:_generativity_vs._stagnation_(middle_adulthood,_45%E2%80%9364_years)
March 30, 20224 yr My E-mountain bike thinks it's in the USA. That gives it an extra 4mph which makes all the difference and turns it into a viable road bike (on private roads of course)
March 30, 20224 yr My E-mountain bike thinks it's in the USA. That gives it an extra 4mph which makes all the difference and turns it into a viable road bike (on private roads of course) And there was me thinking you wanted the excercise;)
March 30, 20224 yr Well, l only use the lower assistance mode so to keep the mountain bike with its 2.8" off road tyres at those speeds takes about the same effort as riding my road bike which isn't an ebike.
April 2, 20224 yr Well, l only use the lower assistance mode so to keep the mountain bike with its 2.8" off road tyres at those speeds takes about the same effort as riding my road bike which isn't an ebike. 2.8" inch off road tyres??? how are they on the bumps?? sorry - had to be done I assume you mean 29inch I also normally use the lowest assist mode - I don;t have a none assist bike but I do wonder how much more effort it would be ALthough I do tend to go faster in Eco assists level than most other bike - except the lycra clad road bike people - so I assume the assist helps a fair bit
April 2, 20224 yr Sorry l meant the tyres are 2.8 inches wide! They are the "plus size" tyres which seemed to be popular a couple of years ago. The wheels are 27 1/2"
April 2, 20224 yr its down to the width and axle size to what tyre will fit the rear triangle, my tyres are 2.3 wide hansdampf on the rear and 142x 12 rear axle so boost size for mtb is the new normal size.
April 6, 20224 yr What is the legality of towing a petrol generator in a small trailer to charge a second battery that could be used to power the ebike later? Just curious. I have no plans to do so but just wondered about it. Could you effectively have a petrol powered ebike legally without registration and insurance. Where you cycle vast distances by just swapping batteries regularly. If you couldn't use it while mobile would it still be ok to stop to charge batteries before continuing, I assume so. Is there a maximum speed to use a generator while moving. I remember carnival floats would run generators to power all their lights which were running in a moving vehicle. Probably only 3mph though.
April 6, 20224 yr Petrol generators are heavy. Then there's the cans of fuel to run it. Plus you (and others) will be breathing in all those pollutants. Not really a practical proposition. Maybe you could run a small dynamo from the drive train or even a small wind turbine while moving and a couple of solar panels to charge the spare battery, that might be a more practical solution.
April 6, 20224 yr Author What is the legality of towing a petrol generator in a small trailer to charge a second battery that could be used to power the ebike later? Just curious. I have no plans to do so but just wondered about it. Could you effectively have a petrol powered ebike legally without registration and insurance. Where you cycle vast distances by just swapping batteries regularly. If you couldn't use it while mobile would it still be ok to stop to charge batteries before continuing, I assume so. Is there a maximum speed to use a generator while moving. I remember carnival floats would run generators to power all their lights which were running in a moving vehicle. Probably only 3mph though. There is some obscure law forbidding manufacturing etc on the public highway so that could be breached. However, in the way you've descibed it as a range unlimited system, it would definitely be illegal since it would arguably be a petrol-electric drive, regardless of any delay in swapping the battery over. You'd definitely be using the petrol indirectly to propel the machine. There are dispensations. For example very long ago there was one to permit readymix trucks to make concrete while driving on the road. I don't think ice cream vans ever had one though, but some of those do make the ice cream on the move. Funfairs and circuses have a dispensation allowing towing more than one trailer, so they may have one for their mobile generators. That could suffice for carnivals. .
April 6, 20224 yr There is some obscure law forbidding manufacturing etc on the public highway so that could be breached. However, in the way you've descibed it as a range unlimited system, it would definitely be illegal since it would arguably be a petrol-electric drive, regardless of any delay in swapping the battery over. You'd definitely be using the petrol indirectly to propel the machine. There are dispensations. For example very long ago there was one to permit readymix trucks to make concrete while driving on the road. I don't think ice cream vans ever had one though, but some of those do make the ice cream on the move. Funfairs and circuses have a dispensation allowing towing more than one trailer, so they may have one for their mobile generators. That could suffice for carnivals. . I assume it would be legal to tow to a location and then charge the battery while stationary. I mean small petrol generators aren't too heavy and if you took it to a campsite to power devices as well as charge the ebike batteries. I was only curious about what law the police would get you on if the generator was active while riding. I have no plans to do this but it just crossed my mind that I wonder what laws would be broken.
April 6, 20224 yr Author I assume it would be legal to tow to a location and then charge the battery while stationary. I mean small petrol generators aren't too heavy and if you took it to a campsite to power devices as well as charge the ebike batteries. That is definitely legal, caravanners do similar all the time for all sorts of purposes, including charging e-bike batteries. I was only curious about what law the police would get you on if the generator was active while riding. I have no plans to do this but it just crossed my mind that I wonder what laws would be broken. It might well invite a stop, since the sound of an i.c. engine when an unregistered vehicle was moving would excite curiosity, but I don't know what laws might be broken. Pollution laws could be for example, since i.c vehicles are subject to pollution limits, even when stationary and the engine not driving the vehicle. However, some flout the laws anyway and mostly get away with it. The bike below has a Panasonic crank drive motor powered from the battery rear of seat post and/or a Heinzmann front hub motor powered by the generator on the carrier, so it breaks all sorts of laws, two 250 watt motors making it a 500 watt bike for starters:
August 21, 20232 yr Hi flecc, Resurrecting an old thread, 1983 EAPC law, only now valid combined with amendments from the 2015 law below http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1983/1168/made 6th April 2015 revisions to EAPC law http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/474/pdfs/uksi_20150474_en.pdf Isn't https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/24/introduction/made the 2015 amendment to EAPC ? IIUC the 2015 amendment you mentioned is the one for The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) - it doesn't mention 250W replacing 200W for two wheeled and removing the 1983 law applicability only on bicycles & tricycles. Regards Afzal
August 21, 20232 yr Author IIUC the 2015 amendment you mentioned is the one for The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) - it doesn't mention 250W replacing 200W for two wheeled and removing the 1983 law applicability only on bicycles & tricycles. Regards Afzal It didn't even need to mention the 250 watts issue since that hadn't been illegal for 12 years and a ministerial order acknowledging that was issued on 13th April 2013. It's a mess as usual Afzal. The link you give covers the 250 watt aspect but makes no mention of the plating lable requirements or spelling out the detail of the removal of weight limits, only going on to give the authorisation by Claire Perry. The link I gave covers the labelling and other legal aspects and is also authorised by Perry. Why they couldn't do it neatly in one document I can guess at, to avoid acknowledging why we got into this mess. . Edited August 21, 20232 yr by flecc
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