New to e bikes and looking for one for 20km commute and bikepacking and touring. Im fit and usually do 5 day bike tours with all my gear, averaging 45 miles a day. I envisage using an ebike on minimal assist most of the time. My ideal range would be about 60 km. Not sure whether to go with a light bike with small battery so i could cycle unassisted or a heavier bike with bigger battery and more range. Budget about £2200. Any ideas ?

I am a cycle tourist and when I go the ebike route for a tourer, I shall convert my steel Dawes Super Galaxy because that is a bike that I know is comfortable to ride for many consecutive days.

 

Compare this to the trials and tribulations of finding a new tourer, ebike or otherwise.

Woosh Camino perhaps?

https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?camino

you can get about 50 miles with the 15AH battery, 60 miles with the 17AH battery.

The Camino is fully equipped with rack, mudguards and reasonably lightweight.

 

I've toured on a steel tourer for many years, and recently bought an ebike because I wasn't enjoying the hills as much as I used to. I camp when I tour, so it is fully loaded, and I use four panniers. If you do the same then you will run into the same difficulty that i had, which is that almost all ebikes seem to come with suspension forks. Those with rigid forks are usually carbon. I know you can fit panniers to suspension forks, but it is a bit of a bodge, and panniers on carbon forks is a no-no.

 

So I wanted rigid alloy forks with bosses for front panniers, and I searched far and wide ... and only found 2 ebikes that satsify that criterion. The Trek Allant+ 8. and the Koga eworld traveller. Maybe there are more now - I was searching back in January - but I don't think so.

 

You mention bikepacking as well as touring, so I am assuming that when touring rather than bikepacking you mean with a full complement of luggage.

 

If you do have lots of luggage, the bike is far more stable if you distribute the weight front and back, rather than having it all on the back. The alternative is to use a trailer.

 

Re the bike weight question, I would go for the bigger battery and longer range. I've found that with an ebike I want to go further than I used to...

 

On a slightly separate note it has surprised me how few ebikers seem to be into touring; there seem to be far more MTBers mand the FB ebike forums seem to be mainly populated with people in search of speed.

 

Good luck with your search!

I am a cycle tourist and when I go the ebike route for a tourer, I shall convert my steel Dawes Super Galaxy because that is a bike that I know is comfortable to ride for many consecutive days.

 

Compare this to the trials and tribulations of finding a new tourer, ebike or otherwise.

I agree. I have a hybrid I'm used to, pannier racks front and back. I just fitted a pair of cheap sprung forks, I just had to make a couple of triangular ish S/steel plates that fit the drop out, one hole for mudguard fixing, another to take the pannier leg, slot for the dropout.

I'm waiting for Mr [mention=6303]Woosh[/mention] 's boat to arrive with my Bbs01 and big battery. Come on lad, bribe those seamen with a few oars. Tell em to get a shift on, can't wait.

the container is in the 'Ever Greet' - it's unloading @ felixstowe at the moment.

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So I wanted rigid alloy forks with bosses for front panniers, and I searched far and wide ... and only found 2 ebikes that satsify that criterion. The Trek Allant+ 8. and the Koga eworld traveller. Maybe there are more now - I was searching back in January - but I don't think so.

 

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I've always fancied a Koga - I love the trad look. For those with deep pockets, Santos (Santosbikes.com) do a nice range of bikes suitable for touring including some with the Rohloff IGH and Belt drives - now where's my lottery ticket .

I've toured on a steel tourer for many years, and recently bought an ebike because I wasn't enjoying the hills as much as I used to. I camp when I tour, so it is fully loaded, and I use four panniers. If you do the same then you will run into the same difficulty that i had, which is that almost all ebikes seem to come with suspension forks. Those with rigid forks are usually carbon. I know you can fit panniers to suspension forks, but it is a bit of a bodge, and panniers on carbon forks is a no-no.

 

So I wanted rigid alloy forks with bosses for front panniers, and I searched far and wide ... and only found 2 ebikes that satsify that criterion. The Trek Allant+ 8. and the Koga eworld traveller. Maybe there are more now - I was searching back in January - but I don't think so.

 

You mention bikepacking as well as touring, so I am assuming that when touring rather than bikepacking you mean with a full complement of luggage.

 

If you do have lots of luggage, the bike is far more stable if you distribute the weight front and back, rather than having it all on the back. The alternative is to use a trailer.

 

Re the bike weight question, I would go for the bigger battery and longer range. I've found that with an ebike I want to go further than I used to...

 

On a slightly separate note it has surprised me how few ebikers seem to be into touring; there seem to be far more MTBers mand the FB ebike forums seem to be mainly populated with people in search of speed.

 

Good luck with your search!

I am using a hybrid set up, back panniers plus front bar harness and fork bags which would be ok with suspension forks and carbon forks. I agree that there seems to be a lack of distance touring and bikepacking e bikes. I find myself looking at e gravel bikes as a good compromise.

I've always fancied a Koga - I love the trad look. For those with deep pockets, Santos (Santosbikes.com) do a nice range of bikes suitable for touring including some with the Rohloff IGH and Belt drives - now where's my lottery ticket .

wow, yes those santos bikes look great, hadn't come across them. Maybe my browser knows my budget limits <g>

the container is in the 'Ever Greet' - it's unloading @ felixstowe at the moment.

 

Will that container also have the Gran Camino I've got my name on as well ?

 

Les

Here is another touring bike:

https://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bike/tour-de-fer-30-2020

 

Bikeradar genesis:

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/first-look-friday/box-one-prime-9-groupset/

 

Bikeradar reviews of Thorn touring bikes:

https://www.bikeradar.com/search/reviews/?q=thorn&sort=-relevance

Hope this helps

Edited August 2, 20205 yr by Raboa

I can give you my opinion on the light bike angle, but not for heavier bikes.

I've gone from a 20 year-old steel-framed Mercian audax/tourer to a basic Orbea Gain (D50). I was worried it was quite a big step down in quality, but I was pleasantly surprised.

 

The Orbea Gain frame and equipment is plenty good enough (not as good as Campag on a Mercian, but still perfectly usable), and the disc brakes are excellent. The only weak point I've found is the wheel build quality, which I've remedied (I'm near max weight for the bike, so I'm probably the issue, not the bike). It has mudguard and pannier mounting points too - vital.

 

The weight is slightly up on a steel tourer, by maybe 2Kg, which is noticeable but not intrusive once on the move.

 

If you're reasonably fit (as your description says you are), then you'll be able to ride mostly with no assistance, and just use it for some hills. On shallow inclines you'll be OK under your own steam. For average to steep hills, you'll find you need to put maybe 30-50% in. For really steep hills like 14% (1-in-7) or similar, then you'll be putting 50%+ in, so it's not a free ride. Lighter people can put in less effort than me, of course - less to drag up the hill.

 

In terms of range, if you're only using assistance on demand, then you can expect much more than 60Km - more like 60-80 miles because you're only using it for, say, 10-20% of the ride.

 

The other reasonable priced light bike I'd consider is the Boardman ADV8.9, but it's a tad more than £2200. The two main positive differences are 1) it's a Fazua mid-drive rather than rear hub so the assistance follows your torque (pedalling effort) rather than your wheel speed, and 2) you can remove the battery, which is more convenient for charging. My wife has the Boardman HYB8.9 and I'd say it's slightly better designed than the Orbea, the Fazua system is impressive, so I'd say it's probably worth the extra. The only reason I didn't get one was that a cheap Orbea threw itself upon me.

I can give you my opinion on the light bike angle, but not for heavier bikes.

I've gone from a 20 year-old steel-framed Mercian audax/tourer to a basic Orbea Gain (D50). I was worried it was quite a big step down in quality, but I was pleasantly surprised.

 

The Orbea Gain frame and equipment is plenty good enough (not as good as Campag on a Mercian, but still perfectly usable), and the disc brakes are excellent. The only weak point I've found is the wheel build quality, which I've remedied (I'm near max weight for the bike, so I'm probably the issue, not the bike). It has mudguard and pannier mounting points too - vital.

 

The weight is slightly up on a steel tourer, by maybe 2Kg, which is noticeable but not intrusive once on the move.

 

If you're reasonably fit (as your description says you are), then you'll be able to ride mostly with no assistance, and just use it for some hills. On shallow inclines you'll be OK under your own steam. For average to steep hills, you'll find you need to put maybe 30-50% in. For really steep hills like 14% (1-in-7) or similar, then you'll be putting 50%+ in, so it's not a free ride. Lighter people can put in less effort than me, of course - less to drag up the hill.

 

In terms of range, if you're only using assistance on demand, then you can expect much more than 60Km - more like 60-80 miles because you're only using it for, say, 10-20% of the ride.

 

The other reasonable priced light bike I'd consider is the Boardman ADV8.9, but it's a tad more than £2200. The two main positive differences are 1) it's a Fazua mid-drive rather than rear hub so the assistance follows your torque (pedalling effort) rather than your wheel speed, and 2) you can remove the battery, which is more convenient for charging. My wife has the Boardman HYB8.9 and I'd say it's slightly better designed than the Orbea, the Fazua system is impressive, so I'd say it's probably worth the extra. The only reason I didn't get one was that a cheap Orbea threw itself upon me.

Thanks for your advice it answered a lot of my questions. I forsee myself only using the assist for steep hills and cycling mostly under my own steam and that a heavier bike and battery would lessen my input and make me more reliant on the assist. I think i will be going for the lighter bikes like the Boardman or Ribble.

Thanks for your advice it answered a lot of my questions. I forsee myself only using the assist for steep hills and cycling mostly under my own steam and that a heavier bike and battery would lessen my input and make me more reliant on the assist. I think i will be going for the lighter bikes like the Boardman or Ribble.

I too would be tempted by these bikes from what I’ve read about the Fazua motor. However, for the same money you could buy a good spec traditional tourer (or use an existing one) and fit a lightweight kit like the Aikema 85SX. This is the setup I have (with my Thorn Tour) and it is working well. (Although I‘d always welcome an extra bike!)

Will that container also have the Gran Camino I've got my name on as well ?

 

Les

the Gran Camino is on the 'Ever Genius'.

Its current position is in the Bay of Biscay, Portugal coast.

I too would be tempted by these bikes from what I’ve read about the Fazua motor. However, for the same money you could buy a good spec traditional tourer (or use an existing one) and fit a lightweight kit like the Aikema 85SX. This is the setup I have (with my Thorn Tour) and it is working well. (Although I‘d always welcome an extra bike!)

 

Good point! I did look into converting my Mercian with a mid-drive conversion (the Tongsheng TSDZ2), but the gear cables running (very tidily) under the bottom bracket messed that option up for me. I've chosen to leave the Mercian alone and sell it to a younger owner, rather than hack it about too much.

the Gran Camino is on the 'Ever Genius'.

Its current position is in the Bay of Biscay, Portugal coast.

Do you have any information on the whereabouts of the container bringing the next consignment of Rambletta folders by any chance?

Not yet. I'll get the shipping info next week.

I think i will be going for the lighter bikes like the Boardman or Ribble.

 

I agree the Ribble SLe looks good if you want to go light - 12.4Kg for a Medium frame is what they quote. Or if you want a little extra strength, maybe the CGR Al e gravel one at 13.8Kg. They both use the same Mahle ebikemotion system as the Orbea, so the same pros and cons go with them in terms of rear hub and non-removable battery.

 

On the Fazua front, the other sub-£3k make I've noticed is Canyon. It's worth noting that the Canyon has the newer design of the Fazua battery lock compared to the the Boardman. Not a showstopper for me, but for some people the original battery lock can be fiddly to use - you need some thumb strength to push the release button AND big hands to catch the battery as it drops out of the frame. (You can retro-fit the new lock to a Boardman if need be, at something like £100ish, or check if they have the new lock design fitted yet.)

the Gran Camino is on the 'Ever Genius'.

Its current position is in the Bay of Biscay, Portugal coast.

 

Blimey sounds like the Admiral (Hattie )has got her whole fleet at sea .

They will be queuing up at the Stow to berth.

Woosh has some busy times ahead or just around the corner.

the Gran Camino is on the 'Ever Genius'.

Its current position is in the Bay of Biscay, Portugal coast.

 

Oh god, I've just realised I can track the bloody ship

Oh god, I've just realised I can track the bloody ship

 

But surely you will wan't to know the container # as well.

the container is in the 'Ever Greet' - it's unloading @ felixstowe at the moment.

 

Right, first post time (long time reader - thanks for all the knowledge everyone). I can't resist getting in on all this ship chat. Were the latest batch of Caminos also on the Ever Greet?

 

I'm also really curious as to what happens next. I'm picturing a lorry driving down from Felixstowe with a shipping container full of bike bits and dumping it outside your shop, but I suspect that's not quite it!

Woosh Camino perhaps?

https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?camino

you can get about 50 miles with the 15AH battery, 60 miles with the 17AH battery.

The Camino is fully equipped with rack, mudguards and reasonably lightweight.

 

These are really nice looking bikes, wish I had seen these before!

If you want a branded heavy (23.5kg) touring bike then the Cube Touring model bikes are good value and will easily have the range you need. Costs are in £1500-£2200 range generally.

 

Just make sure you get one with zero resist (which here means Bosch ALP or latest gen Bosch Performance motors) so you only have to pedal when tired, on a bad surface or going uphill.

 

I've done about 6000km on mine without a squeak in the past 1.5 years. It is bombproof.

I commute with it, I tour with it on flat and up hills, I pick up bread from the localbakery on it and I use it as my exercise bike on quick evening fitness loops (with motor off obviously).

 

Search my name on YouTube for a couple of video reviews of mine if you like.

 

The lighter bikes (like the Orbea Gain) tend to be based on road bikes rather than what I think of 'touring' environments - which to me means a lot of off-road - rivers, canals, woods, paths of all sorts, but not pure MTB territory.

 

The lighter bikes with lighter motors are great for good tarmac and better for commuting on roads/good cycle paths but may struggle a bit on more robust surfaces.

Edited August 6, 20205 yr by Andy McNish