June 10, 201015 yr Hi All, Stephen has contacted us looking for feedback to help him develop his idea of electric assistance via the pedals. A brief bit of background from Stephen: I have been developing a cycle assistance kit that will fit any bike, for about 3 years. I have won several awards. The Hub finds new innovations at U. Brighton - News - East Sussex Enterprise Hub - Hastings - Eastbourne - Business Support I have entered a Barclays business award 'Take One Small Step'. In order to develop and manufacture the product. Please have a look at my entry for further details about this new type of assistance product. https://www.takeonesmallstep.co.uk/Entry/View/2462 --- Also see attached PDF files.Fast pg1.pdfFast pg2.pdf
June 10, 201015 yr when I first saw talk of this I looked at the date to see if it was an April fools....But I think the penny has dropped and if something like the Gruber works maybe this can as well? Who knows! I guess the pedals would be geared and they would turn the crank? it has taken a while for me to get my head around it but I think I now kind off see it....... So it could provide a back up /get you home system if retro fitted to an existing e bike as well I guess.
June 10, 201015 yr Me too, I just could not see how this could possibly work at first. I presume that your feet have to resist the torque of the pedals - something they do not have to do in normal pedalling? Put bluntly (and I might be being really thick here) won't it make your ankles ache? I would love to be proven wrong though, it could be a very elegant minimal power assist. Would it work best with long (fore and aft) pedals?
June 10, 201015 yr While I'm sure that powering the pedals in this way would "assist", surely the amount of assistance is going to be quite small, and/or very short lived. It's hard to see how such a system can provide comparable assistance in either power or duration to one with batteries 10 to 20 times the weight.
June 11, 201015 yr Actually I think he maybe on to something here, what about the regeneration possibilities via a e-connected crank? Or using his system with a big battery connected via a e-connected rolling crank? seems possible.
June 11, 201015 yr Nice idea - cant work very well Cannot get enough power to be useful from motors that small - if you could get enough power through the pedal - then surely the pedal will rotate against the riders shoe rather than drive the pedal - and would also be an uncomfortable experience. Also range will be in yards rather than miles I would have thought!!
June 11, 201015 yr Interesting idea. If your feet slip of the pedals, do they spin round wildly like a thing possesed? I winced at the thought of slipping off these and them spinning under their own power against my shins (brings back bad memories of bear trap pedals from my youth). Could we have a bit more technical info on how they work and some specs?
June 11, 201015 yr Although I share mj8765's view on these, thinking the idea impractical and far too low in range and power, it's important to recognise it's just something in development at present so may well develop to answer at least some of the criticisms. .
June 11, 201015 yr What next? motorized calipers that strap to our knee's? Not part of the bicycle so no restrictions on power or weight.
June 11, 201015 yr What next? motorized calipers that strap to our knee's? Not part of the bicycle so no restrictions on power or weight. Yup... Japanese robot suit
June 11, 201015 yr Ian Goodyer, Hub Consultant at the East Sussex Enterprise Hub, was a judge in the Graduate Innovation category at this years U. Brighton Innovation Awards. The winner of the category was Stephen Britt for an electric bike innovation. Powered by batteries, it has a motor and a gearbox to control a bike for around 10 miles. The light-weight system allows the full range of gears to be used, giving it high efficiency and making it good at climbing hills. Stephen said: “The idea formed after being stuck in traffic for 90 weeks while a bridge was built as part of the Beddingham roundabout improvements.” Stephen Britt also shared the Entrepreneurship Award with business studies students, Lauren Goggs, Matt Hacker, Ioanna Zacharis and Emma Brand for their pay as you pedal scheme, which provides a solution to the city’s congested roads. Ian said after the event "The hub is always on the lookout for great, new propositions and the university’s innovation awards are a rich source of ideas. Following on from the awards we often support a number of entrepreneurs and help them to bring their products and services to market.” 3 Jul 2009 Phew, I think I could have solved world hunger if I was in stuck for that long !
June 11, 201015 yr I'd prefer Pedals that do not need a bike, but gently fly you to your destination. Next time I'm in a traffic jam 'll try to solve the extension lead problem. But seriously, I do hope this plan is a step in the right direction. I would hope for more details or a working prototype, though.
June 12, 201015 yr Cannot get enough power to be useful from motors that small The motors used for RC planes / cars etc. are getting pretty serious nowadays, picked at random on a search, this 39mm diameter motor can take 1200 watts continuous - Typhoon 700-60 1865KV brushless motor Some RC motors are certainly powerful enough to drive a bicycle, there's a youtube video of someone who did that but I can't find it right now. However I do wonder how putting the motors in pedals will help, you'd have to have some smartly programmed microprocessor to only spin the pedals when a foot is on them and the crank is turning. Wouldn't want to get my shins sliced up by an out of control spinning pedal!
June 12, 201015 yr The motors used for RC planes / cars etc. are getting pretty serious nowadays, picked at random on a search, this 39mm diameter motor can take 1200 watts continuous While true, they still consume that amount of juice plus about 25% for inefficiencies, so those tiny batteries in the pedal sides would be emptied in minutes with a high power motor. Battery technology hasn't advanced anywhere near as much as motor design. Also high output/small motor means proportionately higher levels of noise, we hear this on the GoCycle with its tiny hub motor's annoying buzzing sound. These would be worse if usefully powered. I think this design will turn out to have very low power and short range, nowhere near enough of either to satisfy most e-bikers. . Edited June 12, 201015 yr by flecc
June 12, 201015 yr Fast Forward Hello Pedelecs, Sorry for the late responce. This thread has only just come to my attention. The aim is to get the pedals to do 10 miles plus range. Target group is the cycle commuter market. Target power will be 100W per pedal (I can already hear the debate begin as to if this equates to 200W total, it does, measure each of your legs output...). As one person here has suggested, this power is easily done with a modern brussless motor. The batteries are shrinking all the time. There is a pair of working prototypes, thought not to this specification. First you have proof of concept, then development, finally an early production model, etc. I have spent a lot of my low income on patenting the idea. The idea does need development, that is why I am trying to win the money. Please help by voting for me, or all your e-bikes will come from China. Best wishes, Stephen Britt.
June 12, 201015 yr Good luck Steve. I gave you my vote, even if I have my doubts. Better dream and fail than not try at all. Would it not be much easier and cheaper to use a small motor to create a motoised crank or axel that will fit many standard bikes? A 400 watt tandem will be flying by soon. cheers. Hello Pedelecs, Sorry for the late responce. This thread has only just come to my attention. The aim is to get the pedals to do 10 miles plus range. Target group is the cycle commuter market. Target power will be 100W per pedal (I can already hear the debate begin as to if this equates to 200W total, it does, measure each of your legs output...). As one person here has suggested, this power is easily done with a modern brussless motor. The batteries are shrinking all the time. There is a pair of working prototypes, thought not to this specification. First you have proof of concept, then development, finally an early production model, etc. I have spent a lot of my low income on patenting the idea. The idea does need development, that is why I am trying to win the money. Please help by voting for me, or all your e-bikes will come from China. Best wishes, Stephen Britt.
June 12, 201015 yr Hello Pedelecs, Target power will be 100W per pedal (I can already hear the debate begin as to if this equates to 200W total, it does, measure each of your legs output...). Yes, I agree Stephen, if the pedals are constantly driving their spindles the power is continuous throughout the arc on both, so totalling 200 watts continuously. Of course if they only worked on foot downthrust via pressure switching, it could be somewhat less, but I trust they won't be working that way or that the pressure switching will need minimal force. .
June 12, 201015 yr Fast Forward Thanks flecc, I have been a long time reader of your site, and comments on this site. Your page on the LaFree, broken down and explained was a real help in considerations of all things e-bike for me. My starting point with this idea was when I was sitting at home and playing with a pedal bought from Halfords. When you turn the spindle (pedal when fitted), a micro generator flashes LED's. I wondered what would happen if the process was reversed. Power fed into a motor from batteries. I started with a very crude prototype composed of a Mac Alister cordless screwdriver and the end of a folding pedal. I did about a mile, but the batteries were small and once the construction stops, the axel locks, continued pedaling unscrews the assembly. So a freewheel was added. I added two tubes full of nimh batteries from Maha, very good but too big for my application. Motors have been upgraded, li-ion batteries fitted, better gearbox. The next step if I get the money is to go to Brushless DC (which I am playing with but no full prorotype yet) and a pic microcontroller based controll system. Again this is coming together but not in the pedal yet. As flecc says, the pressure sensor will not be the whole deal, there will also be RPM sensing, so that the torque will build with speed up to the maximum, much like the Lafree did. I have attended workshops and competitions to broaden my outlook and raise funds. I have been really fortunate and met some good people. CommercialiSE Business Planning Competition Cohort 4 The Hub finds new innovations at U. Brighton - News - East Sussex Enterprise Hub - Hastings - Eastbourne - Business Support The winnings and saving have all been put into the development and IP of the project. The money that I had saved for a newer car paid for a UK patent application. My Nissan Micra has now done over 130,000 miles.... If I win, the money will all be used for development and some marketing. I will not draw a wage in year 1. In Yr 2, I will need investment for producing the first pedals. When I have early production examples, I would really appreciate feedback. Best wishes, Stephen
July 15, 201015 yr Congratulations are in order Electric pedals win Barclays' cash | Bicycle business | News by BikeBiz
July 16, 201015 yr Congratulations! I still cant fathom how it works though! :o There seems to be a trend of electic bikes becoming less obvious with discrete motors and batteries.
July 16, 201015 yr There seems to be a trend of electic bikes becoming less obvious with discrete motors and batteries. Mark Cavendish has a battery up his jumper and 1.5kw motors in each foot which transfer power to the pedals - the authorities haven't sussed it yet, but I know what I know. Colin
July 16, 201015 yr Mark Cavendish has a battery up his **** How does he charge it ? It's fuel cells doing the charging, supplied by the methane gas! .
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