July 18, 20232 yr Hello all, I've recently been considering a Swytch conversion kit for one of my bikes. Looking for reviews etc led me to this site and I'm currently reading threads to see if there's a better alternative given the time it takes to get a Swytch kit and the dubious customer support I'm reading about. I'd appreciate some suggestions of what alternatives might be out there. The bike I'd be converting is a Thorn Raven with a Rohloff rear hub, which is why I'm looking at a front wheel conversion. It's all steel tube and has a steel fork and 26" wheels. It's set up as a touring bike with pannier rack and bar bag, though the bar bag is on an extender because I have On-One Geoff handle bars. I'm 57 and while I'm very active, over the past few years I've become fairly unfit and have developed a knee issue so I'm not running these days. Cycling is a good option to try and rebuild some fitness. However, I live on a farm in very hilly north Devon, you need to be fit just to go anywhere with our hills. I'm looking at the e-bike conversion so that I can get some assistance on hills while being able to turn it off when on the flat so I can work on my fitness but still make it up hills with assistance when needed to save getting off and walking. I also would like to use it for picking up shopping from the local town to save using the car sometimes but I don't currently because with the extra weight of shopping in the panniers it's just more than I can manage getting home up the hills. Range wise, I think up to 30-40 miles max would be plenty for shopping and local days out as I wouldn't use the power all the time. When I've regained some fitness, I'd like to go back to doing some touring again so would just remove the battery and change out the front wheel for the one I currently have with a Schmitt dynohub to give me lights at night and charge my phone, so a kit that's modular and with easily removed parts is wanted. I'm pretty capable mechanically, I built up my old triathlon bike from scratch components in the past, I'm renovating an old car and know electrics, having built amplifiers etc from components as well so I don't expect there to be anything I can't manage if I were to buy either a kit or individual parts. I have a pretty well equipped workshop on the farm. So, any suggestions of kits that might fit the bill would be appreciated, along with personal opinions on the Swytch kit as well as I'm on their waiting list and so like the look of what they're offering, it's just the backup and order time that seems a bit worrying. Many thanks, Jay.
July 18, 20232 yr https://www.cogsygogs.co.uk/shop/mid-drive-motors/bafang-bbs01b-250w-36v-mid-drive-electric-bike-motor-conversion-kit-with-display-c961/ https://www.cogsygogs.co.uk/shop/batteries/lithium-ebike-battery-48v-13ah-cn-cellsebike-batteries-uk/ hub motors are no good for steep hills
July 18, 20232 yr Author The bike has an eccentric bottom bracket for chain tensioning because of the Rohloff hub, so rear hub or mid drive motors can’t be fitted. It’s front hub motor or nothing I think.
July 18, 20232 yr Depends how steep and how long , my bafang cst had no issue with Ditchling beacon climb averaging 9% and with 16% in a couple of places.
July 18, 20232 yr Depends how steep and how long , my bafang cst had no issue with Ditchling beacon climb averaging 9% and with 16% in a couple of places. Is your Bafang CST the 350W or 500W rated version? Or is there a 250W Bafang CST? https://bmsbattery.com/ebike/589-16524-bafang-36v-cst-rear-driving-e-bike-motor-wheel-ebike-kit.html#/348-voltage_power-36v350w Edited July 18, 20232 yr by guerney
July 18, 20232 yr Is your Bafang CST the 350W or 500W version? Or is there a 250W? https://bmsbattery.com/ebike/589-16524-bafang-36v-cst-rear-driving-e-bike-motor-wheel-ebike-kit.html#/348-voltage_power-36v350w There's a 250w version. they were fitted to the first Oxygen MTB. You used to see them on Aliexpress too, though I haven't seen them for a while. There's also a Xofo and MXUS clone.
July 18, 20232 yr hub motors are no good for steep hills Especially when you need to get up them ASAP! Legal rated 250W hub drives anwyay. Sod it, I'm never buying one. [mention=24131]Bonzo Banana[/mention] keeps going on about how wonderful hub drives are, complains about awful mid drives.... all while powering about using a 500W hub driven bike. Of course he's not going to have much problem getting up hills with an illegal 500W rated motor. I'd have been completely stuffed the other night, if I'd converted using any 250W rated legal hub. A younger, stronger and fitter cyclist using a legal hub, might have managed to escape being "grabbed" by a thug giving chase uphill. It's a good thing I converted my Dahon Helios P8 folding bike, using a BBS01B. Legal hub drives clearly aren't suitable for everyone. I don't think I'm ever buying one: https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/bike-chased-late-friday-night-by-loons.45686/ Edited July 19, 20232 yr by guerney
July 18, 20232 yr https://highvoltagekits.com/lightning-rods-electric-motors that will kick a sur rons ass , it will also destroy everything at warp speed some one should put one in a washing machine with some bricks in it
July 19, 20232 yr https://www.cogsygogs.co.uk/shop/mid-drive-motors/bafang-bbs01b-250w-36v-mid-drive-electric-bike-motor-conversion-kit-with-display-c961/ https://www.cogsygogs.co.uk/shop/batteries/lithium-ebike-battery-48v-13ah-cn-cellsebike-batteries-uk/ hub motors are no good for steep hills How does a Tesla get up hills then? I have hub-motor bikes that would leave yours for dead up any hill you choose, and what's more, I'll give you a chance by not pedalling. Don't forget that legal hub-motors won every race at the Bristol hill climbing races.
July 19, 20232 yr How does a Tesla get up hills then? I have hub-motor bikes that would leave yours for dead up any hill you choose, and what's more, I'll give you a chance by not pedalling. Don't forget that legal hub-motors won every race at the Bristol hill climbing races. How many amps would a legal Bafang CST rated 250W need, in order to match the Bafang BBS01B's climbing ability? Assume the BBS01B controller is limited to 15A. I was going to convert my Dahon Espresso with a rear hub. I don't think I'll bother now. I'd get duffed up and stabbed by thugs, and my bike'd get "grabbed" on a hill. Edited July 19, 20232 yr by guerney
July 19, 20232 yr tesla use mid drive motors front and rear and loads on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225513000118?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338749392&toolid=20006&customid=GB_131090_225513000118.145628799569~1924592780607-g_Cj0KCQjw8NilBhDOARIsAHzpbLDI-9_Irlcrnn8ikHfAaoZ2BxUo7yMGv-Cb6D4KpS1TMX9xQL1oFbAaAsoSEALw_wcB and if you want a race on the flat i can hit 40mph with 120rpm from my legs on top the only thing i cant beat is that fkn bafang hd i only got 20 amp controller and a shunt mod to the batt is not a option this is his new bike just the controller is fooked. https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/emtb-owners-photo-and-ride-thread.24089/page-138#post-686482
July 19, 20232 yr This Koenigsegg looks small enough to be installed on a bicycle. It's not a legal rated 250W motor either. https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a38940998/koenigsegg-quark-electric-motor/ Edited July 19, 20232 yr by guerney
July 19, 20232 yr wont go very far going 200mph tho will it battle bots has a 3 min limit cos the batts are shite. 4-500amp 52v limit i think tho you can run the amps as high as you can but wepon speed must not be faster than 250mph. if you have a batt to run at 52v and 5000 amps it will be like 8000nm and would destroy everything https://newatlas.com/automotive/hyperpower-high-density-electric-motor-hyperloop/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq6T5BojXc8:153 you want you tube views you blow $hit up or risk ur life
July 19, 20232 yr Before the OP gets fed up with all this willie-waving, here are the choices I think he has, bearing in mind that a Rohloff hub rules out a mid-drive and a rear hub motor:- 1) Cytronex - Well made and very neat installation. Unique controller integrated into bottle battery means that you are tied to them for spares or repairs. Limited functions and it's rather expensive for what it is. 2) Yosepower - Good value for money. I have fitted two rear hub kits and they perform well. Good email support from China. Cables are very long and a bit of a challenge to install neatly. 3 day shipping from UK warehouse. 3) Woosh - Well specified kits and cabling made to suit vendors bike. Excellent support and based in UK. All can supply front hub kits. I would suggest that buying from Woosh would be the best option. With a choice of motors they should be able to recommend a motor suitable for your needs. Hopefully Woosh will be along shortly as he regularly contributes. From all I have read here and elswhere about Swytch I'm glad I didn't buy one of their kits. Edited July 19, 20232 yr by Cadence
July 19, 20232 yr Range wise, I think up to 30-40 miles max would be plenty for shopping and local days out as I wouldn't use the power all the time Welcome SafetyThird Please visit Woosh Web site. At reasonable price they offer kits and advice customers according to your needs. Yose Power if you want something decent but also cheap. I use front hub motor and have no problems on hills while riding on road. Off road is a different story. I suggest you stay away from Swytch. Edit: Cadence was faster with his reply
July 19, 20232 yr I third the Woosh suggestion. To see the Woosh options go to https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?hubkits, and search 'Which Motor?' To get an idea of what the XF07 can do, see https://ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html?motor=MXUS_XF07&batt=B3614_PF&grade=10&axis=mph&hp=50&cont=cust_17_70_0.03_V You can change details such as total weight, how much effort you can put in, and gradient. We have an XF07 on our tandem. It is underpowered for that as we were advised when we bought it, but was the only appropriate legal option easily available at the time; the BPM and Yose alternatives were all 350w. As you will see from the graphs, power output falls a lot as you slow to say 6mph.
July 19, 20232 yr Hello all, I've recently been considering a Swytch conversion kit for one of my bikes. One point to note is that for the newer Swytch kit there has been a number of people posting on here about how to connect generic batteries to the Swytch conversion to provide extra range. So far no-one seems to have managed to do it. You say you live in 'very hilly north Devon' and want 30-40 miles of range, for sure you will not get that on a Swytch MAX battery, so you would probably need to buy and carry two more, not cheap. For the kits mentioned on here, you have a fair bit of choice battery wise, buy the size that suits your range, with maybe a smaller one as a spare.
July 19, 20232 yr Hello all, I've recently been considering a Swytch conversion kit for one of my bikes. Looking for reviews etc led me to this site and I'm currently reading threads to see if there's a better alternative given the time it takes to get a Swytch kit and the dubious customer support I'm reading about. I'd appreciate some suggestions of what alternatives might be out there. The bike I'd be converting is a Thorn Raven with a Rohloff rear hub, which is why I'm looking at a front wheel conversion. It's all steel tube and has a steel fork and 26" wheels. It's set up as a touring bike with pannier rack and bar bag, though the bar bag is on an extender because I have On-One Geoff handle bars. I'm 57 and while I'm very active, over the past few years I've become fairly unfit and have developed a knee issue so I'm not running these days. Cycling is a good option to try and rebuild some fitness. However, I live on a farm in very hilly north Devon, you need to be fit just to go anywhere with our hills. I'm looking at the e-bike conversion so that I can get some assistance on hills while being able to turn it off when on the flat so I can work on my fitness but still make it up hills with assistance when needed to save getting off and walking. I also would like to use it for picking up shopping from the local town to save using the car sometimes but I don't currently because with the extra weight of shopping in the panniers it's just more than I can manage getting home up the hills. Range wise, I think up to 30-40 miles max would be plenty for shopping and local days out as I wouldn't use the power all the time. When I've regained some fitness, I'd like to go back to doing some touring again so would just remove the battery and change out the front wheel for the one I currently have with a Schmitt dynohub to give me lights at night and charge my phone, so a kit that's modular and with easily removed parts is wanted. I'm pretty capable mechanically, I built up my old triathlon bike from scratch components in the past, I'm renovating an old car and know electrics, having built amplifiers etc from components as well so I don't expect there to be anything I can't manage if I were to buy either a kit or individual parts. I have a pretty well equipped workshop on the farm. So, any suggestions of kits that might fit the bill would be appreciated, along with personal opinions on the Swytch kit as well as I'm on their waiting list and so like the look of what they're offering, it's just the backup and order time that seems a bit worrying. Many thanks, Jay. Hello Jay, Front hub conversion is about the only practical for the Thorn Raven with Rohloff hub gears because of the lump under the bottom bracket. For 30-40 hilly Devonshire miles, I suggest you fit the XF07 with at least 15AH just in case you have to limp home on throttle alone. This XF07 kit comes with 36V 20AH downtube battery and a 17A controller, good enough for up to 80 miles: https://wooshbikes.co.uk/cart/#/product/uid-197-xf07kit-20ah/xf07-front-hub-kit-with-20ah-dp-downtube-battery If you are interested, please email kits@wooshbikes.co.uk
July 19, 20232 yr Author Good morning everyone, and thank you all for such helpful replies, that's certainly given me much to consider. Guerney, I'm so sorry you've had to deal with such dreadful people and very glad you were able to get away from them. After reading everything, it confirms that a front hub is the only option with my bike so [mention=6303]Woosh[/mention] I'll be in touch with you later today to see what we can put together to suit my needs. I'll be sure to post up here when I have a solution and then as I put it all together.
July 19, 20232 yr @Woosh I'll be in touch with you later today to see what we can put together to suit my needs. it's fairly straightforward to install, no drilling hole! Andy can get the kit out to you this afternoon and you could be riding electric this weekend!
July 19, 20232 yr Especially when you need to get up them ASAP! Legal rated 250W hub drives anwyay. Sod it, I'm never buying one. [mention=24131]Bonzo Banana[/mention] keeps going on about how wonderful hub drives are, complains about awful mid drives.... all while powering about using a 500W hub driven bike. Of course he's not going to have much problem getting up hills with an illegal 500W rated motor. I'd have been completely stuffed the other night, if I'd converted using any 250W rated legal hub. A younger, stronger and fitter cyclist using a legal hub, might have managed to escape being "grabbed" by a thug giving chase uphill. It's a good thing I converted my Dahon Helios P8 folding bike, using a BBS01B. Legal hub drives clearly aren't suitable for everyone. I don't think I'm ever buying one: https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/bike-chased-late-friday-night-by-loons.45686/ Why do you keep writing such nonsense? Most kit mid-drive motors and many hub motors exceed the 250W rating, that is only 7A at 36V. Almost everything is illegal in the ebike kit world they just restrict it to 15.5mph and give a fake 250W rating label. How many people have a ebike restricted to 7A current with perhaps short time boosts to 11A? Bosch ebikes can be at 22A at 36V climbing hills for a prolonged period until heat issues. There are plenty of mid-drive motors that aren't great hill climbing bikes and there are many high powered hub motors that can achieve around 60Nm which puts them in the same territory as many non e-mountain bike mid-drive motors. Again I do have a Tosheng mid drive motor I just don't see the point in it for general riding with the extra complexity and accelerated drivetrain wear for longer trips it makes the bike less reliable which is not what you want when a long way from home. The Rohloff and front hub motor will be a fantastic combination it will massively reduce wear on the Rohloff because now when hill climbing the front hub motor will take a lot of wear of it. This will massively extend its working lifespan. It's a brilliant combination and I would say the ideal combination. Rohloff's do fail at times and probably almost guaranteed to fail with a mid-drive motor where high torque output is combined with the riders own power to perhaps give 4-5x the normal power through the Rohloff. It was not designed for that.
July 19, 20232 yr The Rohloff and front hub motor will be a fantastic combination I agree. It's not possible to fit a Bafang BBS01 or a TSDZ2 to the Thorn Raven because it has excentric bottom bracket and the lock nut for the BB is on the underside of the BB shell.
July 19, 20232 yr A front hub on stepp hills may produce some wheel slip though depends on how much cuurent is put through it. My rear hub Bafang CST had no issue getting me up Ditchling beacon 6 or 7 years ago from the very bottom, 9% average, a couple of 16% in places.
July 19, 20232 yr A front hub on stepp hills may produce some wheel slip though depends on how much cuurent is put through it. How much current is a Bafang CST capable of reliably withstanding, without bursting into flames and/or melting? My rear hub Bafang CST had no issue getting me up Ditchling beacon 6 or 7 years ago from the very bottom, 9% average, a couple of 16% in places. Using just throttle? My BBS01B did that with just throttle right out of the box (before I discovered throttles were illegal), admittedly on a bike with 20" wheels. Is your CST marked 250W by the manufacturer?
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.