Some advice needed please...

AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
I have not heard about the outer case screws and I think most of these are hex machine screws so you can get a good purchase on them? I think some regular maintenance is required anyway so by my thinking, if they are not left in situ for years without even being removed maybe you could have a problem. However, I have heard about the screws that hold the internal motor in place seizing. These are not hex and apparently have heads made of a soft cheese like substance. You need to be able to remove these if and when you need to replace the blue gear - I think these are candidates for replacement if you are likely to not perform regular maintenance? No 1st hand experience mind you. I do think the needle bearing is noisy on my unit so I have a replacement blue gear, may get around to fitting at the weekend...
Those may well be the ones I read about somewhere. If they are indeed soft or likely to become a problem at some point then best to change them to something better when in there. It is certainly something I will keep in mind for the first time I have cause to open mine up and changing them to something you can get a good purchase on when needs must is no bad thing.

All the best,

AJ
 

Bogmonster666

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2022
263
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It’s a 48v 14.5ah Hailong cased battery with Samsung cells which I am hoping will suit the 750w motor well in terms of being sufficient for a day out in the forest.
Lots of variables but the New Forest isn't known for its big hills. I'm getting 60+ miles range in a moderately hilly area but I'm also putting in a moderate amount of effort. That's with a 10ah 48v battery with Samsung cells.

Obviously it depends how far you want to go on a day's ride and how much effort you are prepared to put in, but I would expect a minimum of 60+ miles with that battery on the flat.
 
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Bogmonster666

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Jun 6, 2022
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Regarding the bearings, I would have to open the case and thereby void the warranty on a brand new motor. Is it worth taking that risk at this stage or should I wait?
The bearings can I think be added without opening the case, at least two of the three. I plan to do just this but no time before holiday. Sooner or later you will need to open the case for maintenance, depending on your supplier, they may or may not still honour the warranty. Given that a degree of maintenance is required then I think reputable suppliers will support you so long as you don't do anything stupid. My supplier suggested I replace the blue gear and supplied one under warranty so I'm guessing they are ok with me opening the case.
 

Bogmonster666

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2022
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I don’t need speed so much as I need hill climbing ability so maybe a smaller chain ring and a few more gears on the cassette
I need to chang my gearing, but a lot depends on your hills. I regularly need to climb long 16% hills so my current 28t cassette and stock chainring are a bit too highly geared. I only currently have 7 speed. I'm 1st going to try a 32t cassette and 36t chainring - that should easily get me up those hills. I don't particularly feel a need to tackle the really steep local hill which is a sustained 25% killer...
 

AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
Lots of variables but the New Forest isn't known for its big hills. I'm getting 60+ miles range in a moderately hilly area but I'm also putting in a moderate amount of effort. That's with a 10ah 48v battery with Samsung cells.

Obviously it depends how far you want to go on a day's ride and how much effort you are prepared to put in, but I would expect a minimum of 60+ miles with that battery on the flat.
From your experience, I expect that the battery I have bought for my wife's bike to be more than enough. There's no chance she will cover any more than 10 to 15 miles at most and even thought the paths are hilly, the battery should still have sufficient capacity to meet those needs. She will of course put in some effort herself to help out but initially she will probably be on the higher assistance settings until her level of fitness improves.

Thanks very much for that information. It is very helpful for a novice indeed.

AJ
 

AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
The bearings can I think be added without opening the case, at least two of the three. I plan to do just this but no time before holiday. Sooner or later you will need to open the case for maintenance, depending on your supplier, they may or may not still honour the warranty. Given that a degree of maintenance is required then I think reputable suppliers will support you so long as you don't do anything stupid. My supplier suggested I replace the blue gear and supplied one under warranty so I'm guessing they are ok with me opening the case.
I bought mine from PSW Power simply because I am on a tight budget, I have two bikes to convert and their price was the best I could find for both the motor and the battery. I contacted them after placing my order with concerns about the measurements given for the battery. They were very courteous, sent me what I needed and offered to change the battery if it didn't suit. they also gave me permission to open the packaging and test fit it to see if I could make it fit.

I think given that it is a Samsung battery and it is the cheapest one I could find in 48v, I'll figure something out with it. I will certainly look at adding those bearings. It's a cheap bit of peace of mind and a very good idea. I believe there is a particular brand of expensive grease that is preferred for the motors too. I'll have to look into that as well.

Thanks again,

AJ
 
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AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
I need to chang my gearing, but a lot depends on your hills. I regularly need to climb long 16% hills so my current 28t cassette and stock chainring are a bit too highly geared. I only currently have 7 speed. I'm 1st going to try a 32t cassette and 36t chainring - that should easily get me up those hills. I don't particularly feel a need to tackle the really steep local hill which is a sustained 25% killer...
I'm not particularly well versed on road gradients and without that experience I cannot tell you what gradients I ride on but you show clearly that there are options. I will see how my wife's bike performs and will hopefully find out very soon. I could always strip my own bike down and fit the Tongsheng to it first and try it out with the tagalong etc attached but it has three or four cables running under the bottom bracket which I know are going to be a pain. What exactly to do with them is another area I have yet to research.

All the best to you and thank you for taking the time to reply,

AJ
 

pedalfettal

Pedelecer
Jan 3, 2022
44
23
There is an oil seal on each side of the spindle. The support bearings are a straight swap for them. No dismantling required.

On my properly set up double with ten speed on a road bike with narrow Q-factor I could only really use 8 + 8. The tdsz has a much wider q-f so the chain line is impacted - hence 6 + 6.

The tdsz has a bcd of 110mm - so plenty of options for chain ring sizes - I buy used ones from ebay. Best course of action is to try it with what you already have - get experience and then experiment.

By the way, I recommend weighted squats for your knees - you might only need to strengthen the supporting muscles and tendons. Orthotic insoles might help straighten your stance and improve your gait.
 
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Bogmonster666

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2022
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I have arthritis in my knees and need to pedal enough to build up strength in the area but equally I need to do so without straining too much and damaging myself further in the process which am told is something I must avoid.
I would fit the motor and try the 7 speed before deciding on next move. You may find a bigger cassette (depending on your current cassette) and a single smaller chainring (e.g. 36t) will be sufficient. It will limit your top speed, but I get the impression that's not so important to you?

The above is what I am going to try - and you can then try the single chainring on the inside and outside positions to get an idea of how the chainline is if you do decide to go for double chainring setup.

I have re-injured my ankle from overdoing the cycling, I had a very nasty sprain and avulsion fracture after a climbing accident 9 months ago and it has not been the same since it's very easy to get over enthusiastic and push too hard...
 

AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
There is an oil seal on each side of the spindle. The support bearings are a straight swap for them. No dismantling required.
That is an improvement then I am going to make as soon as I get the bearings. Is it one extra per side then?

On my properly set up double with ten speed on a road bike with narrow Q-factor I could only really use 8 + 8. The tdsz has a much wider q-f so the chain line is impacted - hence 6 + 6.
I have to admit I don’t understand what you mean here. Am I correct in thinking that when you say for instance 8 + 8 you mean that you could only avail of 8 out of the ten gears on your cassette on each of your two chain rings i.e. 8 gears using the larger chain ring and 8 gears using the smaller?

The tdsz has a bcd of 110mm - so plenty of options for chain ring sizes - I buy used ones from ebay.
Plenty of different ones to experiment with for as little money as possible. That’s a good idea!

Best course of action is to try it with what you already have - get experience and then experiment.
I believe you are correct. See what I’ve got first and build upon that until I get it where I feel it is as good as can be.

By the way, I recommend weighted squats for your knees - you might only need to strengthen the supporting muscles and tendons. Orthotic insoles might help straighten your stance and improve your gait.
It’s been a problem for quite a few years now but I only recently went to see what was going on with it. Using stairs, getting up off the floor, pulling my boots on, pressing down the clutch in the van etc etc were oftentimes painful and always irritating. If you’ve even seen a giraffe getting a drink then it looks something like that when I really don’t want to have to kneel down. I’ve been doing unweighted squats as directed by the doctor but I’m in line for some physiotherapy as well once I make it to the top of the waiting list. No doubt weights will come into play soon enough. From what I can gather, the muscle wastes away, the kneecaps are no longer locked in place and that’s when the fun begins hence my desire to strengthen up that area and see if it helps.

All the best,

AJ
 

AJ_P

Pedelecer
Apr 19, 2023
46
10
I would fit the motor and try the 7 speed before deciding on next move. You may find a bigger cassette (depending on your current cassette) and a single smaller chainring (e.g. 36t) will be sufficient. It will limit your top speed, but I get the impression that's not so important to you?
We will never be out on the road with these bikes and there is only so much speed that is practical when rattling over rough forest fire roads. The surface is loose and there are people and dogs just around a blind corner on occasion. I’m 52 years old with a tagalong bike on the back and it’s little rider with my wife cycling alongside so I couldn’t sail on if I wanted to. That’s not to say I mightn’t enjoy a little speed while cycling there alone but as you rightly point out, there are options available. Would you think the TSDZ2B is strong enough with improved gearing to assist in pulling all that weight on hilly paths, or should I simply be looking at something with more torque as a starting point like the Bafang?

The above is what I am going to try - and you can then try the single chainring on the inside and outside positions to get an idea of how the chainline is if you do decide to go for double chainring setup.
I’m actually quite excited at the possibilities. I know my wife’s bike will be more than adequate for her with the TSDZ2B motor fitted and if she struggles with it, I can change the gearing to suit.

I have re-injured my ankle from overdoing the cycling, I had a very nasty sprain and avulsion fracture after a climbing accident 9 months ago and it has not been the same since it's very easy to get over enthusiastic and push too hard...
That’s the thing. It is so difficult not to overdo it. A little heat gets into the joint, things loosen up and away we go. Then we spend the next three days hobbling around the place with more damage done. I have friction in one ankle from a bad early childhood sprain and every so often it flares up which is much the same as being welded solid. Little and often is probably the best approach.

Thanks very much for your advice. I really do appreciate it.

All the best,

AJ
 

vidtek

Esteemed Pedelecer
Mar 29, 2015
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Bournemouth BH12
We will never be out on the road with these bikes and there is only so much speed that is practical when rattling over rough forest fire roads. The surface is loose and there are people and dogs just around a blind corner on occasion. I’m 52 years old with a tagalong bike on the back and it’s little rider with my wife cycling alongside so I couldn’t sail on if I wanted to. That’s not to say I mightn’t enjoy a little speed while cycling there alone but as you rightly point out, there are options available. Would you think the TSDZ2B is strong enough with improved gearing to assist in pulling all that weight on hilly paths, or should I simply be looking at something with more torque as a starting point like the Bafang?



I’m actually quite excited at the possibilities. I know my wife’s bike will be more than adequate for her with the TSDZ2B motor fitted and if she struggles with it, I can change the gearing to suit.



That’s the thing. It is so difficult not to overdo it. A little heat gets into the joint, things loosen up and away we go. Then we spend the next three days hobbling around the place with more damage done. I have friction in one ankle from a bad early childhood sprain and every so often it flares up which is much the same as being welded solid. Little and often is probably the best approach.

Thanks very much for your advice. I really do appreciate it.

All the best,

AJ
@AJ_P
I have been following this thread with interest. I purchased my TSDZ2 about 4 years ago and have been very happy with it. I hadn't been on a bike since my early teenage tears as I spent 33 years in Australia and they had compulsory helmet wearing for all over there. No fun in 38deg, you want some air in your hair. On returning to blighty nearly 10 years ago, I was informed by the lovely Jane that She would not be happy with me bringing my motorbike or buying a new one over here with the heavier traffic in Bournemouth/Poole. So I compromised for the sake of my marriage and a peaceful life to aquiesce and thought about an electric bike. I bought a heavy old front hub Sunbear, but it felt skittish on some gravel and a rather unnatural ride. I changed that for a rear hub Freego Eagle, which felt a much more natural ride but was very underpowered.

This forum piqued my interest in the TSDZ2 so I contacted Andy and Tony at Whoosh who prepared a kit for me. I picked a suitable donor bike from a local charity shop "Hope to Cycle" from their pile of donated bikes, they serviced it new cables, tyres, chain, brakes and cassette for £250. Very light 18kg Specialized Crossroads and ideal donor bike for the TSDZ2. Whoosh were extremely professional and gave me every assistance, just a 'phone call away. The whole kit with a 48v battery was £680.00. I have been extremely pleased with this bike and have used it ever since, clocking up nearly 3000 miles. No issues with the kit, except for a poor connection on the battery holder, a twist of the connector sorted that. I did have a clunking noise for which I returned the motor to Whoosh, no fault found, turned out to be a bent rear axle.

I mostly use the bike on cycle paths and tarmac at Hengistbury Head and along the Bournemouth sea front promenade, and often along the grave tracks throughout the New Forest. One thing I will heartily recommend, do get a kit with a throttle. I cannot emphasise this enough.
When starting off, it enables me to start without wobbling, and gives me the confidence to tackle almost any incline.
Finally, good luck with your endeavours, the TSDZ2 will serve you well I am sure.

Here is a link to my review at the time:- https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/whoosh-crank-drive-tongsheng-kit-review.34071/#post-489738

Cheers, Tony.
 
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AJ_P

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Apr 19, 2023
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@AJ_P
I have been following this thread with interest. I purchased my TSDZ2 about 4 years ago and have been very happy with it. I hadn't been on a bike since my early teenage tears as I spent 33 years in Australia and they had compulsory helmet wearing for all over there. No fun in 38deg, you want some air in your hair. On returning to blighty nearly 10 years ago, I was informed by the lovely Jane that She would not be happy with me bringing my motorbike or buying a new one over here with the heavier traffic in Bournemouth/Poole. So I compromised for the sake of my marriage and a peaceful life to aquiesce and thought about an electric bike. I bought a heavy old front hub Sunbear, but it felt skittish on some gravel and a rather unnatural ride. I changed that for a rear hub Freego Eagle, which felt a much more natural ride but was very underpowered.

This forum piqued my interest in the TSDZ2 so I contacted Andy and Tony at Whoosh who prepared a kit for me. I picked a suitable donor bike from a local charity shop "Hope to Cycle" from their pile of donated bikes, they serviced it new cables, tyres, chain, brakes and cassette for £250. Very light 18kg Specialized Crossroads and ideal donor bike for the TSDZ2. Whoosh were extremely professional and gave me every assistance, just a 'phone call away. The whole kit with a 48v battery was £680.00. I have been extremely pleased with this bike and have used it ever since, clocking up nearly 3000 miles. No issues with the kit, except for a poor connection on the battery holder, a twist of the connector sorted that. I did have a clunking noise for which I returned the motor to Whoosh, no fault found, turned out to be a bent rear axle.

I mostly use the bike on cycle paths and tarmac at Hengistbury Head and along the Bournemouth sea front promenade, and often along the grave tracks throughout the New Forest. One thing I will heartily recommend, do get a kit with a throttle. I cannot emphasise this enough.
When starting off, it enables me to start without wobbling, and gives me the confidence to tackle almost any incline.
Finally, good luck with your endeavours, the TSDZ2 will serve you well I am sure.

Here is a link to my review at the time:- https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/some-advice-needed-please.45158/

Cheers, Tony.
Hello Tony,

Yes, been there done that in respect of the lady's input on matters. I was learning to fly microlights many years ago and my sister in law happened to see a photo of yours truly at the controls "up there". She looked at my wife and said "You know, you're going to have to get used to the idea of living without him". I never flew again. True story.

As for the motor, I have only thus far bought one and that is for my wife's bike. It does indeed have a throttle for those occasions when it may be a nice addition to have. The TSDV2B will suit her very well I expect. Nothing too lairy and as close to a natural cycling experience as possible which will make it easier for her to manage while not overwhelming her.

I bought the 750w with a 48v battery and I am looking forward to seeing how it performs. That will then hopefully help me to figure out whether or not it would suit my "articulated" bike i.e. with tagalong bike and kid attached to the back, which all up is going to be 150kg or slightly more. That has to be hauled up rough forest fire roads with gradients in places of what I perceive to be roughly 10% or so. Gearing may well be the solution for my own needs or indeed simply a Bafang motor as a starting point instead but as of right now I do not know how the Tongsheng feels in terms of power, or any motor for that matter so hopefully I will get my wife's bike converted this week or next and I will then at least have that experience to go on. It's a learning process and thanks to the people on this forum, it is losing a lot of it's mystery thankfully.

All the best to you,

AJ

P.S. Your link is directing to this thread.
 

AJ_P

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Apr 19, 2023
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guerney

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Depressing stuff:



... use it or lose it :rolleyes:
 
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vidtek

Esteemed Pedelecer
Mar 29, 2015
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Depressing stuff:



... use it or lose it :rolleyes:
Why oh why did you post this Gurney? Now I'll be mooching about depressed all day waiting until the sun's past the yardarm and I can drown my sorrows in a stiff one and one more and one more.....might as well kill a few more grey cells off.
 
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AntonyC

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Apr 5, 2022
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youth is simply a memory that is disappearing rather rapidly in my rear view mirror. ;)
So long as memory itself doesn't disappear with it you're OK :)

The heat is caused by the current through the motor and as Power is the product of current and voltage (P = I x V) then you can see the 48v version draws less current per unit of power.
Less battery current it's true. With the motor doing the same climb and speed as before, it's getting the same phase current as before and just as hot, with the controller converting as needed according to the battery voltage.
With 48V though the motor might get less hot through climbing a hill in a shorter time.
 
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AJ_P

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Apr 19, 2023
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There is an oil seal on each side of the spindle. The support bearings are a straight swap for them. No dismantling required.
The motor has just arrived. The battery will be another day or two I imagine. I have my wife's bike ready for fitment apart from a cable under the bottom bracket but I would like to fit these additional bearings before using the motor.

I can see the oil seal on the non drive side; the seal on the other side being behind the chain ring I imagine. I've seen references to two additional bearings and some that say three. How many do I actually need, is there a preferred brand for this task and can I refit the oil seals afterwards or are the bearings in their place instead? I wouldn't like dirt and grit to get in there.

Am I correct in saying they are 6902RS bearings?

I'm looking forward to this. :)

AJ