Are They really exempt up to 40mph ?

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
30,379
Its nonsense.

Mobility vehicles are restricted to 4 mph on pavements and 8 mph on the roads in the UK. Similar restrictions apply in the EU.

Get caught riding that on the road unregistered whether an invalid or not and you are in serious trouble.
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RedSkywalker

Pedelecer
Jun 16, 2008
87
0
They do say that you have to qualify medically to avoid registration, etc, but I wouldn't worry about that too much cos with that hot engine so close to your legs I think you'd soon qualify!

On the other hand just think about the fun you could have by pulling in to a busy garage forecourt and ordering an egg-cup of petrol :)
 

keithhazel

Esteemed Pedelecer
Oct 1, 2007
997
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They do say that you have to qualify medically to avoid registration, etc, but I wouldn't worry about that too much cos with that hot engine so close to your legs I think you'd soon qualify!
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its not so much the hot engine that was my first worry, it was the chain wizzing round,would be pretty easy to get "something" caught in there.:eek:
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
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On the other hand just think about the fun you could have by pulling in to a busy garage forecourt and ordering an egg-cup of petrol :)
We used to do that sort of thing in the 1950s with the 25cc to 50cc cyclemotors attachments we added to bikes. The garages hated them for their pint or pint and half sales and owners fiddling about adding the bit of engine oil and shaking it together, so many used to fill a gallon can and top up and mix in the oil at home.
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Bigbee

Esteemed Pedelecer
Oct 12, 2008
445
1
I wouldnt want to be seen dead on one of those but fear that many people will end up that way.45 MPH on a conventional MTB is lunacy.
 

the_killjoy

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 26, 2008
822
226
In disbelief I asked the seller

"By exempt do you mean that they don't have to be registered or taxed ? "

and got the reply:

"Yes that is correct."

I pity any poor buyer !
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
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But did he specify which country. :)

I don't suppose the Congolese or Somalians would be much bothered at present.

But as you see from the photo below, even many years ago in the 1950s when I fiitted these and the laws were much more relaxed, they had to be registered and plated and with tax disc. This one is a 49cc BSA Winged Wheel motor kit by the way:

 
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RedSkywalker

Pedelecer
Jun 16, 2008
87
0
That actually looks like quite a practical vehicle flecc - the motor position is much neater [and safer] down there.

What were they like to ride? speed? and I'm really curious about what sort of MOT you'd have to put them through now!
 

keithhazel

Esteemed Pedelecer
Oct 1, 2007
997
0
In disbelief I asked the seller

"By exempt do you mean that they don't have to be registered or taxed ? "

and got the reply:

"Yes that is correct."

I pity any poor buyer !
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my reply was a bit different as follows...

Hi,

You have missed some print, its rather large and in the middle of the description, reads "Introducing a brand new sport that is already gripping the nation. Motored Off Road Mountain Biking!" But you're forgiven as this is the most common question we get asked.The answer is yes, if ridden over 15mph and the bike is unregistered you can get into a world of trouble, if already banned from driving, then i have a feeling the penalty is alot more severe than a hefty fine....
If registering is a route you would like to persue we are more than happy to advise you on the process and what is required as it is something we have looked into ourselves.

Thanks for your interest,
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funny because part of his descriptions are about bus costs and for people recovereing from operations and arthritis....me thinks some wool being pulled over some eyes here...:cool:
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
30,379
That actually looks like quite a practical vehicle flecc - the motor position is much neater [and safer] down there.

What were they like to ride? speed? and I'm really curious about what sort of MOT you'd have to put them through now!
Thats the thing Red, laws were much more relaxed then and we had nothing like MOTs. However, motorcycle MOTs are nothing like as fearful as car ones can be, and the average independent motorcycle dealer would nod through one of these without much bother.

Among the cyclemotors I was most concerned with were the Cyclemasters which were in the back wheel like that BSA, but the whole motor and fuel tank were within a huge pressed steel hub so fully self contained. They were Dutch though originally designed by German DKW. The 25 cc original was black painted and gutless, the later 32 cc painted grey and shown below the black one was a bit better though not as good as other motors.

The BSA Winged Wheel above was a late entrant about 1952, more powerful but vibrated quite a lot and not as good as you might expect from 49 cc. That one above is adapted to a larger external fuel tank, there's the normal small tank in the hub.

The speed king was the PowerPak, a 49 cc motor that sat above the rear wheel and drove the tyre by an alloy ribbed roller by friction and they could hit 30 mph plus downhill and flat out, though slightly slower on the flat. Once again the vibration could be severe at times and it wasn't uncommon for bike to be literally shaken to bits by it. It was also the shortest lived on the market, discontinued in 1955.

The French brought out the famous VeloSolex with a 49 cc motor over the front wheel driving the tyre through a carborundum roller, and it was an entire bike designed from the ground up, step through, heavy and robust. The motor wasn't very powerful and it wasn't very fast, but it was much more refined than the add-ons though could still produce quite a throbbing vibration through the front of the bike.

There were several others like the noisy Mosquito and one produced by Trojan under licence from an Italian design, but all the add ons disappeared in about a decade with the newly introduced Vespa and Lambretta scooters being far more attractive to a population getting richer in the late 1950s and 1960s. However, the VeloSolex amazingly continued in production until 1982.

In that brief decade of life these add-on cyclemotors were incredibly successful with registrations passing one million in the UK. Compare that with about 100,000 e-bikes at most after 17 years of them being marketed.

Nothing new under the sun though, so inevitably there was a forerunner to all these 1950s motors. Surprisingly early, the Wall Autowheel was made for bikes from 1912 until the mid 1920s. As you see in this photo, it was a motorised wheel with it's own frame that sat alongside the bike's rear wheel.
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RedSkywalker

Pedelecer
Jun 16, 2008
87
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We have quite a good museum of transport over in Glasgow but there's nothing like these machines - shame because I find them fascinating.

Ok then, here's one for you! When I was very young a german lady who lived in our street had what looked like a normal big, black ladies [step through] bike BUT it had a metal pack hanging from the handlebars which housed a motor and as I remember it had a kind of "flexy" pipe going to the front wheel to power it.

I'm certain that she didn't have any number plates or anything [this would probably have been about hmmm, 1955?] - does that ring any bells with you?
 

Barnowl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 18, 2008
954
1
The BSA winged wheel was the first motor bike I rode. My "friend" was nabbed by the police the next day. Joys of childhood :eek:
Next time I saw one was 12 months later in the museum.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
30,379
We have quite a good museum of transport over in Glasgow but there's nothing like these machines - shame because I find them fascinating.

Ok then, here's one for you! When I was very young a german lady who lived in our street had what looked like a normal big, black ladies [step through] bike BUT it had a metal pack hanging from the handlebars which housed a motor and as I remember it had a kind of "flexy" pipe going to the front wheel to power it.

I'm certain that she didn't have any number plates or anything [this would probably have been about hmmm, 1955?] - does that ring any bells with you?
That's a new one on me, but there were numerous cyclemotors in the post war impoverished Europe and I only know some. I take it you mean that was a petroil motor, and it should have been registered and taxed.

We had a mini museum on our Estate at one time, a retired headmaster and friend Alan Proffitt also an enthusiast had a small but growing collection of cyclemotors, but he moved some years ago and we lost contact.
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RedSkywalker

Pedelecer
Jun 16, 2008
87
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Yes it was definately petrol but she was a post war bride so it's quite possible she brought it over from Germany - I remember it well because there was nothing else like it and all us kids longed for a shot, lol; we used to watch her open the front of the pack and pull the rope to start it then she'd put her toddler into a wee permanent seat on the back and off she'd go - sigh, happy, innocent, days!
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
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Yes it was definately petrol but she was a post war bride so it's quite possible she brought it over from Germany - I remember it well because there was nothing else like it and all us kids longed for a shot, lol; we used to watch her open the front of the pack and pull the rope to start it then she'd put her toddler into a wee permanent seat on the back and off she'd go - sigh, happy, innocent, days!
They were certainly innocent and carefree days. I joined the cycle and motorcycle trade at 14 and was riding motorbikes and first drove a car from then on with a blind eye turned by our police customers and beat officers who valued our cuppas in cold weather. That could never happen in these pc times.
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the_killjoy

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 26, 2008
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I only sold a PowerPak motor last week; I seem to remember that they weren't too good in the wet ~ like all those motors which rubbed on the tyre it slipped when wet.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,814
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I only sold a PowerPak motor last week; I seem to remember that they weren't too good in the wet ~ like all those motors which rubbed on the tyre it slipped when wet.
They did indeed. If used with a heavily treaded tyre the PowerPak could rip the tread off in no time at in in wet conditions. It wasn't surprising that it lasted the shortest time of all on the market.
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silversurfer

Pedelecer
Jun 15, 2007
91
2
Hi, the German lady was probably riding a Rex. A front wheel drive cyclemotor. The engine sat in front of the handlebars and drove the wheel via a belt around a large, slim pulley fixed to the wheel/spokes (just like a washing machine drum drive).
They also made a more refined 'moped' with a similar sized (49cc) two stroke fitted near the bottom bracket. I know this because my uncle (living in Germany) has one, along with other German mopeds and a brace of classic 250 and 600 BMW motorbikes.
I have a couple of old, gutless VeloSolex, 49cc= .5 bhp!!! Not used on the road because I am fed up with having to MOT, tax,and insure them just to occasionally go for a run. In France, (their country of origin) no reg needed, all you need is a cheap basic insurance! Thats why I got my Torq, great fun, and FREE!
Oh incidentaly a friend in Leicester is a specialist restorer of BSA winged wheels.....small world ! silversurfer.