What are you really getting ?

[Chief eZee Power]

Hi Jason

Of course we could but why? This Big Chief Ezee chap really seems to have been upset by Wisper which in my book is absolutely brilliant. I hope I never have to resort to such pathetic and sad tactics to sell a few more electric bikes. I really cannot believe the famous Wai Won stooping to such incredible lows.

In truth I am delighted that Ezee have at last got their act together, ever since 50 cycles kicked them out for selling such awful bikes they have been trying to claw their way back into the UK market. The more good electric bikes available the better in my book.

Power to your elbow Wai Won I hope you sell 1000's of bikes, but please don't be so silly. We are competitors but surly we should be working together to build the market not calling each other names?

All the best

David

For your information, I first send a letter to 50cycles to terminate the distribution agreement with them, not the other way as you implied here.
And look who is making a cheap shot and slating and slagging.

Yes, we fell off the perch, but not knocked off by you as you wrote in an earlier post, so don't flatter yourself.

Dear Readers, I am often requested by dealers and distributors to use lower end products to bring the price down or increase the margins, and following that they would say " the customers don't know any better anyway". I don't believe in this, but that is what my competition is taking advantage of. Seems that they may be right as there are so many posts here say it does not matter if it is Tourney or Deore, they all work.

Then we should have only one type or grade of wine in this world, they are all the same, it is just wine and and they all work in getting us drunk ?

Chief eZee Operator

 

[Wisper Bikes]

David

You state

"ever since 50 cycles kicked them out for selling such awful bikes" about eZee bikes.

I admire both you and Mr Ching and, like other neutrals, I do not like elements of this thread. However I accept the view of those who argue that this is an example of free speech and healthy dialogue... but this comment is simply is not true.

I bought my eZee Forza from 50 cycles after a web search and was please to see that they had a brand of electric bikes that they called the best available. I picked up the bike from Loughborough and they repeated the statement. In fact they were happy to extol its many virtues, much as they did the next range of bikes they sold. I was very happy with their service at the time but was disgusted with their subsequent "public" slating of the brand they had recently held to be the best.

I don't know why 50 Cycles stopped selling eZee bikes but it was not because they were awful.

Sorry Conal, that is simply what I heard from a very credible source, but I would be pleased to be proved wrong.

I really hate having to defend myself and product like this and I do feel awful when it gets out of hand and I sink as low as my attackers. Should I simply ignore them?

Regards

David

 

[dan]

I am not slating nor slagging a competitor, what I am trying to expose these misleading informations or specifications in their brochures.

I suppose you have not even read the table for the components between the eZee and the Wisper here. On the Wisper ONLY the derailleur in ALIVIO, while the rest of the drive train is the low end Shimano Tourney - the sprockets and Shifters - but that is not mentioned, is that trying to fool customers into believing the whole set up is Alivio. That is one point I wanted to clarify.

Then there is also the Bike with the Alfine hub, but just be aware that the the brakes are not in the Alfine series which is hydraulic brakes. I am telling people the finer details.

The Shimano MTB series starts at the bottom to top with Tourney, Altus, Alivio and Deore. You are telling people they are all the same ?

Chief eZee Operator

Chief,

I think we all get the point, you use higher specification components which cost you more to put on your bike, so pound for pound your bike costs more at the factory gate than wisper. You then cut out one layer of distribution and sell at the same price.

Problem is no matter how good a bike is at some point it will need servicing or repairs (even Rolls Royce’s break down) and unless you have a dealer network in place, you are going to be let down by after sales service.

Example: Bike stops working and the one and only supplier is 200 miles away, customer rings the supplier and says “my bikes stopped working and I don’t know why” whilst it may be possible in some cases to diagnose the problem over the phone, who is going to fit the required part and what if you cant solve the problem over the phone.

The extra level of a dealer network may push up the initial cost of the bike, but you can’t beat it for customer service.

Distant selling of any type of vehicle is fraught with difficulties.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

For your information, I first send a letter to 50cycles to terminate the distribution agreement with them, not the other way as you implied here.
And look who is making a cheap shot and slating and slagging.

Yes, we fell off the perch, but not knocked off by you as you wrote in an earlier post, so don't flatter yourself.

Dear Readers, I am often requested by dealers and distributors to use lower end products to bring the price down or increase the margins, and following that they would say " the customers don't know any better anyway". I don't believe in this, but that is what my competition is taking advantage of. Seems that they may be right as there are so many posts here say it does not matter if it is Tourney or Deore, they all work.

Then we should have only one type or grade of wine in this world, they are all the same, it is just wine and and they all work in getting us drunk ?

Chief eZee Operator

Dear Chief

Dear me how low can you sink?

Why have not called me as invited. All you are doing is causing bad feeling here. This is not doing you or anyone any good.

You build your bikes I build mine, we obviously disagree about where the money should be spent, so why not simply agree to disagree and move on like adults?

Kindest regards

David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Chief,

I think we all get the point, you use higher specification components which cost you more to put on your bike, so pound for pound your bike costs more at the factory gate than wisper. You then cut out one layer of distribution and sell at the same price.

Problem is no matter how good a bike is at some point it will need servicing or repairs (even Rolls Royce’s break down) and unless you have a dealer network in place, you are going to be let down by after sales service.

Example: Bike stops working and the one and only supplier is 200 miles away, customer rings the supplier and says “my bikes stopped working and I don’t know why” whilst it may be possible in some cases to diagnose the problem over the phone, who is going to fit the required part and what if you cant solve the problem over the phone.

The extra level of a dealer network may push up the initial cost of the bike, but you can’t beat it for customer service.

Distant selling of any type of vehicle is fraught with difficulties.

Thanks Dan, of course there is a difference between all 4 shimano deraileurs but really very little, the Tournay is a bit shabby but the difference between the top two is very little as reflected in the price. We have never had a problems with the Alivio deraileurs so why change them? As a matter of interest I have recently ordered Deor for our bikes but purely as a marketing exercise. The point is I would rather spend the little difference on other parts of the bike and as you say on servicing our customers.

I find it sad that this guy seems to want to try and discredit us.

All the best

David

 

[simonbarnett]

I really hate having to defend myself and product like this and I do feel awful when it gets out of hand and I sink as low as my attackers. Should I simply ignore them?

Regards

David

Yes, you've stayed very diplomatic but this is showing no sign of stopping.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Ahhhhh!

OK OK I've stopped!

Best regards

David

 

[eddieo]

I am losing the will to live........ Can we not get this madman of here?

I though it was an enthusiasts forum

 

[Rab C Nesbitt]

Right , this is definitely my last post on this - I normally can't be arsed with these drawn out handbag fights but this Chief guy mentioned a couple of things which need addressed.
Firstly, it's not a great idea to attack people just because they might disagree with your viewpoint. Even allowing for English being your second language, you're really digging a feckoff size hole for yourself.

So firstly you dig me up with "I suppose you have not even read the table for the components between the eZee and the Wisper here." Well, funnily enough I did read it and do you know what, all I could think of was my neighbour calling your Ezee Torq " a heap of junk" because of bad batteries and worse support - that answer your question ?

Then eddieo disagreed with you and you chimed in with
"eZee bike with our battery behind the seat post increase the wheel base by 30 mm with our unique design which you don't know anything about, and the angle of the seat tube is such that for taller people extending the seat post extends the distance from the handle bar or head stem as well, making the fit automatic.

eZee bike has a shorted wheel base than Wisper which just slot the battery behind the seat post without any further consideration.

You are so obviously disturbed that you could not see anything nor appreciate anything we have, all you could do is groan. Wisper is indeed the generic chinese bike made by ACTIVE. It is not any different from the Freego Eagle selling for GPB 999 , yes standard chinese drive system with BaFang motor and controller and battery gauge unit package, low end Shimano Tourney gears and shifters that try to be pass off as Alivio.

I know far more about the Bionx than you. I have been talking with them since 2001 when their bikes they made were called Amigo, and that failed and they turned to selling the drive system. I have evaluated and tested and stripped and examined every detail of the Bionx the latest version together with Justin, and just what do you know.

What battery management does Wisper have ? , just the basic hardware for your BMS, eZee have the O2micro.

Now I know the diplomatic corps isn't for everyone, but you need to soften up your approach son, because what you're doing here is alienating a lot of folk who might be thinking of giving Ezee a go. Eddieo, did you **** on his chips ? Now tell the truth . . .

Finally, you say "I am not slating nor slagging a competitor, what I am trying to expose these misleading informations or specifications in their brochures" (see quote above . . .. )

To the neutral observer, you seem fixated with beating or doing down Wisper - if I were in the market for either of these bikes, human nature being what it is, I would say to myself, this Wisper seems to be the one to beat - I'll give it go.
So well done son , you've succeeded in giving Wisper probably the best piece of advertising they've had for a while

Anyway, apologies to the rest of the forum as this has taken arms and legs

I'm gone
Rab

 

[flecc]

I though it was an enthusiasts forum

Can't fault Wai Won on this part, he is an enthusiast and rides his bikes regularly.

He's been riding very long stretches of The Silk Route to test his bikes abilities and reporting with photos on those rides in here.
.

 

[eddieo]

Can't fault Wai Won on this part, he is an enthusiast and rides his bikes regularly.

He's been riding very long stretches of The Silk Route to test his bikes abilities and reporting with photos on those rides in here.
.

Fascinating......well I suggest he stops this obsessive navel gazing, steps back and has a look at the bigger picture. He has his head so far up his bottom he is losing his grip. until he gets wider distribution and backup, a better warranty (transferable to assure decent resale value)his bikes will continue to be esoteric not mainstream IMO.

Ezee bikes make very poor resale on ebay, less then half a wisper 905, so who exactly does this guy think he is trying to kid!

Compare like with like, not just gears/brakes but the whole ownership experience from our perspective....... But I doubt his ego will allow for that. I feel sorry for Onbike having to deal with the fall out from this guy.

 

[flecc]

Ezee bikes make very poor resale on ebay, less then half a wisper 905, so who exactly does this guy think he is trying to kid!

The prices crashed long ago in 2007 as a direct result of the dud batteries Phylion supplied them and the reputation that resulted. New condition Torqs were selling for well under half price so once down it's very difficult for them to rise again. Those in the know though picked up some real bargains, they were great bikes and some of the know how that went into that design went into a rival bike later. You can guess which bike and who was responsible for that. . PM me if not sure.

A very low price second hand Torq 1 is a better buy than a high price second hand rival when the same make replacement batteries often needed on either used bike cost the same.
.

 

[Cyclezee]

I wonder if it might be possible to settle some of the arguments between Wisper and Ezee in a gentlemanly fashion by having a head to head test of equivalent models carried out by an independant unbiased reviewer like AtoB for example?

J hn

 

[simonbarnett]

I wonder if it might be possible to settle some of the arguments between Wisper and Ezee in a gentlemanly fashion by having a head to head test of equivalent models carried out by an independant unbiased reviewer like AtoB for example?

J hn

Anything that terminates this mud slinging would be fine. It must be very off-putting to newer members. Reminds me of the old slagging off of 50C about Kalkoff delays that took them out of the forum for a while.

I'm not a user of Ezee or Wisper, but they each have their fans here. Ezee for quality fighting back from old problems. Wisper for customer service and a good product recently. Both are targets for the moped accusation, but so what?

I'm still in favour of traders/manufacturers putting their wares to us, but I think this has gone too far. At least David has now desisted and I hope Chief does so too. We can make our own choices on what we're told before it descends into a slanging match.

 

[flecc]

I wonder if it might be possible to settle some of the arguments between Wisper and Ezee in a gentlemanly fashion by having a head to head test of equivalent models carried out by an independant unbiased reviewer like AtoB for example?

J hn

Or Chief eZee Power versus Chief Wisperbike:

Tomahawks at dawn, the feathers will fly.
.