February 25, 20206 yr Action taken here but some of the report does not make much sense. These are twist and go, no pedalling required. (I've been there) yet this seems to imply that TS were only concerned about them possibly beeing derestricted. The trouble is that there is so little knowledge of the complexities of pedelec law, even among the authorities. In this case they were justly concerned that a derestriction connection had been broken on one of them allowing it an excessive 22 mph assist speed. But they were wrong to complain of the 16 mph one, since the usual 10% speed limit tolerance applies and this has been confirmed by the DfT. Up to 17 mph assist is permissible. The complaint was possibly sour grapes by a rival trader, there was a similar one in Guernsey years ago when one trader shopped another on a technicality in the law at the time. Must be something about islands! .
February 25, 20206 yr The trouble is that there is so little knowledge of the complexities of pedelec law I'm wondering if these moped style bikes have PAS as the pedals look impossible to use? If not, would this affect the test for full power throttle use? Edited February 25, 20206 yr by wheeliepete
February 25, 20206 yr On the basis that an ebike that was first sold after 1-1-2016 cannot have a throttle and, therefore, must only have pedal assist - then I can't see how these can be classed as ebikes. They certainly don't come under the wolley classification of an ebike being a "normal bicycle with a motor to help out" - these things look as if they are designed to be mopeds with a few bit on to make it look like they comply with the ebike laws. In my opinion they just produce an atmosphere where people have a reason to distrust proper ebikes and as such I don't like them
February 25, 20206 yr I'm wondering if these moped style bikes have PAS as the pedals look impossible to use? Would this affect the test for full power throttle use? They are usable though mainly at low speed since they are very low geared, so they do pass the pedelec pedal ability test ok. .
February 25, 20206 yr https://www.scootaboot.co.uk/prices If they are classed as e-bkes I wonder why the minimum age of 16? They've got 14 correctly for the bikes.
February 25, 20206 yr On the basis that an ebike that was first sold after 1-1-2016 cannot have a throttle and, therefore, must only have pedal assist - then I can't see how these can be classed as ebikes. As I've posted, the DfT have since made a ruling for Great Britain only that if an e-bike is taken through a form of type approval they can still be regarded as pedelecs, even with a fully acting throttle. In practice that means taking each one individually though SVA (Single Vehicle Approval) at an approved testing station for a £50 fee. I'm only aware of one going through that process so far. I agree with your last sentence. .
February 25, 20206 yr https://www.scootaboot.co.uk/prices If they are classed as e-bkes I wonder why the minimum age of 16? They've got 14 correctly for the bikes. It may be their misunderstanding, but it's more likely just their own rule. Note they also also say helmet compulsory for pasengers under 14 years, but there is no such law. .
February 25, 20206 yr Looks like they are back in business again. I'll bet there is no individual approval for these. Edited February 25, 20206 yr by Ianb11
February 25, 20206 yr Looks like they are back in business again. I'll bet there is no invidual approval for these. There may well be. Some e-bikes, including scooter style ones, from both Germany and China, do have EU certification for registration as motor vehicle. That is also Type Approval. .
February 25, 20206 yr There may well be. Some e-bikes, including scooter style ones, from both Germany and China, do have EU certification for registration as motor vehicle. That is also Type Approval. . Interesting. Thanks.
February 26, 20206 yr Action taken here but some of the report does not make much sense. These are twist and go, no pedalling required. (I've been there) yet this seems to imply that TS were only concerned about them possibly being derestricted. https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/eco-friendly-scooter-shop-owner-20065046 As long as the motor operates with the 15.5 mph cutoff it's all good then. My Grandson will be 14 soon enough. I might get him one for his 1.5 mile bike path commute to school. How cool is that.
February 26, 20206 yr As long as the motor operates with the 15.5 mph cutoff it's all good then. My Grandson will be 14 soon enough. I might get him one for his 1.5 mile bike path commute to school. How cool is that. Needs to have approval as well. Looks like from the OP you may not be able to trust what the merchant claims about legality.
February 26, 20206 yr Needs to have approval as well. Looks like from the OP you may not be able to trust what the merchant claims about legality. Lots of new ebikes come with throttles fitted. You just have to plug them in yourself. So that no laws are broken by the seller. I've not heard of any of those being pulled for using a thumb throttle yet? I suppose that If you wanted one of those escooters then the 50 quid approval fee might be worth the hassle. Particularly worthwhile due to the likelihood of getting pulled for being abnormal. Although the regular looking ebikes, where the throttle is provided by the seller, and you plug it in yourself after the sale, never bother going through that approval process. Well not that I've heard of anyhow.
February 26, 20206 yr Needs to have approval as well. Looks like from the OP you may not be able to trust what the merchant claims about legality. It would appear not, the guy in the video is renting out the same bikes as in the 1st post. If his bikes have been taken away for inspection and returned to him to continue his hire business, would it be fair to assume they are all "approved"?
February 26, 20206 yr It would appear not, the guy in the video is renting out the same bikes as in the 1st post. If his bikes have been taken away for inspection and returned to him to continue his hire business, would it be fair to assume they are all "approved"? Possibly, but Flecc, who clearly knows his stuff, suggested that even the authorities can be unclear on the law.
February 26, 20206 yr even the authorities can be unclear on the law. Deff. looks like that is the case in this instance.
February 26, 20206 yr The law regarding illegal ebike use isn't very harsh for first time offenders. The met at the tail of last Autumn and early winter confiscated about 100 pedicabs off the streets of London, the users were not prosecuted but were sent a warning letter laying down the law and consequences should they be caught again.
February 26, 20206 yr Possibly, but Flecc, who clearly knows his stuff, suggested that even the authorities can be unclear on the law. How true this is becomes very clear when the DfT, who make the law, don't know it to the point of comedy. When a police force tried to prosecute a pedelecer for having a 250 watt motor, the DfT backed them, until I pointed out an anomaly and the prosecution was stopped. The problem was that their pedelec usage law (1983 EAPC) states that any bike having over 200 watts had to be type approved as a motor vehicle, that ruled by the DfT legal department, However the DfT's Vehicle Inspectorate who do type approval work to a different construction law (168/2013), which exempts any otherwise legal pedelec having 250 watts or less from being type approved. A bit like pantomime really, one DfT department saying "Oh yes you must!", while another department says "Oh no you can't!"
February 26, 20206 yr The problem was that their pedelec usage law (1983 EAPC) states that any bike having over 200 watts had to be type approved as a motor vehicle, that ruled by the DfT legal department, Hasn't that since been resolved since we adopted the EU regs?
February 26, 20206 yr Hasn't that since been resolved since we adopted the EU regs? Yes, but not at the time of the attempted prosecution, Now we have a new DfT mess with their bonkers ruling on type approval to permit a throttle. That is against both UK and EU law. .
February 26, 20206 yr Now we have a new DfT mess with their bonkers ruling on type approval to permit a throttle. That is against both UK and EU law. they obviously don't want the police to prosecute pensioners with arthritic knees.
February 26, 20206 yr they obviously don't want the police to prosecute pensioners with arthritic knees. True, but they could have achieved that within the law, rather than making a local rule that breaches the law and which hardly anyone can understand and never use. That's similar to how we got into the mess we were in for 12 years with most pedelecs illegally powered. It seems they never learn. .
February 26, 20206 yr Suspect this will cause a rethink https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/ebike-cyclist-death-by-dangerous-driving-a4372596.html
February 26, 20206 yr Suspect this will cause a rethink The prosecution and defence agree that Hanlon did not have a licence or insurance for a motorbike, but he is contesting the first two charges because they require a fault in the driving, which contributed in a more than a minimal way to the death. A tragic accident no matter what. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0s_fyHS-ug
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