April 23, 20241 yr What's going to stop people from using R/C lipos powering their ebikes, like we used to. As presently, new ebike laws will rarely be enforced.
April 23, 20241 yr Its sounds highly unlikley that no-one is allowed to climb a ladder beyond 12ft without scafolding. There might well be some circumstances when those in emplyment have to errect scafolding. I was wrong. I have looked up the law and it applies to trades people. That said, erecting scaffolding vastly increases the costs of simple work at gutter level. I was quoted a ridiculous scaffolding charge for recovering the top of a bay window with new felt. £180 for the actual work, and £500 for the scaffolding. I just put up my own ladders, bought 10 litres of cold mastic and cut a strip of felt from a roll I had after re-roofing the shed. Total cost about £25 - the felt was left over. Job took half an hour. I would have edited or deleted that post where I said the electrical and height regulations applied to the individual doing his own work. I can't. The buttons ofr edit and delete must be time limited. Sorry about that.
April 23, 20241 yr I would have edited or deleted that post where I said the electrical and height regulations applied to the individual doing his own work. I can't. The buttons ofr edit and delete must be time limited. Yes it's 24 hours Tony. .
April 23, 20241 yr As presently, new ebike laws will rarely be enforced. That's dangerous thinking. Bike laws are rarely enforced against individuals but the proposed bill acts against the suppliers of batteries, chargers, ebikes and conversion kits, and they're much easier to pin down. If Certsure were named as an assessor, this certifying body that funds a de facto industry consortium and lobby group would become gatekeepers to the UK market, surely a pandemic-style conflict of interest. We should get writing to our MPs about ESF's proposal.
April 23, 20241 yr I'm sure that if Certsure make a suitable contribution to party funds the current government will be happy rush through some unthoughout legislation.
April 23, 20241 yr 10 minute bills rarely make their way into law without government backing. Similar to that proposal to add penalty points to number plate offences from a few years ago. The media still newly posts as if this is coming soon despite it failing to make a second reading in 2021. Vehicle Registration Offences (Penalty Points) Bill - Parliamentary Bills - UK Parliament
April 23, 20241 yr It is absolutely scandalous that the prime motivator of the bill has a vested interest in its passage - a license to make money and restrict competition. The scale of the problem does not demand a locking down of the battery and e-bike industry into the maw of a handful of expensive producers. I am put in mind of the chap who made my battery and did the conversion on my bike. He is a very small, careful one man band and I have confidence in him. This kind of regulation would put him right out of business. The scale of his enterprise could not bear the costs of being certified. It is not like an MOT - this kind of stuff costs many tens of thousands of pounds and has ongoing demands and interference.
April 24, 20241 yr It takes a minimum of three years to become a qualified electrician, with practical and theory exams and tests. Then you need a certificate proving that you are cogniscant witht the current regulations - another course/exam. These regs are constantly updated and changed, so this is repeatable. Then you have to register with a trade body at your own expense. This is an annual fee with the need to be annually inspected and to show continual proffessional development. I.e. paying for more courses. Then your very expensive test meters have to be annually calibrated, at your own expense. Then along comes Part P that allows anyone who has done a weeks on line course to work on kitchens and bathrooms and makes a mockery of the whole shebang. All this regulation has meant that electricians have had to put their rates up significantly just to cover costs. The methodologies that have to be used look overly complex to the punter and the suspiscion always is thet they are being fleeced through techno babble. The relevant point of this rant is that all this regulation has not stopped dodgy practices. People constantly do it themselves or seek workarounds because they just can't afford the gen job. The cowboys are still there under the radar, but worse than before because any one with a bit of understanding would not go anywhere near these bodge jobs because of the danger and liability.. Yet still the Jo Bloggs, 'I'll do that for you mate' as a favour to the neighbour are still there. I know - I see the nightmarish results. I'm not sure what's being proposed for batteries but I can guarentee it will make things worse.
April 24, 20241 yr I had to go into a house in a similar state to make the electrics safe. It was a chip pan fire. Let's all panic and regulate chip pans.
April 24, 20241 yr Standardise charging protocol, plugs and sockets, is a good idea. if the components are safe then there is much less need to legislate the kits. Knee Jerk reaction I agree but on reflection. Unless we have very clever chargers (think PD usb c) then same sockets/plugs across multiple voltages is asking for trouble, isn't it ? I'm on Facebook groups about ebikes and battery building. It. Is. Terrifying This forum is like being in university by comparison.
April 24, 20241 yr I was wrong. I have looked up the law and it applies to trades people. I would have edited or deleted that post where I said the electrical and height regulations applied to the individual doing his own work. I can't. The buttons ofr edit and delete must be time limited. Is there an exemption for my window cleaner..??
April 24, 20241 yr Never seen anything like that. He won't be with us long. If he was your window cleaner, I'd advise you start already looking for another one.
April 24, 20241 yr Never seen anything like that. He won't be with us long. If he was your window cleaner, I'd advise you start already looking for another one. He retired about 5 yrs ago after doing this his entire working life....! He's probably minted, I remember paying £40 for 20mins effort last time he came....danger money he said ;-)
April 24, 20241 yr He retired about 5 yrs ago after doing this his entire working life....! He's probably minted, I remember paying £40 for 20mins effort last time he came....danger money he said ;-) People who take risks like that REALLY can't afford to have an 'off day' can they? One moment's lapse and he's gone or paralysed and smashed to bits.
April 24, 20241 yr Knee Jerk reaction I agree but on reflection. Unless we have very clever chargers (think PD usb c) then same sockets/plugs across multiple voltages is asking for trouble, isn't it ? I'm on Facebook groups about ebikes and battery building. It. Is. Terrifying This forum is like being in university by comparison. The problem is the BMS, not the charger. They are not good enough. They should block charging voltages or currents that are too high and they should be able to withstand transient spikes from motors. Unfortunately, corners are cut and most battery BMS systems are not really up to the job. It doesn't need smart coms etc, just proper implementation of basic electronics.
April 24, 20241 yr Is there an exemption for my window cleaner..?? The first time I went to the Isle of Man TT week, a guy climbed the clock tower on Douglas promenade. It was an old 4-faced Victorian one with curly wrought iron decoration. The guy was extremely skilled in his climbing technique in the way he manipulated his body to climb the tower, which was about 25ft tall. After sitting ay the top for a bit, he decided to come back down, but he was a bit hampered by his jacket. He managed to remove the jacket, and while holding on to the wrought iron with one hand, he threw his jacket down to the ground. Unfortunately, the jerk from the throw, broke a piece of the rusty wrought iron off, and down he went to fall head first onto the concrete below. Obviously, he didn't survive. This is it:
April 25, 20241 yr Standardise charging protocol, plugs and sockets, is a good idea. I disagree. Battery fires have raised issues you can view as: Future: a need for improved technologies, safety standards and regulation. Past: a legacy situation of battery fires occurring and posing a risk to life. Present: a scramble to impose fixes and an opportunity to distort the market. Obviously the losses these fires incur now are mainly through them occurring indoors. This is where an immediate impact could be achieved yet the education campaign seems low key and other actions aren't in evidence. As WheezyRider says (in effect) if a BMS works properly mischarging can't cause a problem, and as part of the battery a BMS's protection is permanent. While BMSs are inadequate regulating chargers is misguided and when they're adequate it's counter-productive. And Grin Technologies think that as fires go cell defects and external factors far outweigh BMS issues. Edited April 25, 20241 yr by AntonyC
April 25, 20241 yr And Grin Technologies think that as fires go cell defects and external factors far outweigh BMS issues. I agree with that. Most normal batteries have properly functioning BMSs. Everybody is trying to solve a problem without any data. We have no idea what caused any of the fires we've seen and discussed. They all look like very dodgy installations, and we have no hard facts about what sort of creative ideas the users invented on how to abuse their batteries.
April 25, 20241 yr Nothing . If anything comes of it, it will just be more garbage legislation and will be ignored by the people who cause the real problems in society. It's a pattern that's been happening for decades. Mobs of protesters were causing chaos in cities. New laws were created so police can disperse any group of 2 or more people - laws have been used to break up peaceful meetings but are rarely used when there's a mob on the streets. Police were using the new laws to move on groups of teenagers at out local shopping center - kids were normally having fun but not causing a problem. New laws = the public suffer with no effect on the actual criminals. Knife crime is increasing (criminals are breaking the law and using knives to do it) = knife laws introduced when buying knives. The changes affect normal law-abiding public, the criminals ignore the new laws the way they ignored the originals. Criminals were shooting people with guns, new laws (including registration in Scotland for all airguns including low powered kids guns) make it more difficult for the public to own legal guns - criminals continue to use illegal guns while breaking the law (ie shooting people !) A lot of the new laws are knee-jerk reactions to show "we listened and we did something" but don't actually help the situation. Most ridiculous it that it's illegal to use mobile phones in petrol stations as "They might cause an explosion" but some petrol stations also have signs up "Use our App on your phone to pay for your fuel". Mythbusters TV showed that it was impossible to cause an explosion using a mobile phone. This all started with an urban myth that phones could cause explosions, the new laws were never needed...
April 26, 20241 yr It's a pattern that's been happening for decades. Mobs of protesters were causing chaos in cities. New laws were created so police can disperse any group of 2 or more people - laws have been used to break up peaceful meetings but are rarely used when there's a mob on the streets. Police were using the new laws to move on groups of teenagers at out local shopping center - kids were normally having fun but not causing a problem. New laws = the public suffer with no effect on the actual criminals. Knife crime is increasing (criminals are breaking the law and using knives to do it) = knife laws introduced when buying knives. The changes affect normal law-abiding public, the criminals ignore the new laws the way they ignored the originals. Criminals were shooting people with guns, new laws (including registration in Scotland for all airguns including low powered kids guns) make it more difficult for the public to own legal guns - criminals continue to use illegal guns while breaking the law (ie shooting people !) A lot of the new laws are knee-jerk reactions to show "we listened and we did something" but don't actually help the situation. Most ridiculous it that it's illegal to use mobile phones in petrol stations as "They might cause an explosion" but some petrol stations also have signs up "Use our App on your phone to pay for your fuel". Mythbusters TV showed that it was impossible to cause an explosion using a mobile phone. This all started with an urban myth that phones could cause explosions, the new laws were never needed... Well said. Law abiding people take notice of regulations. Villains don't. I remember in 2010 when a Labour Home Secretary, Alan Johnson, was proposing to make it illegal to own a dog unless you had third party insurance, microchipped it, and if I am not mistaken, he was talking about owners having to attend a course in civilised dog keeping. The problem he was trying to solve, pertained to thugs and criminals using savage, monster dog types to intimidate people in London parks. Like all such legislation, the people he was aiming to control, were a tiny minority of the population who behave like outlaws. Of course as always, these are the very people who will ignore the regulations. Their behaviour was already illegal, but more law affecting everyone else seemed to him the obvious solution....
April 26, 20241 yr Author "A heavily pregnant mum and her family have been left homeless after their house was destroyed in a fire started by an electronic bike charger. " https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/heavily-pregnant-mum-family-left-32667839
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