Help! Legal e-bike kit

[Adamroze]

You are right! Bafang has changed their sitemap.
Same with Tongsheng. The old EN15194 is now replaced with a new certificate, but not for their TSDZ2 like the old one was.
TSDZ5 EN15194_Suzhou Tongsheng Electric Appliances Co., Ltd. Motor Meter Controller (tongsheng-e.com)

Ah I see, would this mean that Bafang bbs01b or TSDZ2 isn’t technically legal now? Since it’s not got EN15194 or did you mean the new certificate is the same as EN15194

 

[Woosh]

Ah I see, would this mean that Bafang bbs01b or TSDZ2 isn’t technically legal now? Since it’s not got EN15194 or did you mean the new certificate is the same as EN15194

No, it does not mean that. You asked for EN15194 certificates, I was looking for them where I downloaded before.
Manufacturers do not need to test each and everyone of their product. Certificates are only valid for 3 years but manufacturers don't need to get the same product re-certified after the validity runs out.
Manufacturers can issue certificate of conformity for a similar product to the one that has been certificated. If you ask Bafang, they can issue a certificate of conformity to you. The same applies to the Tongsheng TSDZ2B kits.

 

[saneagle]

Ah I see, would this mean that Bafang bbs01b or TSDZ2 isn’t technically legal now? Since it’s not got EN15194 or did you mean the new certificate is the same as EN15194

You don't need an EN15194 cert for a bike to be legal in UK. All you need are:

• Motor RATED at 250w or less
• Assistance cut above 15.5 mph
• Assistance stops when you stop pedalling
• A label that shows key info.
• The bike can be pedalled without power

Obviously all the regulations that apply to non-assisted bikes also have to be considered. Technically, the max voltage allowed is a 48v battery, but that's not tied down tightly enough to argue either way whether you can go higher.

I only looked at one court case, where the legality of the bike was in dispute. The Judge simply went through the above 5 points. In that case, it failed on the last point.

 

[Adamroze]

No, it does not mean that. You asked for EN15194 certificates, I was looking for them where I downloaded before.
Manufacturers do not need to test each and everyone of their product. Certificates are only valid for 3 years but manufacturers don't need to get the same product re-certified after the validity runs out.
Manufacturers can issue certificate of conformity for a similar product to the one that has been certificated. If you ask Bafang, they can issue a certificate of conformity to you. The same applies to the Tongsheng TSDZ2B kits.

Ahh ok I see what you mean, glad it’s fine and thanks for the advice

 

[Adamroze]

You don't need an EN15194 cert for a bike to be legal in UK. All you need are:

• Motor RATED at 250w or less
• Assistance cut above 15.5 mph
• Assistance stops when you stop pedalling
• A label that shows key info.
• The bike can be pedalled without power

Obviously all the regulations that apply to non-assisted bikes also have to be considered. Technically, the max voltage allowed is a 48v battery, but that's not tied down tightly enough to argue either way whether you can go higher.

I only looked at one court case, where the legality of the bike was in dispute. The Judge simply went through the above 5 points. In that case, it failed on the last point.

Oh right that’s the main 5 points ok thanks. Oh really so they failed on the “the bike can be pedalled without power” thought all e-bikes when turned off can be peddled but ofc harder difficulty

 

[saneagle]

Oh right that’s the main 5 points ok thanks. Oh really so they failed on the “the bike can be pedalled without power” thought all e-bikes when turned off can be peddled but ofc harder difficulty

It's just the extra mass that you have to deal with, typically around 8kg. So if you can imagine riding a normal bike while carrying 8kg of shopping, that's what it's like.

 

[Adamroze]

It's just the extra mass that you have to deal with, typically around 8kg. So if you can imagine riding a normal bike while carrying 8kg of shopping, that's what it's like.

Ah yh I understand it would be heavy to peddle. But based on the court case, an e-bike too heavy could fail? So I can’t have 2/3 batteries installed as it would be heavy?

 

[Az.]

But based on the court case, an e-bike too heavy could fail? So I can’t have 2/3 batteries installed as it would be heavy?

It is not only added weight. There is an insane amount of mopeds dressed up as pedelecs. People simply add pedals and think they can ride moped without registration plates, accountability, insurance etc.

For example look at this "bike":

EU Warehouse 2023 new design electric motor bicycle 20" fat tire bicycle electric 350W(250W) motor 7 speed gear electric fat tire bike bicycle

EU Warehouse 2023 new design electric motor bicycle 20" fat tire bicycle electric 350W(250W) motor 7 speed gear electric fat tire bike bicycle

www.pswpower.com

Seat is very low and you can't raise it up or lower it down. It would be very difficult to ride without assistance.

The other day I saw delivery rider on his bike without chain using throttle only. Hardly a legal pedelec that was.

 

[Adamroze]

It is not only added weight. There is an insane amount of mopeds dressed up as pedelecs. People simply add pedals and think they can ride moped without registration plates, accountability, insurance etc.

For example look at this "bike":

EU Warehouse 2023 new design electric motor bicycle 20" fat tire bicycle electric 350W(250W) motor 7 speed gear electric fat tire bike bicycle

EU Warehouse 2023 new design electric motor bicycle 20" fat tire bicycle electric 350W(250W) motor 7 speed gear electric fat tire bike bicycle

www.pswpower.com

Seat is very low and you can't raise it up or lower it down. It would be very difficult to ride without assistance.

The other day I saw delivery rider on his bike without chain using throttle only. Hardly a legal pedelec that was.

View attachment 56864

Ah yes I understand it being over the top haha fair point. I’m just interested in adding 2 batteries that are 36v20ah.

 

[Az.]

Ah yes I understand it being over the top haha fair point. I’m just interested in adding 2 batteries that are 36v20ah.

I don't think it would cause any problem with legality, although I don't understand why would you want to do that.

 

[scbk]

40ah battery to ride in london? Is there an electricity shortage down there or something?

 

[matthewslack]

Ah yes I understand it being over the top haha fair point. I’m just interested in adding 2 batteries that are 36v20ah.

You'll be fine with that - no different to two panniers full of shopping.

 

[Adamroze]

I don't think it would cause any problem with legality, although I don't understand why would you want to do that.

Well as a side hustle I do food delivery sometimes every week, so I think the extra mileage would be nice for that purpose. Roughly 20-25 hours every week.

 

[scbk]

You'll be the slowest food delivery bike in town

 

[Adamroze]

40ah battery to ride in london? Is there an electricity shortage down there or something?

40ah battery to ride in london? Is there an electricity shortage down there or something?

Haha using this bike for food delivery side hustle

You'll be the slowest food delivery bike in town

hahah I know, ill be stuck at 15.5 mph whilst others will be going 30+mph. But i ain’t risking it for 6 points on the licence!!.

 

[guerney]

Every food delivery bike I've ever seen used a hub motor. I believe they're selected for reliability, ease of repair at low cost.

 

[saneagle]

Ah yh I understand it would be heavy to peddle. But based on the court case, an e-bike too heavy could fail? So I can’t have 2/3 batteries installed as it would be heavy?

There's no legal weight limit. Amazon are using legal 250w trikes that carry up to 500kg.

 

[Az.]

Well as a side hustle I do food delivery sometimes every week, so I think the extra mileage would be nice for that purpose. Roughly 20-25 hours every week.

How many hours daily? Start with one battery and see how it goes. 20Ah is a lot.

 

[Az.]

Every food delivery bike I've ever seen used a hub motor. I believe they're selected for reliability, ease of repair at low cost.

I have seen one mid drive on delivery bike(only once in my life). I think it was Bafang BBSHD.

 

[soundwave]

bbshd full throttle max amps 20ah batt 17-20 miles, if it does not fall apart going 40mph.

m8 has 4 batts i cant catch it on the road anyway drops me 50m from standing start



both are about 24kg just mine wont fall to bits off road