I've seen a used bike I like, but its got a 350W motor. Would I be able to get a dealer to replace it with a 250W one? If so, would other components need to be swapped out too, would I be able to keep the 350W motor and any ideas on cost?

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by grazie

Don't tell anyone it is 350W and just use it...

No, if you're involved in any accident with a non legal eBike, they throw the book at you...in the UK at least.

Easy. Just ring a dealer and ask..

No, if you're involved in any accident with a non legal eBike, they throw the book at you...in the UK at least.

 

AFAWK this has never been tested or proven.

I know of an incident last year where someone on an s-pedelec was knocked off their bike and the Insurance company paid out compensation, car driver admitted liability and the claim went through without a hitch.

From what I've read over the years the motors are identical, it's the programming that is different, although again I read this isn't something a dealer could alter. As Gubbins says ask some Bosch dealers, or perhaps someone will do you a swap.

AFAWK this has never been tested or proven.

I know of an incident last year where someone on an s-pedelec was knocked off their bike and the Insurance company paid out compensation, car driver admitted liability and the claim went through without a hitch.

I should have added "could" to my statement above. I couldn't find details of the incident referred to below, but I suspect it's the type of thing the boys in blue would love to crack down on.

 

https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/blog/post/how-to-de-restrict-a-bosch-electric-bike/

 

I was hit from the rear by a car nearly 3 months ago while on a trike without a motor. The car driver was to blame and it was also a hit & run (illegal). AFAIK, the car owner hasn't responded to police requests (also illegal), so a driver has yet to be established. The process has been difficult enough so far without any complications. I personally wouldn't be prepared to take the risk with an illegal eBike.

 

From what I've read over the years the motors are identical, it's the programming that is different, although again I read this isn't something a dealer could alter. As Gubbins says ask some Bosch dealers, or perhaps someone will do you a swap.

If Bosch 250W and 350W motors are the same hardware with different configs, then there would be no point in swapping any hardware. I've already been told that the bike I'm interested can easily be restricted to 25Kph and if that's all that's needed to make it legal, I wouldn't have anything to worry about?

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by grazie

From what I've read over the years the motors are identical, it's the programming that is different,

I have read exactly the same thing, I will have a look around the net to see if I can find any links that say this. I cant remember where I have read it so might not be able to find anything.

I have read exactly the same thing, I will have a look around the net to see if I can find any links that say this. I cant remember where I have read it so might not be able to find anything.

It's the sort of nugget SW seems adept at finding.

I personally wouldn't be prepared to take the risk with an illegal eBike.

I'm exactly the same although I realise the chance of getting caught are tiny, I still would not feel totally relaxed when out on an illegal bike and consequently would not really enjoy it.

Easy. Just ring a dealer and ask..

I asked a dealer near to the bike location whether they'd check it over for a fee before I bought it. This answer I received was "No!". They wouldn't do anything with an eBike that wasn't bought from them. I'm not saying all dealers are like this, but it didn't inspire much confidence.

All the evidence I have suggests the only difference between the motors is the configuration.

 

I've ridden a Bosch Spreed Pedelec and the ride is identical to a de-restricted Bosch bike I had - there's no extra grunt, it just carries on assisting above 15.5mph.

 

And, of course, the motors are identical to look at, unlike the higher power Bafang kit motors which are larger.

 

Bosch are notoriously secret squirrel about their motors, so i doubt you will get official confirmation.

This article is from 2014 so not sure if it applies to the latest versions of the CX motors, but it says that the two motors are identical its just the software that is different.

 

https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/blog/post/whats-the-difference-between-the-250w-350w-bosch-ebike-motors-explained/

Is there a label on it saying 350w? If not plead ignorance or say it is 250w. Take a lot of time & effort to prove otherwise. IMHO.

So we can conclude that buying the later 250W CX variant that's been de-restricted has more oomph (a highly technical term) than the older variants with a 350W motor. Crazy!

So we can conclude that buying the later 250W CX variant that's been de-restricted has more oomph (a highly technical term) than the older variants with a 350W motor. Crazy!

Is it?? How many 2 litre petrol cars have more oomph than 3 litre petrels of say 15 years ago. ......progression

Apparently a red or grey badge is the distinguishing factor.

 

Is there a label on it saying 350w? If not plead ignorance or say it is 250w. Take a lot of time & effort to prove otherwise. IMHO.

If someone was killed or even seriously injured in a accident (almost certainly the cyclist), they'd be more than willing to take the time & effort to prove it.

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by grazie

If you are that concerned about the legality and possible consequences, then you are best off looking at 250 watt bikes that are restricted to the legal speed limit.

There are very few choices in the type of eBike I'd like. These would include the Orbea Gain (unobtainium), Giant Road E+ (I don't like), something I can't remember the name of (I don't like), Haibike Xduro (pricey) and Wisper Wolverine (v.pricey). A shame about the latter as I'd really like to be in a financial position to buy one.

Edited August 4, 20187 yr by grazie

If you are that concerned about the legality and possible consequences, then you are best off looking at 250 watt bikes that are restricted to the legal speed limit.

Exactly!, hence my initial query. However, others have been very helpful in providing information about what the situation is, which I didn't already know.

last year a new dealer was selling haibike, some had bosch moters,

whilst chatting to ,dealer, the technical bod from Raleigh (who supply haibikes I believe) turned up.

I asked is it just software that is the difference between active/performance/cx 50nm 63nm 75nm

 

the reply was the internal gearing is different on each moter.

the dealer went on a bosch technition course, bosch can input a different wheel size to make moter go over the 15 mph limit

bosch can input a different wheel size to make moter go over the 15 mph limit

 

They don't input a different wheel size, they change the software to move the speed restriction from 25kph to 45kph. They also do special software for the US and other markets.

 

The 350w motor is a Performance motor with the speed restriction moved from 25kph to 45kph. This is just a software change, so yes a good dealer in partnership with Bosch should be able to restrict it for you. I'm not sure anyone has every asked before. By restricting the speed it'll by default also reduce the power to 250w, making the bike UK legal

 

But yes, the newer Performance CX motor has different power curve etc etc to the standard Performance motor.

 

Also the 350w motor comes on sPedelecs, so there is other differences to the bikes, including mirrors, lights, brakes etc etc all of which are specific and required for sPedelecs. They are not, just normal pedelecs with more speed assistance.

Would I be able to get a dealer to replace it with a 250W one? If so, would other components need to be swapped out too, would I be able to keep the 350W motor and any ideas on cost?

 

As I understand it; the speed-pedelecs are defined as "mopeds"; and are cathegorized as sutch. Just as cars, motorcycles, tractors etc.

So even when downgrading the motor to a 250w ; the bike itself would remain in its original defined cathegory :-(

all the motors have the same power just software limited to 15.5 mph.

 

under the speed limit the motor can pull way more wattage than 350w more like 800w as that is what gets you up the steep hills if it was limited to 250w you would have no chance.

 

a 250w motor with a dongle is faster than a sclass motor as thats limited to 28mph where as a dongle can be unlimited.

a 250w motor with a dongle is faster than a sclass motor as thats limited to 28mph where as a dongle can be unlimited.

 

I'll take a x3 dongled s-class then