February 4, 20224 yr I will start the ball rolling as I mentioned in the PM. Test and test a again, it's the only way. It worked to a degree before the wire became twisted and broken, so the shorting that will have occurred has either blown the Halls again or the controller mosfets. Voltage test the Halls as before and resistance test the controller phases to see if the fets have blown. It's annoying and probably testing your patience now but it's the only way to go after an occurrence like the motor cable breaking.
February 4, 20224 yr Author ="Nealh You will have to go through all the tests again to find the fault. The twisting and shorting of the wires has either blow the Halls in the motor or Blown/shorted the controller mosfets, only by testing will you know. Disconnect the controller Phase wires and if the motor turns by hand ok then it is likely a controller mosfet or mosfets have failed. Confirm by mosfet resistance testing. I have just removed phase wires from the junction box what go to controller, and wheel does turn freely, but if you touch 2 phase wires together on the cable then it seems there is a brake sticking but obviously no brakes fitted as of yet, its a test I learnt on youtube to test phase wires
February 4, 20224 yr Author I will start the ball rolling as I mentioned in the PM. Test and test a again, it's the only way. It worked to a degree before the wire became twisted and broken, so the shorting that will have occurred has either blown the Halls again or the controller mosfets. Voltage test the Halls as before and resistance test the controller phases to see if the fets have blown. It's annoying and probably testing your patience now but it's the only way to go after an occurrence like the motor cable breaking. I do apologies for all this but Im nearly getting to the stage of calling a scrap dealer, as I honestly thought after all this time, it was ok. I go for 1st dam test drive after 3 months of fixing it. go just less than 1/4 of a mile only for cable to twist and break. Im afraid Nealh you will have to show me in very simple terms how now do I test the halls, and the controller mosfets. please make it as simple as possible LOL when you say if the motor turns by hand you mean wheel dont you Edited February 4, 20224 yr by billyboya
February 4, 20224 yr You have show that the motor wheel frees up and turns by disconnecting the controller so rules out the motor phases and cable as the issue. I have already described the process in you other many threads or in the PM's. Follow the two pdf links for testing. BlownMosfets.cdr (ebikes.ca) HallSensorTesting.cdr (ebikes.ca)
February 4, 20224 yr Author You have show that the motor wheel frees up and turns by disconnecting the controller so rules out the motor phases and cable as the issue. I have already described the process in you other many threads or in the PM's. Follow the two pdf links for testing. BlownMosfets.cdr (ebikes.ca) HallSensorTesting.cdr (ebikes.ca) ok I will do this later, but just feel this has been going on a good 3 months, But as long as you dont mind helping I do appreciate it lots. are mosfets easy then to replace I cant seem to find which wire is the ground one. I have a cut out switch with a green/yellow wire which goes to the thick red on controller. is that the ground one. or is it that black thick wire coming from the controller are all mine suppose to say 10 ohms like in test as I’m still struggling to find where ground wire is OK I have done the hall sensors 1st, will try mosfet test later. But it does now seem it could be 2 hall sensors the yellow and blue ones. how do I know what sensors to buy same also with the mosfets, red + black = 4.31v black + yellow= 0.13v black + blue= 2.46v black+ green= 4.99v Well I tried the mosfet tests, with ground and no power. the only wire which must be ground is that thick black one coming from controller. but numbers on each wire test flashed up fast then back to 1. on all 3 phase wires green, blue & yellow But on the power test it was this power+green= 498 power+blue= 506 power+yellow= 496 hope this is right now, but it seems to me just 2 hall sensors need replacing, the yellow and blue ones. I don't know if that's right. But I will remove motor cases and check again Am I doing something wrong as in this video he dont even connect to the power and all his readings stay on the screen. yet mine just flash back to 1. thats no power Wont it just be easier to replace all 3 sensors in motor, then at least I will know they all fine. then just see if motor runs, if not then it has to be the mosfets. But I dont know what sensors to buy or even mosfets hopefully its not the mosfets Edited February 5, 20224 yr by billyboya
February 5, 20224 yr Author I seem to now be getting proper readings on the mosfet tests as I have now set meter to 200 ohm mode. I will test again and get back to you. Tomorrow
February 5, 20224 yr One can only know where the fault lies by testing, guessing or hoping get's you know where when you don't get the answer you were looking for. Mosfet's are in the controller, one must test them with no power as it is a resistance test using the 20 or 200 ohms range. Test Black controller wire to the three phases, one usually see's high 9 ohms or occasionally 10 with no power. It really depends on the spec's of the resistance range of the mosfet's. Then test Red controller wire to phases with no power, the results will be different to the above ones. You may just see 1 as the result or see an ascending numeral result which is fine, if any give a zero result then they are fried. Two Halls are fried so one will have to go through repairing them. Usually ss41F bipolar ones, I paid £2.99 recently for three. Hall Sensor Bipolar 41F SS41 SH41 SS41F Electric Bike Motor Repair with Guide UK | eBay Edited February 6, 20224 yr by Nealh
February 6, 20224 yr Author One can only know where the fault lies by testing, guessing or hoping get you know where when you don;t get the answer you were looking for. Mosfet's are in the controller, one must test them with no power as it is a resistance test using the 20 or 200 ohms range. Test Black controller wire to the three phases, one usually see's high 9 ohms or occasionally 10 with no power. It really depends on the spec's of the resistance range of the mosfet's. Then test Red controller wire to phases with no power, the results will be different to the above ones. You may just see 1 as the result or see an ascending numeral result which is fine, if any give a zero result then they are fried. Two Halls are fried so one will have to go through repairing them. Usually ss41F bipolar ones, I paid £2.99 recently for three. Hall Sensor Bipolar 41F SS41 SH41 SS41F Electric Bike Motor Repair with Guide UK | eBay Hi Nealh firstly I am so grateful for all your help, its most appreciated, I honestly thought after 3 months fixing moped. I was all done. and like I said took it less than 1/4 mile not even that, and bugger me, cable twisted, but that's my fault for not having the proper washers on axle etc. But I have now received more nuts anti rotation washers plus torque washers from Erider. anyway I have now done the mosfet tests, I always thought when it said with power, it was to have battery connected then test. or am I wrong or is it like you said thick red wire is the power. anyway now I have put multimeter on 200ohms setting I'm getting proper readings now. but when i had meter on diode and continuity mode numbers wont read right anyway here is readings below, it seems thank god my mosfets are ok the numbers was going up fast at 1st then slowed no power thick blck wire on controller green= 08.0v blue= 09.7v yellow= 09.7v no power thick red wire on controller green=17.4v blue=19.1v yellow=18.5v are all hall sensors same sizes then, I have ordered 3 new ones where you said. cheap enough £1 each. but it seems you have to make sure the legs of the sensors don't touch, so not much solder will be needed on each leg. I did see on you tube that you glue in the sensors, is that true then here are images of my sensors,
February 6, 20224 yr The mosfets don't give a voltage reading, the reading is ohms resistance. The one at 8 ohms is quite low and is weaker then the other two it should be nearer to 9.7 ohms. The Halls will have an identifier number on them, I can't read them as the pic is of poor resolution when blown up. Use a mag glass to red them.
February 6, 20224 yr The Green/Yellow phase wires look fried to me and looks like the Green has overheated and the core visible. The Halls, one has to solder the correct leg and check they are orientated right as they only fit one one with bevelled edge. Use the white sheath to insulate the legs when soldered.
February 6, 20224 yr You was nearly there with the original repair so will have to try again. For mosfets try and drain them of the voltage for a better reading, disconnect the controller from the battery and then to touch the controller Black v- & Red v+ together to drain the the voltage. This will give a brief spark but won't do any damage. Double check the Green mosfet that gave 8 ohms reading and use the 20 ohm scale. If it still reads low it may be worth replacing it. Also do check them again against the Red wire.
February 6, 20224 yr Author The mosfets don't give a voltage reading, the reading is ohms resistance. The one at 8 ohms is quite low and is weaker then the other two it should be nearer to 9.7 ohms. The Halls will have an identifier number on them, I can't read them as the pic is of poor resolution when blown up. Use a mag glass to red them. So do you think the green mosfet is bad and needs replacing, as I didnt think I would need to remove controller and open it. I cant read the hall sensors identifier numbers as nothing on them, probably, rubbed off when i cleaned the motor. But I have ordered 3 from where you said, just hope they same as I have.
February 6, 20224 yr Author The Green/Yellow phase wires look fried to me and looks like the Green has overheated and the core visible. The Halls, one has to solder the correct leg and check they are orientated right as they only fit one one with bevelled edge. Use the white sheath to insulate the legs when soldered. No what you thought was fried is just black liquid installation tape What is that white stuff in circles. as it seems like some strong paste
February 6, 20224 yr Author You was nearly there with the original repair so will have to try again. For mosfets try and drain them of the voltage for a better reading, disconnect the controller from the battery and then to touch the controller Black v- & Red v+ together to drain the the voltage. This will give a brief spark but won't do any damage. Double check the Green mosfet that gave 8 ohms reading and use the 20 ohm scale. If it still reads low it may be worth replacing it. Also do check them again against the Red wire. then to touch the controller Black v- & Red v+ together to drain the the voltage. This will give a brief spark yes I have had this happen before made me jump as thought i had blown something ok will do that and get back to you
February 6, 20224 yr Author Im a bit lost as you say disconnect the controller from the battery, But I have not had battery connected at all for these tests, as you said no power. Ive just been testing wires not even connected to battery. But I just did touch thick red and thick black wires on controller together, but no spark. and retested them again no power thick blck wire on controller green= 08.11v no power thick red wire on controller green=17.76v
February 6, 20224 yr A strong heat resistant double sided tape to ensure the Hall pcb stays attached to the insulation barrier beneath it.
February 6, 20224 yr Im a bit lost as you say disconnect the controller from the battery, But I have not had battery connected at all for these tests, as you said no power. Ive just been testing wires not even connected to battery. But I just did touch thick red and thick black wires on controller together, but no spark. and retested them again no power thick blck wire on controller green= 08.11v no power thick red wire on controller green=17.76v I don't know why you keep insisting of writing up as a voltage test is a resistance test and should be denoted as such by writing ohms or inserting .
February 6, 20224 yr I would replace the Green mosfet as it is a weak link and may thermally cut out.
February 6, 20224 yr Author I don't know why you keep insisting of writing up as a voltage test is a resistance test and should be denoted as such by writing ohms or inserting .[ATTACH type=full" alt="45632]45632[/ATTACH] No you getting me wrong, I just said when you quoted about disconnect the battery, was just letting you know I never have battery connected anyway.
February 6, 20224 yr Author A strong heat resistant double sided tape to ensure the Hall pcb stays attached to the insulation barrier beneath it. I maybe able to solder in the 3 hall sensors by just leaving that white stuff there, as it seems very hard to remove and dont want to crack that board.
February 6, 20224 yr Author I would replace the Green mosfet as it is a weak link and may thermally cut out. Ok so what mosfet do I get or will I have to open controller 1st to check. as I believe there are 6 in all 2 of each - and +
February 6, 20224 yr Author Ok I have now opened the controller, and it seems I was wrong its not 6 mosfets, its 9 it seems 3 for each phase colour. I have looked at 1 and it has on it. so what do I order. the green wire is C then CS48N78 45195 33S
February 6, 20224 yr Author Well it seems I have made a mistake with checking the mosfets, as now I have removed controller from moped and retested the phase wires its seems its all ok so it seems the cable just fried 2 hall sensors. btw will those ones I ordered same as you said fit into those slots on motor ok and do they need to be Loctite glued in thick black wire from controller + green = 9.79 ohms thick black wire from controller + blue 9.81 ohms thick black wire from controller + yellow 9.79 ohms thick red wire from controller + green = 19.48 ohms thick red wire from controller + blue = 19.46 ohms thick red wire from controller + yellow = 19.48 ohms Edited February 6, 20224 yr by billyboya
February 7, 20224 yr Author Good, the mosfet's are consistent. Yes it seems I removed the test probes too quick, as numbers was still going up, so I thought best to wait until they slowed down Why is there 9 mosfets, do that mean 3 for each phase wire then, and how do you tell which are + and - Im just curious nice to learn stuff Also I have ordered 3 of those hall sensors as you said. will they be same as mine, and are they stuck in slots with glue. also do they go in slots with the writing facing you. I will have to be very careful how I solder the legs in as they mustn't touch, well only a small amount of solder on each leg it seems Btw what did you say that white liquid is called what sets very hard. as I will probably put some over the wires before I close motor case God its so hard to get the 2 end sensors out middle one was ok as I could push that one easy out. is there a special way to get them out probably a sharp pointed needle there is some here too. Edited February 7, 20224 yr by billyboya
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